Mick Taylor / Bill Wyman Exile on Main Street contributions

Good, I'm glad you brought up the point on erroneous crediting for Bill. It seems to be a real problem with them. We won't even touch the revisionism, over Bill and Brian. But I will tell you Bill is on a hell of a lot more of those later albums than the credits say. It's also funny how all these songs that Bill supposedly did not play on, he sounds great on live and almost note for note

 

"Let It Loose" for me is like the Stones equivalent of the Caramilk Secret or Col. Sanders' secret eleven herbs and spices- just who is playing that guitar, Keith or Taylor? It is a great, understated part that is perfect for the song. Like I said, playing-wise it has all the hallmarks of Keith but the execution of Taylor if that makes any sense. For 27 years now I've been trying to suss out who's playing there. It honestly wouldn't surprise me if "Let It Loose" was another uncredited Jagger/Taylor collaboration like "Sway" or "Moonlight Mile"- again, another one o' those hunches...

 

Yeah, it is funny how that works, innit? I mean, Bill Wyman supposedly only playing on exactly three songs on Goats Head Soup or Dirty Work? Crazy. Some of the credits simply can't be right.

 

One thing I've always wondered but never looked into. Is there electric bass on the tracks where Bill Plummer is credited with acoustic bass? I always assumed so, since most of those tracks were recorded in Nelcotte or Olympic Studios before being overdubbed in the sessions at Sunset Studio in LA (where Plummer would have been).

I think I've heard a rhythm track of "Rip This Joint" that had bass on it, for example, and that would have been Nellcotte. Maybe they wiped the electric bass before adding Plummer's overdub?

Maybe the credit of "uprite bass" wasn't intended to mean that Wyman was not on the track?

 

IIRC, Wyman was living well away from the chateau so showing up quickly wasn't going to happen. This probably explains why he didn't play on all tracks where bass was needed.

 

Exactly, I mentioned that earlier. Bill was far enough away that he could not be on call 24/7.

 

One of the great strengths of "Exile" is the ensemble playing. It's the one where Taylor is reigned in the most, meaning he is integrated into the whole. Weather this was by accident due to the nature of the recording sessions, or deliberate in the mixing/production I have no idea. Fascinating subject.

 

According to the 33 1/3 book, I Just Want To See His Face has Taylor on electric bass with Plummer overdubbed later on acoustic. So it has both electric and acoustic bass if this is correct.

 

Regarding Rocks Off I am pretty sure it is Keith playing both rhythm parts, see the quote from Andy Johns below. I do think Taylor plays a part in the middle of the mix, just a simple boogie pattern that locks with the piano. Also there are some ghostly slide parts and little runs that I think are him that pop up through the mix.

“Rocks Off"
Andy Johns: It went on for ages. When Mick came back from Paris for the first time he seemed happy with the sound. And Keith would sit down stairs and at one point he sat there for 12 hours without getting out of his chair just playing the riff over and over and over.

And then one night, it was very late, four or five in the morning, Keith says, ‘Let me listen to that take again.’ And he nods off while the tape is playing. I thought, ‘Great. That’s it. End of the night and I’m out of here.’ So I go back to my place where I was staying. (Horn player/arranger) Jim Price and I had this villa. It was pretty spanky. I’m
tellin’ you. A half an hour drive. I walk in the front door and the phone is ringing. I pick it up and it’s Keith. ‘Where are you?’ ‘Well, I’m obviously here ‘cause I answered the phone.’ ‘Well you better get back here, man, ‘cause I have this guitar part. Come back!’

And I returned and it’s now six in the morning and he played the counter rhythm guitar of “Tumbling Dice” which was another Telecaster track, a second rhythm track, the whole thing just came to light and it just knit the whole thing together. That was one of my favorite tunes. Keith used to sleep with his guitars.

It was a very busy mix. It was very difficult to mix. At Sunset Sound I tried mixing it a couple of times and it wouldn’t work. On the last batch Mick called up and said ‘Come back. We can’t beat your mixes.’ I mixed about another 12 songs in a marathon session. I would just leave the booth to have a piss and just go back in the room and that was it. For some reason I brought ‘Tumbling Dice’ up and it just started to work. Sometimes it happens that way.

