"Grease" - the pre-1998 audio mix?

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by TheLazenby, Apr 8, 2017.

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  1. TheLazenby

    TheLazenby Forum Resident In Memoriam Thread Starter

    Location:
    Pittsburgh
    A film buff I know recently clued me in on something I never realized about "Grease", having been raised more or less on the DVD editions..... the audio mix is *very* different on home video releases starting in 1998 (the 20th anniversary VHS onwards), and not close to what the theatrical version presented.

    So, intrigued by this, I bought a VCR today and scoured the thrift stores for an edition that pre-dated my 20th Anniversary boxed set (my VHS copy has that 'Megamix' CD and the mini script, so likely the first of the 'remix' batch), and after coming up empty at a few stores, I found a 1990 VHS.

    Listening to the movie on headphones...... he was right. Some songs like "Summer Nights" sound the same to me (well, the song itself does; I seem to remember the DVD mix having ambient sounds audible through the song, like birds and people playing football, which are missing on this VHS), but others are *drastically* different - "Sandra Dee" is a much different orchestration than I'm used to, with the strings much more subtle and a very prominent banjo and accordion I never noticed before; and "Greased Lightning" sounds less bombastic and over-orchestrated, and the sound effects seemingly changed for the 1998+ releases (the horn honks during the instrumental break being the most obvious to me).

    Is there a list of differences anywhere, so I know my ears aren't deceiving me? :)
     
  2. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR!

    Location:
    Hollywood, USA
    It's very possible they did a 5.1 remix around that time, and creative people love to change things. I would bet that director Randal Kleiser supervised and approved those decisions.
     
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  3. chacha

    chacha Forum Resident In Memoriam

    Location:
    mill valley CA USA
    I love the original mix and can't stand the new one. Off the top of my head, the title track was a unique mix as was Hopelessly Devoted and You're The One I Want. Now they're just the radio versions. Really disappointing to me.
     
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  4. Vahan

    Vahan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Glendale, CA, USA
    Sorry, but Mr. Kleiser is an idiot for being happy with this new mix, and refusing to go back to the original.
     
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  5. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    I may be able to throw one more wrench into things. I have a friend who was in exhibitor relations (or some such thing) for Paramount in the 70s/80s, and he was invited to some sort of pre-release screening of GREASE at the Egyptian (I think.....maybe it was the Chinese, but I don't think so) in Hollywood, using a 70mm answer print with synchronized sound on a mag film dubber in the booth. He was absolutely blown away by the sound, and couldn't wait to see the movie again just for the sound quality he had heard. He first saw it during general release in 35mm, but then it landed at, I think, the Village in Westwood in 70mm, and sounded nothing like that rough version he had heard. He still comments to this day about what a complete disappointment that was, and he'd love to know what happened to that early mix/release he experienced.
     
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  6. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR!

    Location:
    Hollywood, USA
    I try to never argue with directors. They're at a higher pay grade than me.
     
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  7. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    Not to veer this far off-course, but do you have Glenn Berger's NEVER SAY NO TO A ROCK STAR book, Matt? His chapter about working on ALL THAT JAZZ and the mixes for release, which became watered down, possibly relate (without knowing the particulars on your friend's experience with GREASE)..
     
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  8. chacha

    chacha Forum Resident In Memoriam

    Location:
    mill valley CA USA
    They pretty much ruined it for me with the new mix. I remember seeing it the first week it came out at a premiere and hearing people around me commenting how great it sounded.
     
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  9. TheLazenby

    TheLazenby Forum Resident In Memoriam Thread Starter

    Location:
    Pittsburgh
    Not to mention, "You're The One That I Want" now has extra sound effects over the song - you can hear things like the mechanical sound of the rotating tunnel and the 'Shake Shack', and on my old VHS tape, none of those are present.
     
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  10. chacha

    chacha Forum Resident In Memoriam

    Location:
    mill valley CA USA
    Yes - awful. I have an old laser disc somewhere but unfortunately it's pan and scan and looks awful.
     
  11. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR!

    Location:
    Hollywood, USA
    Yeah, I don't think Paramount opted to do a letterbox version until the early 1990s (at the earliest). I'd make the counter-argument that if you throw away 40% of VHS resolution to blanking, what's left is maybe 120 lines (at most) for the image area, so it's not a great choice for standard def. Even in DVD, it wasn't great. Letterbox widescreen is fine with Blu-ray -- there's more than enough resolution for it to work there.
     
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  12. chacha

    chacha Forum Resident In Memoriam

    Location:
    mill valley CA USA
    Letterbox worked fine though for laserdisc with a good CRT.
     
