Help! & Rubber Soul 1965 vs 1987 Stereo Mix (Poll)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by MrMojoRisin, Jun 15, 2018 at 2:34 AM.

  1. MrMojoRisin

    MrMojoRisin Last Album Heard - Led Zep II Thread Starter

    Location:
    Perth
    Done to death? Maybe within threads, but there’s only been one thread dedicated and it had no poll. Good enough excuse for me to make this? Probably not. Here it is anyway.

    Which do you prefer?
    DISCLAIMER: You have 2 votes, please vote for only 1 version of each album, not 2 Help!’s or 2 Rubber Soul’s. Thanks.

    Personally I prefer both ‘87 mixes of each album. In-fact, I hate the 65’s so much I’m mot even sure Rubber Soul would be my second favourite Beatles album anymore if that’s all we had. The vocal panning far right is painful to listen to for Rubber Soul, likewise with the instruments. The opening to Norwegian Wood just sounds stupid on the ‘65. For Help! the vocals have a really interesting sound to them and that’s not a pleasant interesting. They sound atrocious. The instrumentation is so low in the mix it’s just ridiculous. The Beatles don’t have good panning as it is on stereo making them sound less rocky than the monos, but goddamn at least they don’t sound as pathetic as on the original ‘65’s. But hey, that’s just me. What about you?
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2018 at 2:40 AM
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  2. lechiffre

    lechiffre Forum Resident

    Location:
    phoenix
    Help is an easy choice 1965. Didn't even have to think about it.

    1965 for Rubber Soul as well.
     
  3. MrMojoRisin

    MrMojoRisin Last Album Heard - Led Zep II Thread Starter

    Location:
    Perth
    What do you prefer about the ‘65 Help! so much?
     
  4. Nick Dunning

    Nick Dunning Forum Resident

    Easily the 1987's, and I grew up with the 1965 stereos (first LP's I ever bought).
     
  5. Beatmaniac

    Beatmaniac Forum Resident

    Voted for ‘65 Help!

    I just really felt the reverb was not necessary. If the Beatles wanted that much reverb, they would have added it in 1965.

    I didn’t even vote for either of the Rubber Soul stereos. The instruments left and vocals right work perfectly fine for the first two albums, because that’s how it was recorded!

    Rubber Soul has more tracks and overdubs to work with and could create a marvelous stereo image (even if it’s just a simple mix like Beatles For Sale). It just seems like a waste of potential.

    Plus the mono mix of Rubber Soul is perfect, especially the 2014 reissue, probably the best of the box
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2018 at 4:47 AM
  6. MrMojoRisin

    MrMojoRisin Last Album Heard - Led Zep II Thread Starter

    Location:
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    Admittedly I don't understand that reverb complaint. I don't even hear it.
     
  7. funkydude

    funkydude Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    The original mixes sound horribly dry. I think George Martin was on the right track when he remixed them. I prefer the 80s mixes.
     
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  8. Beatmaniac

    Beatmaniac Forum Resident

    I would have been fine with the remixes if they were more adventurous, though I understand George Martin’s reluctance. But in that case, I don’t understand the point, especially with Rubber Soul.

    Ironic how he didn’t want PPM and WTB in stereo for the 1987 CDs because of the weird stereo separation yet turned around and remixed Rubber Soul in that same fashion.
     
  9. MrMojoRisin

    MrMojoRisin Last Album Heard - Led Zep II Thread Starter

    Location:
    Perth
    That is quite ironic indeed, and very disappointing.

    Do you listen through speakers? Maybe then I can understand why you'd like the '65's better. Rubber Soul is still hard panned of course on '87, but not nearly as much.
     
  10. Beatmaniac

    Beatmaniac Forum Resident

    I listen through both.

    I completely understand the love for the ‘87 Help!, but it just isn’t my cup of tea. The ‘65 mix sounds right to my ears.

    Not to say it can’t be done better, just that the ‘87 isn’t the answer. Maybe a new remix is.
     
