Just won a GE VR 1000-7 cartridge from Ebay

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by PhxJohn, Sep 6, 2017.

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  1. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Hi everyone,

    I just won this cartridge. Anyone have any experience with the model ? I also have a brand new stylus (one of many) that is a 0.5 mil and changes the model to a VR 1000-5 which is supposed to track at a lighter force. That would depend if Pfanstiehl made the cantilever more flexible. I have not tried it yet as the turntable that I bought for it an AR 77-XB is not here yet either.
     
  2. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    I posted this last night but it did not appear.
     
  3. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    I installed a NOS Electro-Voice stylus in the GE VR 1000. The Pfanstiehl 508-D5 0.5 mil was useless as the tip did not extend beyond the metal shielding. Visually, the cantilever was just too tiny. My stereo dealer installed the cartridge in a brand new AR headshell. The cartridge sounds great ! Clarity and speed come to mind. It definitely has me thinking about a London Decca as the next logical step. I have an Ortofon Quintet Blue which is a fine cartridge. The VR 1000-7 is 'bright'. But since it is clean, you can back off at tiny bit on the treble control.
     
  4. McLover

    McLover Senior Member

    Suspension on these old cantilevers is iffy. Also, this is a lot better mono cartridge than Stereo. GE didn't get Stereo somewhat down until the final GE Stereo Classic, then they were out of the cartridge business. Think about the ADC early model cartridges as the successor to the GE Stereo line, as they were both designed by Peter Pritchard. Peter Pritchard wanted lower tip mass and tracking force, and GE didn't want to evolve much, and they went from the dominant manufacturer of magnetic HiFi cartridges to a historical footnote. Shure and Pickering took over from there, and ADC, Empire, and other USA makers competed. When Stereo first was released to the world on LP discs, Shure's M3D was the finest available of the first generation, the M7D/M21D was better but not suited for changer use.
     
  5. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    The channel separation is incredible. The VR 1000 was the last cartridge group. Newer than the Classics. VR 1000 was available as '-7, -5, and -3'. Styli 0.7 mil, 0.5 mil, 0.3 x 0.7 mil respectively. It is a shame that Peter Pritchard left GE. The cartridge had tremendous potential.
     
  6. McLover

    McLover Senior Member

    GE didn't let Peter Pritchard do his thing, and they got out of cartridges. What is the published channel separation on the VR 1000-7?
     
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  7. Tamla Junkie

    Tamla Junkie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Detroit, Michigan
    Better than 20 dB at 1 kHz. Not great, but about par for the course for the primordial stereo era.

    The Shure M3D, my favorite stereo cartridge for that era, is also rated at better than 20 dB @ 1 kHz.

    I've played with the GE variable reluctance stereo cartridges, the Shure, the early Pickering stereo offerings, the ELAC "Beatle" cartridge, and the Shure was far and away the best. That said, the GE is not without its charms and I think no early cartridge collection is complete without a VR-1000-7.
     
    showtaper likes this.
  8. McLover

    McLover Senior Member

    Indeed. Technically speaking the Shure M3D was the best early generation Stereo cartridge and the N7D/N21D even better. In the modern era, I regard the Shure M 44-7 as the quintessential period correct mono and pre 20 degree VTA Stereo option. And still available new along with genuine styli. Great on mono and pre 1966 Stereo.
     
    needlestein and The FRiNgE like this.
  9. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Here is a test report on the -7 and -5: Stereo Review
     
  10. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    The GE VR 1000-7 was a $10 cartridge back in the mid 60's. My very first cartridge was a Shure M44-5 that I bought to use with my brother's Sansui SR 4040 turntable. It cost twice what the GE cost. That turntable came with a moving coil cartridge with a transformer built into the headshell. Shure's always tracked very well, there is no disputing that. My next cartridge was a Pickering that came with my KLH Model 27 compact stereo. I think I have the model numbers correct, but it was 46 years ago. I replaced the DAT 2 (conical) stylus with a DAT E (elliptical). It was a significant improvement. I will skip the details and just list brands that I have had over the decades(that I remember LOL) GE, Grado, Ortofon, Pickering, Realistic(Shure), Sumiko, Shure, and Stanton.
     
  11. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    What changed in 1966 stereo ?
     
  12. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    A simple stylus assembly as in the below link could have been developed. Add the two pole pieces and mount the diamond in iron for a portion of the cantilever. Typical MM or MC levels could be achieved by varying the amount of iron. The amount of iron would affect tip mass. The rest of the cantilever could be made of various materials as the cantilever's only 'duty' would be to position the diamond tip. You could have many different models using one cartridge body but with various styli as did Shure with the M44 series. Probably even more as the stylus assembly on the GE can determine output. For example, the -7 version delivers 10 mv whereas the -5 version delivers 5 mv. And the only difference is the stylus. Here is the link to show what I am yammering about: https://www.amazon.com/Pfanstiehl-R...TF8&qid=1505628137&sr=8-2&keywords=pfanstiehl
     
  13. McLover

    McLover Senior Member

    Cutting head Tracking angle advanced from 15 degrees to 20 degrees. New RIAA agreed on standard.
     
