KISS: The Songs 1974-2012

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by GodShifter, Feb 7, 2017.

  1. YardByrd

    YardByrd Forum Resident

    Location:
    Helsinki
    By the late 80s, I wasn't listening to anything contemporary except for Flat Duo Jets, Pogues and Tom Waits... by '91, even though I was living in WA state for a brief period, I was totally unaware of grunge... Nirvana took off big time when I moved back to the hills of North Carolina, where I was only listening to blues and bluegrass (even mowing legendary flat picker Doc Watson's lawn)... I tell you this solely to illustrate that besides a handful of Cobain tunes, I wouldn't know grunge if it bit me on the a** (I did see Mudhoney a few years ago here in Helsinki; my friend at the gig expressed it best "they sound like a Doors tribute band trying out their own material")... so, I am actually able to approach CoS with absolutely no preconceived notions for good or bad.

    And what's so cool as I get into this album, is it's exactly what I was hoping it would be after recently discovering the pleasures of CotN and especially The Elder... a weird detour in their catalog - an outlier that sounds like nothing else they've done... no formula - at least according to their own lights - and a risk... and with grownup lyrics to boot (somebody said that earlier; I forget who, but kudos)... "Hate" itches that scratch in particular... as I've said before, I've preferred Gene's songs since the '70s so it's nice to have him back on track... and while it can be compared to "Unholy" in that it's A) heavy B) opening track for Gene, at least there's none of those awful gang vox on the chorus that I grew to detest as @GodShifter steered this boat through the perilous shoals of the '80s... that's what kept "Unholy" from being a bonafide classic in my book... if it had been the sole song of theirs with gang vox, I woulda loved it... but by '92 they had beat that poor horse to death and then some... thankfully, "Hate" doesn't... I digress... Gene delivers a cool vox... Bruce finally lays down some guitar that I find memorable... and Eric Singer is really the man for this albums... can't begin to imagine the other two drummers able to deliver in this context... I dig this...
     
  2. Musicman1998

    Musicman1998 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Georgia
    Hate:
    Well, it's well played, the rhythm flows fairly well, Gene's in good voice, and while the song is overall listenable, it doesn't feel essential. I don't automatically go "I want to hear that again!", it's a copy of a copy of a copy. But it's passable.
     
  3. DTVOICES94

    DTVOICES94 Active Member

    Hate
    Gene's delivery sells the song although there isn't much of one there. One of the worst openers in the catalog (along with King of the Mountain and Hell of Hallelujah) and might be the worst Gene offering on here. The production isn't helping any and neither is the dumb intro. 4/10
     
  4. yarbles

    yarbles Forum Resident

    Location:
    Darkhan
    Can't say I noticed a song, but too bad about the soloing and vocals. What's he saying - 'let me feel the cumstain'???

    Regarding VV's soloing, do any musicians here understand his stream-of-consciousness widdly-wankery, because it makes no sense to me at all. Is there actually any method to his apparent madness?

    Foolishly, I forgot to hit pause after Euphoria finished, and it went into 'Get The Lead Out', which is worse, if anything. Looking at some of the comments though, I will say this: VV's fans, if a tad delusional, are nothing if not effusive. This made me chuckle: "This sounds like if Led Zeppelin were actually good. Zeppelin should listen and learn from VVV" :biglaugh::crazy:
     
  5. yarbles

    yarbles Forum Resident

    Location:
    Darkhan
    HATE

    Pretty much exactly what I was expecting.

    I played this 3x, about 15 minutes ago, and already I can't remember anything about it. Basically, there is no song here; it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing. IMO.
     
  6. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    Each day while we are covering CARNIVAL OF SOULS, I'll post the lyrics to the song of the day. These are from the KissFAQ digital booklet, which can be found here:

    The KISSFAQ - Digital Booklet Archive



    Track One - "Hate"
    [​IMG]
     
  7. GodShifter

    GodShifter The Last in Line® Thread Starter

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    Jugulator sucked. No other way to say it.
     
    BluesOvertookMe likes this.
  8. Cheevyjames

    Cheevyjames Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Durham, NC
    Hate

    I'm going to try to approach all these songs on their own merits. For Hate, without the vocals it sounds nothing like KISS. That's fine, I'm just stating it. The intro/chorus riff isn't the kind of thing that they've normally written; they just don't write riffs like that. So this stuff is totally out of left field for being a KISS album. Change is good, though. It challenges us. And this song is certainly challenging for being the opening tune on a new KISS album. Gene's bass is pretty damn funky on this song which an interesting way to play on such a heavy song. Hate is right in Gene's wheelhouse vocally and attitude-wise. Eric plays the hell out of the song and I love that. Overall it's an average song for me. I don't love or 'hate' it, but it's solid. A good start for the album.
     
  9. vamborules

    vamborules Forum Resident

    Location:
    CT
    Nope. Not buying it. :shake:
     
  10. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    I definitely disagree with the notion that these songs don't sound good acoustically. Presented this way, you can see the really catchy and/or melodic song at the heart of it all.

    But I do agree about the difficulty of adapting many of Ace's songs acoustically. When I thought about it more, after posting last night, I realized that a few of these might not sound as good as I first thought. Much like how "Shock Me" just wasn't coming together when they tried it. I could still hear "Talk To Me" or "What's On Your Mind?" working, but maybe not the others. As I said, "Ozone" would be awesome, but there's no way at that point in time they'd present a song to the world with the lyrics "I'm the kind of guy, who likes getting high" over and over again! :shake:
     
    carlwm likes this.
  11. vamborules

    vamborules Forum Resident

    Location:
    CT
    It's funny you mention In Utero because I was trying to think of what that feedback reminded me of and that's what it was. I mean, feedback is feedback I guess..but still. That's what I was thinking of.

