Jimi Hendrix - Let's Talk About How We Would Have Put Together His Posthumous Albums!

So, if you don't believe the conceit that Jimi got back together with Chas then the rest is of premise behind the track list is wasted on you. Obviously, you don't dig a bit of daydreaming. The rest falls apart if he doesn't get back together with Chas. That's not believable, is it? That Jimi Hendrix was not good at focusing, and he couldn't get his stuff together without a guiding hand?

That Jimi had several different album concepts, yet he could only scrape together a dozen finished songs over a nearly two-year period of time, says that Jimi was mostly full of **** when he spoke about this huge concept, and this triple album, and yadda, yadda, yadda?

Jimi dreamt way longer than he was psychically able to live.

This bit is me giving Jimi the benefit of the doubt that eventually Hendrix would have his own Bitches Brew to go along with his Electric Ladyland.

I believe in the power of Jimi Christ, but only in the last quarter of 1971 or the first quarter of 1972. It wouldn't happen, though. Reprise would squeeze an album from him by the summer of 1971 had he lived. He was a close to putting together an album as I am traveling to the moon in a Model-T.

Speculation
Speculation

Ouija board

 

I never said anything about not believing that Jimi may have gotten back together with Chas. In fact its known that they talked about the possibility while Jimi was in the UK shortly before his death. That has nothing to do with why I don't buy that an album would have likely been released without its (semi) title track. Either the album title (of your hypothetical tracklist) would have been different OR it would have contained Hey Baby and Izabella (whether it was released as a double album or not).

For me to believe that Jimi would have ultimately used that title (FROTNRS) would have required the inclusion on the album of those two songs.

Without both songs he would have named the album something else (saving the FROTNRS title for his next album that WOULD have included those two songs - unless of course he were to for some reason abandon both songs completely and never release them)

Simple as that

 

Yeah, Jimi probably wouldn't need 16+ months, but 12+ months, certainly.

But I wouldn't put too much stock in what Kramer says. He often contradicts himself. I worship Hendrix, but not as much as Kramer. There is no musical evidence to back up his claim that the end was in sight.

Theses marathon mixing sessions were still done with only about a dozen songs. They certainly weren't going to mix all of the rough jams without overdubs, to make a double album? I'm not buying it.

That is to say, the focus on completing an album wasn't even close to what it was during the Electric Ladyland sessions.

 

Jimi did have (what became known as) "Pali Gap", "Beginning" and the "Hey Baby" overture of "Bolero" (needed more work obviously) to help pad out the album in order to make it a double. With some late September/early October tweaking and the album could have seen a release for early 1971 (or a Christmas 1970 rush relelase?).

 

I actually just did a list of the Aug 20 & 22 mixes. Between the 2 dates, there were 21 different songs mixes (I'm going off of what was in Ultimate Hendrix, I think it left out the BOG Earth Blues which didn't come out until the 2010 set). I've mentioned I think he was pretty much done with 8 or 9 songs: Dolly (done), Nightbird Flying (done), Ezy Ryder (done), Straight Ahead (done, but maybe could've used another overdub), Room Full of Mirrors (probably a little more mixing), Freedom (an overdub and a mix), Drifting (some overdubs and a mix) and Angel (overdubs and a mix), and throw in Drifter's Escape which just needed a good mix. Of what was left, take out Message and Power, and there were 10 songs that needed some to a lot of work: Astro Man (needed more overdubs), the Bolero/Hey Baby medley (again, more guitars), Come Down Hard On Me (lots of work needed), In From the Storm (maybe more overdubs, but might have been complete as well), Bleeding Heart (more overdubs), Midnight Lightning (if this was the July 1 version, needed to be cut down and overdubbed), Beginning (more guitars and editing) and Cherokee Mist (up in the air). There wasn't any new work done on Stepping Stone and Izabella, those were in the can if needed plus either version of Earth Blues, as well as Valleys of Neptune in its uncompleted state. So there was stuff there for a 10 track LP with a minimal amount of work to polish it up. A double probably would've needed another month or two to get it to Jimi's standards. Plus some of this may have been set aside for Rainbow Bridge since they already knew the concert recordings were a mess (in 1970 terms anyway).