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  14. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Whatever the 'faults' of the GE VR 1000 are, it sounds incredible. I enjoy it more than my Ortofon Quintet Blue. And the Quintet leaves many carts in the dust.
     
  15. Tamla Junkie

    Tamla Junkie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Detroit, Michigan
    Your post inspired me to dig out mine and mount it in a spare headshell. Honestly, I think the only misgiving I have with the cartridge is tracking ability, which frankly was mediocre on the Shure too. It's much better than I remembered it being. A faulty memory is a funny thing...

    The stereo separation seems to be better than the Shure M3D. The high end is slightly more rolled off on the GE, but I actually consider this to be a good thing for my purposes. I'm going to try the GE out for the next couple of weeks and see if the Shure is headed to eBay.
     
    PhxJohn likes this.
  16. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Which of these three do you have ? (You have to scroll down a bit on the page).
    1967 Allied Radio Catalog - Electronics For Everyone #260B Low-res page 151 of 526

    Mine has a 0.7 mil stylus installed. The Stereo Review(link above in earlier post in blue) test indicated that the -7 version was brighter sounding than the -5. As I noted above, I could not use the 0.5 mil stylus. I back off on the treble one detent on my Marantz 222oB. My speakers are nicely balanced(for my tastes). They are AR 6's with the tweeter pots set to about 3/4 from off. I think I noted above that my GE is bright but very clean. It is very easy to listen to. I wonder which stylus you have ?

    When you mentioned that the Shure tracks better, I have not pushed mine with any 45 rpm 12" singles or remasters. I am tracking at 4 grams on an AR 77-XB. I lucked out with this AR. Tonearm does not have slop or friction. Feels almost as good as my RB202. Definitely better than the RB101 tonearm when my Rega was stock RP1. The GE is heavy. AR changed to a lighter aluminum counterweight with the 77-XB. The counterweight is at the limit of the end-stub and looks precarious. I sent away for an older counterweight from Ebay. Of course. LOL. Ebay is where all of the cool stuff that I could not afford as a teenager and very young adult, is now ready for me to buy. Right now, the old Empire turntables look interesting. Just what I need, a third turntable. I was messaging a gentleman in Russia on Ebay. He has a GE VR 1000 for sale. $375 USD. He explained that they are very popular over there and they even make special tonearms for the GE's. I asked him what the differences are. If he tells me, I will post on here.
     
  17. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Important- I just noticed a listing for a VR 1000-7 in NZ. Listing has expired. But I noticed the shield is missing. The shield not only reduces/eliminates hum but it holds the stylus assembly in place. If you contemplate buying one, make sure the shield is present.
     
  18. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    I just bought a Marantz PM5005 integrated amp. I wanted to test the 'bass'. So I put George Michael's song 'Hard Day' on the AR 77-XB with the GE VR 1000-7 cartridge. On the heavy bass notes...it mistracked. Skipped. I had not experienced that in decades. Is this one of the limitations of the GE and some other low compliance cartridges ? I didn't want to say 'older' cartridges because the Shure V15's and some of their other models were/are champs at tracking anything. I have my GE tracking at 4 grams and I don't want to go any higher. This is the first record that it mistracked on.
     
  19. Tamla Junkie

    Tamla Junkie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Detroit, Michigan
    Mistracking is a major limitation of the GE cartridges, and any moving iron or moving magnet cartridge from the dawn of stereo.
     
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  20. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    The GE VR 1000's still appear in 1967 catalogs. Not high compliance for sure. The -5 version has reasonable compliance, but the styli are nowhere to be found.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2017
  21. Tamla Junkie

    Tamla Junkie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Detroit, Michigan
    T
    The GE design dates back to the late 50s, early 60s. I'd honestly be surprised if they were still building them circa 1967... probably just back stock.
     
  22. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC
    I would bet that the pre 1966 Motown 45s and the Four Seasons Vee Jay 45s would sound Fantastic with the Shure M3D cart.

    I have a 1961 Shure M7D cart which I bought a new stylus for. I intend to install this in my Garrard Type A table for 45 playback.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2017
  23. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    There is a 1961 test report earlier in this thread. Anyway, I have been playing the GE all day and other than on that one album it sounds great. Really great.
     
  24. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    First record I tried with the GE --Supremes Greatest Hits. I yelled some expletive it sounded so good !
     
    Tamla Junkie likes this.
  25. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    The catalog says 'New' for the elliptical stylus model. I find it strange that they put the elliptical on the heavier tracking cantilever. But not as strange as dropping the cartridge altogether.
     
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