    I disagree with you on that album though. To me it's one of the best of the '90s. In fact I just listened to 'Milk It' now and oh boy did it sound good. Absolutely crushes 'Hate'. In my opinion anyway.
     
  12. GodShifter

    GodShifter The Last in Line® Thread Starter

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    Ha! What? You mean I slave over a hot keyboard for over an hour and I can't sell you on this song? :laugh:

    Truth is, I get it. Maybe there isn't a ton to the tune and, as people have said, it's just not a style that people can relate to for KISS, but that's been a problem for me since right after The Elder. I think, for me, I've always really liked heavy rock like this (stoner, doom, and aggro metal are big in my record collection) so I can accept this with no problem (is it KISS? Dunno, but that's what it says on the album cover). I was heavily into "grunge" at the time it flourished so I love all those bands that came out of the scene (except Pearl Jam) so there's that, too. I totally respect your opinion on "Hate" and if you don't like it; you don't. I don't know this album very well other than about three songs in, but I can tell you if you didn't like this one for whatever reason the next two are going to probably be bigger downers, but who knows as people latch onto to different things. That's one thing I'll say about this group: with few exceptions, people never fail to surprise me with their opinions. I think it's going to go one way and it goes the other which is quite refreshing if you really think about it.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2017
  13. vamborules

    vamborules Forum Resident

    Location:
    CT
    They do sound good. It's just not the way I want to hear them.
     
  14. vamborules

    vamborules Forum Resident

    Location:
    CT
    No, I meant the song. Not your write up. That's why I cleared everything but the video out of the comment.
     
  15. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    Send me your address, and I'll add you to my Christmas Card list! I love it! :hugs:

    I wish you'd been with us when we were covering this album! ;)

    I like "Rise To It" and "The Street Giveth..." more than you do, and you definitely like "Read My Body" more than I do, but other than that, we're pretty much in total agreement!

    Thanks for sharing! :cheers:
     
    Diamond Star Halo and carlwm like this.
  16. GodShifter

    GodShifter The Last in Line® Thread Starter

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    But he didn't say they didn't sound good acoustically. He said he preferred in the context he originally heard them as: hard rock songs. I agree with him. I don't normally like acoustic versions of electric songs as it's just not my thing.
     
  17. GodShifter

    GodShifter The Last in Line® Thread Starter

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    No, I got it. I was just making a (apparently not funny) joke. I understood.
     
    npgchris likes this.
  18. YardByrd

    YardByrd Forum Resident

    Location:
    Helsinki
    agreed! I saw Unplugged the night it was broadcast and never seen it again... until yesterday when I watched God of Thunder and 2000 Man... didn't need to go any further... sounds fine, but more like a novelty as opposed to essential... which are the originals...
     
  19. Curveboy

    Curveboy Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York City
    They are right.
     
  20. walrus

    walrus Forum Resident

    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    That's the best version of that song, by a mile.

    Alive III was my intro to Kiss, so i'll always have a special place for it in my heart, even though it's about as 'live' as an extra on Walking Dead. Wish they'd added "Tears Are Falling" to it, since all the other 80's tunes on Alive III sound much heavier and rock harder than the studio versions.
     
  21. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    If you don't like it, you don't like it. But you almost couldn't have picked two worse songs to gauge the overall quality of the performance. Give one or two of these a shot, if you've got a few minutes: "Got To Choose", "Rock Bottom", "Sure Know Something", "See You Tonite", "Comin' Home", "Goin' Blind" or "A World Without Heroes". These are just off the top of my head, but are all fine examples of how quite a few of their songs really shined in this type of setting.
     
  22. YardByrd

    YardByrd Forum Resident

    Location:
    Helsinki
    On your say so, I'll give those specific tunes a look see in the morning... time to put the young 'un to bed... I'm 10 hours ahead of you... I'm in the future... if you need a winning lottery ticket number, just ask ;-)
     
  23. yarbles

    yarbles Forum Resident

    Location:
    Darkhan
    My imagination is running riot trying to envisage how PAUL will be tackling this type of material vocally, assuming his songs are as 'grungy' as Hate. It could well be the comedic high point of their entire catalogue, which would be no mean feat. Over the past few albums, PAUL's vocs have become an enormous irritant for me, but I haven't actually LOL'd yet. That might all be about to change.

    One observation I would make at this early stage: despite the adverse opinions of some narrow-minded 'grunge' haters, there was a huge amount of melodicism within the genre, and several of the singers had incredible voices. GENE's past material has generally lacked both of those qualities; Hate was no exception, and was proof that if you are trying to mimic 'grunge', it's not sufficient for the music just to be heavy. But at least Hate was tolerable, if instantly forgettable, and I'd hazard a guess that that will be true of his other songs here. On the other hand, when you factor in PAUL's increasingly irksome strangulated cat vocals and generally idiotic lyrics, CoS could well develop into an unlistenable nightmare.
     
  24. The Hermit

    The Hermit Forum Resident

    They were shouting "Boo-urns!!!"
     
    dave9199, Cheevyjames and bartels76 like this.
  25. carlwm

    carlwm Well-Known Member

    Location:
    wales
    Appreciate that!

    Always good to connect musically with someone who's opinions you respect!

    Nice thing about this thread though is even when someone is way off the centre ground (for me, loving Crazy Nights, not much enjoying Ace's solo record) people are understanding & give informed rebuttals rather than rant & be rude. It's really refreshing.

    When I was away, my only way of listening to music was an ancient net book with such knackered speakers, they make Tom Waits sound like Alvin & The Chipmunks so I thought it wasn't fair to comment on stuff. Hopefully, I'll have heard Revenge enough to be able to add some thought tomorrow & also keep up with COS.

    Into uncharted waters from hereon in for me!
     

Share This Page