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  11. MrMojoRisin

    MrMojoRisin Last Album Heard - Led Zep II Thread Starter

    Location:
    Perth
    Fair call. I could most certainly do with a remixed Rubber Soul.
     
  12. Beatmaniac

    Beatmaniac Forum Resident

    Yup, lot’s of double-tracked vocals on that album which a remix would really put on display. A remixed Rubber Soul and Revolver are two releases I hope see the light of day
     
  13. Price.pittsburgh

    Price.pittsburgh Forum Resident

    Location:
    Florida
    Play Dizzy Miss Lizzy side by side and the Night Before side by side for examples from Help!
     
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  14. tages

    tages Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    Still love the original stereo mixes - I listen on speakers and love the separation.
     
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  15. MrMojoRisin

    MrMojoRisin Last Album Heard - Led Zep II Thread Starter

    Location:
    Perth
    Even still reverb doesn't bother me in the slightest.
     
  16. Price.pittsburgh

    Price.pittsburgh Forum Resident

    Location:
    Florida
    Yeah, it's not like Dextor reverb lol.
    It's not real obvious.
    I think the issue with it is why George Martin would add it at all to Beatles tracks when those cds were about to be presented to the world.
     
  17. Beatmaniac

    Beatmaniac Forum Resident

    And it’s frustrating that those were the only mixes available on CD for 22 years.
     
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  18. Price.pittsburgh

    Price.pittsburgh Forum Resident

    Location:
    Florida
    Well, 19 years for a lot of the tracks that were part of the 2006 Capitol albums Vol II but I know what you mean as far as the titles go.
     
  19. ohnothimagen

    ohnothimagen https://soundcloud.com/porkchops-productions

    I prefer the '65 mix for Help! and the '87 for Rubber Soul. I don't mind the Rubber Soul remix because it isn't quite as hard panned as the original '65 mix is, whereas the added reverb on the '87 Help! drives me nuts.
    Compare "Dizzy Miss Lizzy" from the original '65 mix to the '87- they slathered so much reverb onto the '87 version it makes Lennon's vocal sound like it's a Plastic Ono Band session outtake. What's worse is it's totally unnatural digital reverb- "Let's go down to the 7-11 and get a can of reverb!" as Neil Young would say. The added 'verb was used much more tastefully IMO on the Rubber Soul remix.

    I don't think there was ever any need to remix Help! at all, let alone dump a bunch of fake sounding reverb onto some of the tracks. Nothing wrong with the original 1965 mix at all; the sound of the stereo mix is comparable to Beatles For Sale, certainly one of the better stereo mixes (again, my opinion). Rubber Soul on the other hand benefited from the remix, I can't stand the whole "vocals on one side, instruments on the other" aspect of the original mix. Mind ya, I prefer Rubber Soul -any version- in mono anyway...
     
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  20. MrMojoRisin

    MrMojoRisin Last Album Heard - Led Zep II Thread Starter

    Location:
    Perth
    Yeah, I hear it now, but still it doesn't bother me in the slightest. It is unnecessary, though.
     
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  21. paolo

    paolo Forum Resident

    The 1987 mixes are superior on every level, even taking account of the digital reverb. Better clarity, musicality and tonality.
     
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  22. Bingo Bongo

    Bingo Bongo No music, no Life

    What's the differences?
     
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  23. forthlin

    forthlin Forum Resident

    I'm going to respectfully disagree:) Dexter reverb would've sounded much more natural than the digital effect Martin used on the '87 Help! and Rubber Soul. Help! and Rubber Soul are a bit thin in stereo which is generally solved by listening to them in mono ;) The '87 versions of those two albums are inferior to the '65 versions.
     
  24. Somerset Scholar

    Somerset Scholar Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bath
    Thankfully GM stopped the remixing at RS.
    The original mixes are better choices. Musically and historically.
     
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  25. Beatmaniac

    Beatmaniac Forum Resident

    Also, the ‘87 mix absolutely ruins Yesterday. Extra reverb was not necessary. The fragile dry mix is what made the song popular!
     

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