Electric Ladyland was done in about 8 months on and off. He'd worked on the material he was going to use for a little under a year by the time he went back to England, and really got serious once Electric Lady opened. That was only two months and things were worlds different from when it opened in May-June until the party on Aug 26th. If the four songs played that night were really done to his satisfaction, toss on Room Full of Mirrors and you've got Side One right there.

 

^ Yeah, the musical evidence is there. He could've pulled off a release in 4-5 months easy. Possibly quicker, if he really followed through with bringing Chas back into the picture. He may have been beset by the drug trial, band breakup, and capitol album deal in '69. But those problems were over by September '70. I think it's clear he had some momentum going.

 

I know it's subjective and speculative, but if by momentum we mean that he could have had a double album full of 4:00 minute songs, with an extra 4-5 months, okay. I feel ya. Because going through the tracks above, to me, that's only enough quality songs to cull one single album from, but not nearly up to the magnum opus standards of Electric Ladyland.

Maybe I'm expecting too much from Jimi Hendrix. I just don't believe that in another few months, even 4-5 months, that from the abovementioned songs, we have a double album that in any way matches the standards that Jimi Hendrix set for himself with the first 3 records.

So, to me, the evidence is there that you have one album as strong (maybe) as Axis: Bold as Love, but to make a double album out of the rest of those tracks would be a diluted affair, not in keeping with Jimi' grand vision. Hendrix would need time to write and/or arrange, and record the rest of the songs. Moreover, let's not forget that Chas Chandler wasn't a fan of the double album concept, if we are to use the Chas scenario for our speculation.

Me, I eat up every note that Jimi played, but that doesn't mean that all notes are created equal.

 

The other day I was listening to Bolero/Hey Baby and Valleys of Neptune with this exact idea in mind. These songs definitely would’ve needed at least another rhythm guitar and probably a bunch of punch in fills along the way. Would it have taken him several months? I don’t think so but with the way he wanted perfection, it’s possible. He never got what he wanted for Valleys or Burning Desire and was still trying figure out Midnght Lightning. He had Hear My Train and Lover Man nailed down live, but couldn’t quite get them in the studio. So I agree we could make up a list of recordings for First Rays but it wouldn’t have been the album he intended, even if we got every song in the right order

 

Thought it was better to go here rather than over in the Both Sides thread to kind of recap where we are as far as where things are, what's still missing, etc. Since we're hearing "This is the last of the studio albums" and my pondering of another box set, what's still left to go? Here's a recap:

Cry of Love-reissued

Rainbow Bridge-reissued

In The West-tracks available on reissue and purple box

War Heroes-Tracks all available in various places, not in original mixes in some cases

Loose Ends-All tracks except Blue Suede Shoes available, not in original mixes in some cases

Crash Landing (original versions): Message-both boxes, Somewhere-purple box, Crash Landing-PHA (sort of, unofficial version also out there), Come Down Hard on Me-purple box, Peace In Missisippi-B-side, purple box reissue, Power of Soul-BSotS, Stone Free-purple box, Captain Coconut-New Rising Sun and MLK reissued, opening section still not available

Midnight Lightning (original versions): Trash Man-HMM, Midnight Lightning-unreleased, Hear My Train-VoN, Hey Gypsy Boy-PHA, Blue Suede Shoes-see Loose Ends, Machine Gun-unreleased, Once I Had a Woman-:blues, Beginnings-unreleased

Essential Jimi Hendrix-Gloria on purple box

Nine To the Universe-all songs reissued except for title track

Jimi Hendrix Concerts-Stone Free, Bleeding Heart and Foxy Lady not reissued yet

Johnny B. Goode-all tracks reissued

Band of Gypsys 2-Ezy Ryder not reissued

Live at Winterland-all tracks reissued, +3-Voodoo Child not reissued

Radio One-all tracks reissued

Live & Unreleased/Lifelines-One Rainy Wish (alt), Room Full of Mirrors (alt), Rainy Day Shuffle, Valleys of Neptune (demo), Sending My Love to Linda (depending on what's on BSotS), plus most of the LA show

Stages-Stockholm-some tracks, Paris-reissued, San Diego-mostly reissued, Atlanta-reissued

Not completely definitive, but a good start. So there's still a lot to get back out. Plus that's not even contemplating if a War Heroes/Loose Ends reissue takes place, that would almost wipe out the need for South Saturn Delta and leave 6 or 7 tracks stranded there. What I might do for myself is make a "box set" playlist out of SSD, VoN, PHA and BSotS and see what it looks and sounds like.