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  13. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR!

    Location:
    Hollywood, USA
    Not for me. It looked like absolute, utter crap. DVD didn't come soon enough, as far as I was concerned. 99.9% of anybody looking at a CRT in the last 30 years had no idea about setup or alignment or calibration, so chances are what they was seeing was in outer space compared to how the movie was intended to look.

    It's a moot point today: Blu-ray ended any need for standard-def, as far as I'm concerned. 4K is coming sooner than a lot of people think. Grease was a pretty soft movie -- it had a lot of diffusion plus those Panavision C-series lenses, which were not sharp at all (compared to modern prime lenses). All that plus shooting on 100ASA Kodak 5247... it's a soft film. I'm not convinced there's even HD resolution in it, so 4K won't buy anybody much.
     
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  14. TheLazenby

    TheLazenby Forum Resident In Memoriam Thread Starter

    Location:
    Pittsburgh
    Yeah, I noticed when I edited the two movies together into a coherent whole, "Grease 2" looks much crisper than the first one.
     
  15. chacha

    chacha Forum Resident In Memoriam

    Location:
    mill valley CA USA
    Not for me. I was in the .1%. Had a professionally calibrated Mitsubishi pro monitor. It looked fantastic. I have a calibrated Pioneer Kuro plasma now for the last 8 years. Looks great but sometimes I miss the look of that old CRT. It was beautiful.
     
  16. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR!

    Location:
    Hollywood, USA
    Yes, the photographic styles changed, the lenses got better in the 1980s, stocks got better, and I think they backed off on the diffusion a bit.

    I think nostalgia is clouding your judgement. I used a $20,000 Sony BVM-24 CRT every day for mastering in the 1990s, and I don't miss them at all. I far prefer the look of plasma and OLED HD. I think the Kuros were good for their time, but the problem is now, they're all worn out and you can't get replacement panels.
     
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  17. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    The only widescreen LD in the US is of the 20th Anniversary Edition, there is a 1991 PAL LD using the original audio mix though in widescreen. The only US LD issues with the pre-1998 audio mix are P&S.
     
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  18. Dude111

    Dude111 An Awesome Dude

    Location:
    US
    I have an early VHS release (early 80s) and its gorgous (The music and video)

    I may get an 8 track tape of the music also........ I really love that movie :)
     
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  19. mark renard

    mark renard Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    Does the soundtrack on CD have the original mixes? I think I have the original CD. Not sure if they ever did a remaster.
     
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  20. Bobby Morrow

    Bobby Morrow Senior Member

    The most notable sound difference on the 1998 re-release of Grease was they added backing vocals on the chorus of Hopelessly Devoted To You (like the record). In the original film it Olivia singing on her own which worked much better. I always wanted a CD version of that.
     
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  21. Bobby Morrow

    Bobby Morrow Senior Member

    The CD soundtrack wasn’t remixed (I don’t think!). It sounds like the original LP. Grease was remastered in 2003 for the 2 disc deluxe edition, though it didn’t sound much different to the original CD.
     
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  22. mBen989

    mBen989 Senior Member

    Location:
    Scranton, PA
    Well, with the 40th anniversary this year, maybe we'll get a new 4K transfer and hopefully the original audio mix.
     
  23. Kirk76

    Kirk76 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Texoma
    There's a rumor out of France of a UHD BluRay 40th anniversary release. Hopefully the original mix will be an option.

    Grease : Une édition 4K Ultra HD Blu-ray chez Paramount en avril

    Via Google Translate:

    "This is good news for all fans of this cult movie.

    Grease will celebrate in 2018 its 40th anniversary. And the Paramount will take advantage of this event to bring out the musical comedy carried by John Travolta in video disc. With the key and for the first time: an Ultra HD Blu-ray edition of the film.

    We can confirm this since the title has just appeared in the publisher's schedule: Grease will be the subject of a 4K Blu-ray edition on the French market.

    It will be released in France next April. The exact date of release will be communicated soon.

    We keep you informed as soon as we have more details"
     
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  24. Song4U

    Song4U Senior Member

    Location:
    South Florida
    Every re release of Grease after 98 the music soundtrack is bombastic. I can't understand why they ruined the music. I must have seen the original movie in 78 about 36 times at the theater and that's the music I remember it was fantastic. I bought the recent blu Ray and the music soundtrack is horrible.
     
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  25. Song4U

    Song4U Senior Member

    Location:
    South Florida
    This is how the movie was suppose to sound, here is the original broadcast on ABC TV back in Nov 1981.

     
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