Is hardship and struggle needed to create great music?

I don't know about that, I know tons of artists throughout history that wanted nothing to do with the fame and fortune and simply wanted to create music.

 

I take your point Siegmund, but have you read The Gambler?? Written to a deadline, to clrear a debt, and far from D's finest.

 

Not one of his best, but still pretty good, I'd say.

 

Had he been British, JT would have been called a 'trustafarian'. I think what saved him was his talent. Similar story with Eric Clapton (who did not come from a privileged background).

 

Bro, I reckon its both. Jean Simmons is the king of party animals, we truly are not worthy. And yeup there are others who do it from the heart. Do you know what the term rock and roll really mean? Its not just fer dancing, if you catch my drift. I know Rock n roll is to party, wink, wink, I know blues is for when you are down, and you want others to feel your blues too.And Gospel, is for when you need some religion after partying hard.

Cmon man, rock and roll is a gift from some really great folks, the 50's rock was simply the best, because there was no message, just fun! Angus Young said forget the hoopla we are here just to party!

 

Rare with a honest post about this here. It's clear from his (ghosted) autobiog that racism affected Miles deeply; and he turned a corner after the Birdland incident.
Being one of the world's finest musicans but treated like a second-class citizen in your own country? That must hurt.

He also had an addictive personality and big health issues for most of his career (sickle cell anemia and more).

 

This question may actually be more appropriate to the words than it is to the music.

 

Thank You Mods! Having trouble making my pictures work.

 

In terms of the artists whose albums I would consider "great", the answer is definitely no. Although they all have an album or two that would suggest, yes, some kind of hardship or uncertainty fueled a great record.

In my opinion, imagination, inspiration, and a natural gift for melody or craft are the things needed to make "great" music.

 

Is hardship required? Not necessarily, though it does often seem to provide the most creative fuel to the fire. Some form of struggle is important too, even if an artist is just struggling with themselves to take their craft to the next level. It is possible to come up with more casually tossed off moments of brilliance, but those kinds of songs don't always seem to resonate as deeply.

I was thinking about this recently in relation to John Martyn's career in the 70s. Sunday's Child is said to be his "domestic bliss" album and while it's an enjoyable enough listen, it doesn't rank as one of his more memorable achievements from his peak period. I prefer a little more fire and frission.

 

As someone who has struggled from depression for a good deal of my life (but isn't an artist), I think the whole romanticization of the idea that only the "tortured artist" is able to create great works of art is complete ********. (Whether the artist be tortured by mental illness, alcohol/drug addiction, or other debilitating matters). It only leads people with mental illness and/or alcohol/drug addictions to not seek proper help because, hey, it is what fuels their creative genius. And then, we end up with the "27 club," etc.

 

No. Great songs come from passion but not necessarily a struggle. Deep love, a total positive thing can do the trick.

 

Nowhere did I say that only "tortured" artists create great music. What Im saying is that great art is created when artists tap into past experiences that come from a dark place or are under some sort of pressure. Hardship and struggle take many forms like financial struggle, coping with the death of a loved one, or even the stress of not being successful at your craft. Even something as simple as the pressure of time constraints. Something that acts as a catalyst and helps them dig deep and use all the talent and creativity they have to record their best work.

 

William Wordsworth said that "[p]oetry is the spontaneous overflow of powerful feelings: it takes its origin from emotion recollected in tranquility.” I suppose that holds true for all artistic endeavors, including music.

 

No, I don't think it's necessary, just like drugs aren't necessary.

But in defense of the hardship arguement, I will say that it did produce Blood on the Tracks...

 

Oh, I definitely realize that you weren't saying that only tortured artists create good music. I guess I'm just tired of hearing that narrative from other places, and I think that it really irresponsible for the media to continue to push that narrative.

In direct response to your thesis - yes, some great art has been created in response to suffering personal hardships. But, I don't think that more great art has been created in response to hardship than great art created without significant hardship. Many people are just born with, or raised to have, a great drive and/or desire to push themselves to be the best that they can be.

Also, the current state of the music industry seems to be filled with people who have come from fairly privileged backgrounds and suffered little real hardship along the way since they are the ones who are able to afford unpaid internships with media industries, produce and record their own music, and have industry connections. See below.

A working-class hero is something to be … but not in Britain's posh culture

Stuart Maconie: The privileged are taking over the arts – without the grit, pop culture is doomed

 

YES, YES, YES!

 

This. I write essays and short stories and I can't tell you the number of times I thought "time to write", plop myself in front of the computer and come up with zero. Then there are the times where I'm walking down the street and a line pops into my head and when I get home the words come faster than I can get them down. Or I'm listening to a song and there will be one note, one chord, that works like a key and I'm gone. Something needs to kick start the, for lack of a better term, muse. I spent almost an entire year riffing off albums by Bedhead, Real Estate and The War on Drugs, got a lot of work done. Inspiration is the thing you need. And the ability to get it down properly, no matter what art form you engage.
As far as the whole suffer for your art thing goes, the life I led makes up a good part of what gets down on paper, whether it's an essay based on facts or short fiction. At this stage of life I've got enough distance from the things I write about , so the process isn't painful. For me the suffering is in the past, and its doubtfult I could write as much, or as well, as I do now if I was still in the middle of all that crap.
But there are a lot of people who need to be in turmoil in order to create. Look at how many artists burn their brightest when young and unmoored and crazed, then when they mature what made them brilliant ain't shining as bright. Then there are people who approach their art as a craft from the jump and can pull off their creativity without burning themselves out. It's just different for everybody.

 

That is the game in a nutshell. WHATEVER can be purposed to fuel the Imagination. And, sensibly, with the minimum of the wear-and-tear that terminates creativity.

 

Unfortunately or not, a lot of great literature has certainly been triggered by spiritual anguish and/or mental neurosis.

 

I don't know about hardship and struggle, but at the very least some sort of internal hunger is needed. That's why despite the fact that I know several middle/upper middle class professional types that still play, almost none of them make what I consider compelling music. Success at work must take that drive away when music isn't the only thing you have going for yourself.

 

Sometimes yes, suffering and hardship results in great art.
Sometimes happiness and joy inspires great music.
It depends upon how well an artist can express whatever emotion influences creation.
And how much the artist is in touch with the mechanics of that expression.

 

Ah - but Jimi also had to be joyously inspired to write "Foxey Lady"!

 

There's always the alleged 'cathartic' or 'therapeutic' aspect of art coming out of suffering...

 

Happy and horny