 

Since I love the Band Of Gypsys so much, I decided to use this excellent playlist from PacificBlueOcean (Jimi Hendrix Atlanta Pop Festival ) as a blueprint and expand it a bit with the blues numbers I love so much.
So this is (for now) my perfect Band Of Gypsys playlist:

Gypsy Side
Ezy Ryder (Record Plant, New York, NY, 1969.12.18, v2) Cry Of Love
Stepping Stone (single, 70-01-07 studio, 70-02 mix) Voodoo Child: The Jimi Hendrix Collection
Izabella (v3) (single, 69-11-21 studio, 70-02 mix) Voodoo Child: The Jimi Hendrix Collection
Power Of Soul (Record Plant, 21 janv 70) South Saturn Delta
Message To Love (Record Plant, 1969.12.19) (Mix 2) The Jimi Hendrix Experience

Blues Side:
Lonely Avenue (November 1969 jam with Buddy Miles) West Coast Seattle Boy
Bleeding Heart (1969/5/ 21) People, Hell And Angels
Once I Had a Woman (Record Plant on Jan. 23, 1970) Blues
Hear My Train A Comin' (1969/5/ 21) People, Hell And Angels
Burning Desire (Record Plant, 16 janv 70) West Coast Seattle Boy
Earth Blues (Record Plant, NY, 1969/12/19) (V2) The Jimi Hendrix Experience

I really, really wanted to put Born Under a Bad Sign (Record Plant, Dec. 15, 1969, Blues album) somewhere, but could not find a spot.

 

Here is the Band of Gypsies studio cdr that I created. All of the songs are versions with vocals.

Hear My Train A Comin' (PH&A)
Bleeding Heart (PH&A)
Room Full Of Mirrors (First Rays)
Ezy Ryder (Purple Box)
Earth Blues (Purple Box)
Message To Love (WCSB)
Burning Desire (Baggy's Rehearsals)
Them Changes (Baggy's Rehearsals)
(I'm Your) Hoochie Coochie Man (Baggy's Rehearsals)
Lover Man (Baggy's Rehearsals)
Mannish Boy (Blues)
Stepping Stone (Voodoo Child)
Izabella (Voodoo Child)
Astro Man (Purple Box)
Once I Had A Woman (Blues)
Power Of Soul (SSD)

 

Here is my revamped Blues track listing

Red House (alternate version)
Killing Floor
Driving South
(I'm Your) Hoochie Coochie Man
Catfish Blues
Hear My Train A Comin' (acoustic version)
Come On (Let The Good Times Roll)
Electric Church Red House
It's Too Bad
Hear My Train A Comin' (electric version)
Bleeding Heart
Georgia Blues
Mannish Boy
Once I Had A Woman
Midnight Lightning

Born Under A Bad Sign or Country Blues (alternate tracks to replace one of above)

 

The following Band of Gypsys studio album conceivably could have been completed in January/February 1970. The material in question was mostly in the final stages of completion. Had Hendrix had a producer to guide him through the final phases of overdubbing and mixing, he could have delivered a stellar album in the winter of 1970 -- however, one suspects he did not want to give Ed Chalpin/PPX an album of first-rate studio tracks.

Side A:
Ezy Ryder
Power of Soul
Stepping Stone
Izabella

Side B:
Message of Love
Earth Blues
Burning Desire

I do think it is interesting that EH never issued an exclusive BoG studio set, particularly because they have proudly promoted the trio on a number of occasions through a number of projects. Hendrix, Cox and Miles started recording together in the spring of 1969, then exclusively during the fall through the New Years Fillmore shows and subsequently through early 1970. In addition to being able to show how close Hendrix was to realizing a finished BoG album in early 1970, there are also a number of intriguing session outtakes from the various sessions that took place. But much like with the disjointed manner in which EH has presented the "First Rays" period, the BoG studio work has also been spread out across numerous titles with little cohesion.

