Ken Burns - "The Roosevelts"

My thoughts were that the GOP has drifted so far right-ward over the past 30 years that George Will sounds like a liberal today (even though I know he is really a conservative)

 

Dear Mrs Roosevelt (Woody Guthrie)



Bob Dylan and The Crackers

 

This sounds fascinating, though it sounds more like a winter program than a late summer one due to the time commitment.

 

I've read that Russians have always pronounced it both ways, but here in Moscow, Idaho, it is definitely pronounced MOSS-ko. Outsiders who say MOSS-cow are giggled and pointed at behind their backs. Not that anyone asked or cares, the commonly accepted explanation for the name of our very small city is: In 1875 our first Postmaster named it after his home town of Moscow, Pennsylvania.

 

Well, that's that. I'm very glad to have watched it. Bravo, Mr. Burns!

 

Go figure. I and everyone I know call is Moscow rhyming with cow.

Well, the program has run its course so it's bact to football. IMO, this is one of Burns best.

 

Ever since I read this book 20 years ago, I always cringe when someone says it with a "cow" in it, but that way does seem to have taken over in pronunciation in the U.S. in the past few decades, unfortunately.

 

I liked the first half of the series, but was a bit disappointed as I felt that the last half at times veered close to hagiography in regards to its treatment of FDR and his presidency (IMHO).

 

He uses voices from all parties to give some balance, but more importantly to immunize himself against criticism that this is a liberal or Democratic Party propaganda film pushed by PBS.

I don't mean to be Political but it is inherent in the subject matter. FDR is fascinating because he had gone from being a President that Republicans used to want to align themselves with to one who is regularly smeared as a socialist or a architect of our deficit woes.

The documentary shows him as the right man at an impossible time. Even my Mother, who was a child in the Depression called me up last night to praise FDR after watching the show.

She is now 80 and after decades spent listing to AM Talk Radio she has drifted more and more to the right. Ken Burns gave her a sober reminder of the stark reality of the Depression era and the amount of resolve that FDR showed in trying to help the average Americans.

Well done, the subjects are all larger than life characters.

 

Excellent series. I always love KB's docs. I have a nephew who thinks Michael Moore is the premier documentary maker........he really has no clue

 

I've been trying to watch it and it's obviously a romanticized view of a political figure which is fine. There's a lot of people then and now who see politicians as "daddy" or "mommy" figures though. I can't comprehend this mentality myself.

I haven't seen 100% of it but I guess they didn't add the letter by one of his economic guys admitting that after years of their economic policies unemployment and the economy was a bad as when FDR started basically admitting "New Deal" economic (not talking social) policies were a failure.

The War got us out the the Great Depression not FDR.

I have a pet theory that one of the real reasons for the CCC/WPA was to get young men away from the cities so they could not riot or start a revolution. So they created these rural armies to fix roads and build trails and bridges as far from the cities as possible. I still see the little concrete bridges all over the county.

 

What? I can't say I know anyone with such a mentality. It is apocryphal.

How does this statement relate to the documentary?

 

I have been saying it with a "cow" in it for much more than a few decades. I have rarely heard it differently; only when I was in Europe and parts of Canada. In Asia and other places, I've heard it pronounce many different ways.

 

If you go to Oklahoma, they say "Miamuh" instead of "Miami". Doesn't make it right in Florida.

In the US media, it seems like the "MosCOWW" pronunciation gained traction about the same time as "GlazzGOWW".

 

Things had gotten so bad by 1932, that most likely there was no short term solution to problems that had taken years to accumulate (although unemployment did drop in half between 1932 and 1940, it would, indeed, take a war to get the country back to full employment. If Hoover and the congress would have acted dramatically in 1930-31, things would have never gotten to where they did. The main thing was that the New Deal put in place things (such as Social Security, the FDIC, Glass–Steagall (RIP), The G.I. Bill, Unemployment Insurance and a government commitment to full employment that would (hopefully) lessen the possibility that such a huge depression would happen again. I know there are some people that would like to turn the country back to a time before the New Deal, but that discussion would probably be too political for this site.

 

There's infinite examples of people fawning over politicians. Just look at the people at conventions and at rallies how they cheer and get misty eyed and give the most positive attributes to people they don't know or people that haven't even served or even people that are already know to be crooks and liars. This kinda stuff really disturbs me.

I'm reminded me of the Gilligan's Island episode where they think one of the castaways was a murderer and Gilligan says to Skipper "You know Skipper, we didn't know ANY of these people before we got stranded."

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I liked the show but I really don't see what the point is beyond a nostalgic trip through the Roosevelt family and telling a story. I mean it's not a historical documentary (to me) even though it's content is historical. It's not an expose or an analysis either. It's more akin to those films they show of presidential candidates at a Convention except longer.

I just don't believe the bit near the end that made it seem Eleanor learning about FDR's mistress was a surprise and that Eleanor may have felt cheated on. We now know that Eleanor herself had a lesbian life away from FDR.

 

I see what you mean. I do know some political hacks of every ilk. I just wouldn't describe them as looking for a Mommy or Daddy. More like hardcore fans for a specific sports team.

I felt it was an historical documentary it just was non-controversial and somewhat glossed over due to the standard restraints of television.

 

I support all that by the way, most people do. I tried to make the point which is the raw "stimulus" spending never actually stimulated the economy. That's not MY opinion, that's the internal opinion of one of his top people many years into it. I forget who it was exactly, may have been a Secretary. That's a completely different topic than the "safety net", financial regulation, new social benefits.

The drop in "unemployment" you mention must have included numbers from the direct employment of people from the government (WPA, CCC, etc) which I would not count since it's not a reflection of the economy.

I'm not an economist but it seems the need for war materials is what actually got things going by putting demand on industry rather than just paying people to dig ditches and build park facilities.

Wash, rinse, repeat, and fast forward to 1964, to 1980, to 1991, to 2003, and probably 2015. It's a nice cycle of a bad economy with bogey-man threats followed by militarism.

 

It was interesting to me how this series crossed over with some past Burns documentaries. The "National Parks" series had more about some specific aspects of TR's presidency, and the "Dust Bowl" series went more in-depth about Henry Wallace being replaced by Harry Truman on the 1944 ticket.

 

OK, back to the documentary to keep this open.

 

Teddy is another fascinating character. He was the original tugged individualist. Despite his somewhat reckless and eccentric behavior it is hard not to like the man. I wish we could have a President that colorful and unguarded today.

 

I'm over 50 and I've never in my life heard it pronounced Mos-ko...and I've known a couple of people with degrees in Russian studies that speak Russian and spent time there.

 

Enjoyed it very much!

TIL that the only thing those people had to FEAR was Eleanor Roosevelt's manner of speaking!

 

To keep this thread from being hijacked I just opened a new one in the Off Topic forum about the presence or absence of Moss Cows.

 

After watching the entire thing I decided that Burns is better off sticking to broad topics rather than focusing on individuals (particularly politicians). It is hard to not stir up political feelings in this day and age, and I thought he was overly careful if anything. I am a great admirer of FDR and I would take it that you aren't, but it is hard to present a biography of that large a figure without annoying someone.