 

I found this article while I was looking for something else. I must have read this when it came out, but I found it really interesting in context of recent conversations. It's a must read.

Was Jimi Hendrix Out of Control During His Final Days in the Studio? Evidence Emerges on 'People, Hell and Angels'

 

I'd rather a collected BoG than the EH Both Sides thing.

 

I was just looking at that issue last weekend! Good article though the headline is a little misleading, none of these three albums really touch on 1970. After decades of 1969 being a sort of Jimi black hole in terms of material, we have 5 CDs that mostly concentrate on that year (the “trilogy” and Dagger’s Hear My Music and Burning Desire). Great as the music sometimes was (and sometimes not), it was definitely lacking in focus. Working in Electric Lady certainly helped with that focus, possibly working with Chas again might have helped even more. Though it’s also possible Jimi was just in a different place that Chas couldn’t relate to and Slade was really where his heart was.

 

I guess I need Baggy's Rehearsals, them isn't it?

 

Great article. Personally I think Jimi would have ended up heading off in another direction along the lines of what Herbie Hancock did with Headhunters had Jimi lived, but Jimi needed money and the record company was demanding something from him and ultimately it was that vs. his need to experiment make it seem like that he was out of control. I think Jimi conflicted by business needs vs. artistic needs is probably a better picture of the situation. The eternal struggle of all artists really.

 

I know it might sound strange, but I think this one, "Once I Had a Woman," was the epitome of Jimi's blues explorations up to his death. I'm glad we have a reasonably complete version without it being too chopped (it's a nice natural fade), or posthumous musicians added.

It's thoroughly composed. Obviously the the lyrics were thought out and delivered in a non-traditional fashion, with unique flourishes, not dissimilar from the masterful "Voodoo Chile." The guitar tone at the beginning, whether it was a happy accident, or planned, with the thin sound and crackle, hearkens to the delta era, while still maintaining Jimi's psychedelic predilections.

Indeed, given my dislike for seemingly unfinished compositions being shoehorned into playlists for FROTNRS, this one is a rare occasion where I believe the power of the performance makes up for any of its shortcoming, akin to "Come On Pt. 1."

It's a little surprising that this song wasn't known to have been used in any of Jimi's proposed tracklists, especially being fresh in his mind by the time that Electric Lady opened for business. Overdubs or not, in my mind it was ready to go.

The same version from Loose Ends?

 

There are 2 versions of Burning Desire on the Baggy's Rehearsals disc and I made the cdr so long ago that I don't recall which version that I used whether it was the one from Loose Ends or not.

 

How?

Stoned man. Very, very stoned.

 

Not necessarily stoned, but beautiful

 

Nothing wrong with being both!

 

Toss on Room Full of Mirrors and tweak the sides a bit for a little better time balance and it could have worked, had they put down vocals on BD. The live BOG could have been an all Jimi album if he included the Jan 1 version and dropped Buddy's two songs. At this point I think that has to be the most fully realized version of the song (the Baggy's one from Loose Ends doesn't have the intro). But it was one of those songs he had in the back of his mind, "I can do better". He was still writing it down as late as the Aug 14 list for PHA (or Strate Ahead). If ever get around to making my triple LP version of the material, I'd do the live versions of BD from 1/1 and Lover Man & Hear My Train from Berkeley since those are arguably the best version of those songs (though I like the studio Lover Man from the purple box and thinks it was just about good to go).

I still want a full 2 CD collection of the final BOG session on Jan 20, it's all split up over the various CDs, but we're still missing a big piece with the Highway of Desire/$7 in My Pocket jam.

 

As interesting as "Who Knows" is, that is another track that ideally would have been omitted if the intention is to strengthen the LP. The 1/1 2nd show version of "Stone Free" is tremendous and certainly could have enhanced the album, particularly if Hendrix was still going to save things like "Earth Blues," Ezy Ryder" and "Burning Desire" for future studio endeavors.

Agreed.