Here is the full interview:
Engineer Andy Johns Discusses the making of The Rolling Stones Exile On Main Street »

 

"All Down The Line" for one. Plummer gets the credit but Bill Wyman is the odds-on favourite for having actually played the part. Give it a listen, quintessential Wyman bass playing there.

Excellent points, George. What's crazy is, out of eighteen tracks, exactly two ("Rocks Off" and "Ventilator Blues" though you might as well include "All Down The Line" too since Bill Wyman probably is playing on it) feature the entire band, plus Nicky Hopkins, Bobby Keys and Jim Price- the lineup a lot of Stones aficionados consider the Stones' finest (as shown on the 1972 tour).

 

Bill Wyman didn't play on Tumbling Dice?!?

(This is why I love this site)

 

Not on the studio version, at least Bill did do a nice variation on Mick Taylor's original bassline when they played it live, though.

 

I remember when I was getting into the Stones I heard Exile after Sticky Fingers. At the time I was disappointed that there wasn't more stand along lead playing as on Sway and GYHMK. However over time I got more into it and now it is my favourite Stones album along with Let It Bleed.

The only areas I would add more Taylor would be some solos on Tumblin' Dice and Rocks Off like he did on the subsequent tour on the bridges. Maybe another 30 seconds of soloing with less of a fade on the end of Rocks Off?

 

It seems kind of strange that Exile is considered one of the great guitar albums -a double album, no less- with not a lot of heavy lead guitar playing etc. Exile On Main Street is a great example of guitar music where the guitars are there for the song, and not merely gratuitous showboating. Kinda refreshing, actually.

 

This is such a false myth that has been repeated ad nauseum for so many years that it's somehow become 'fact'. Get an early vinyl pressing and the record is anything but "murky", it's absolutely riveting. Some clown 'reviewer' called it "murky" way back when, and this has been the mantra ever since, unless, of course, you actually listen to the record. Hell, even the '94 Virgin CD doesn't sound "murky".

Sorry for the rant.

 

I still believe he did. And he played on a lot more than he was credited for

 

Hey, imagine my surprise when I found out it was Taylor and not Wyman playing bass on "Dancing With Mr D", that's a very "Wymanesque" bass line!

It could be Bill on "Tumbling Dice", but if so then he could very well be on "Torn and Frayed" and "Shine A Light" too (all of which are credited to Taylor on the album) since to me it sounds like the same guy played those three lines. But who knows? I bet if asked Bill would say "Of course I played on those songs!" and Taylor would say "Did I play bass on those songs?"

 

What would be the incentive to give Taylor credit where Wyman played? Unless it was simply an error?

 

I agree with you in general, but I believe that The reason for this perception is that there are (i) there are a number of tracks where vocals are much lower in the mix than is typical, and (ii) there are a number of tracks that are mixed in very narrow stereo, almost mono sounding, that sound murky when listened to back to back with a "wide stereo" track,especially on a home stereo setup. Listen to "All Down the Line" back to back with "Stop Breaking Down". Very different mixing approaches.

 

Exile sounds like one long party with people coming in to jam and going out to get loaded. It's a very youthful album. Does anyone really have the overview?

 

Keith has stated in 'Life' that he is the only Stone on 'Happy'.

 

No incentive at all. Simple errors, omissions, credits written down AFTER the sessions (often under the haze of drugs, booze and little sleep). It happens. Sometimes even the principles themselves mis-remember or forget details. George Harrison once told our host that he didn't play the lead solo on I'm Down. Well, he DID. George was probably thinking that Paul started playing some leads during the Help era (Ticket To Ride, Another Girl) and wrongly stated that he also played lead on I'm Down, not himself.

Andy Johns may well have accurately recalled the night/morning when Keith called him to return to the studio to lay down a counter rhythm part on Tumbling Dice, BUT, was THAT specific overdub actually incorporated into the released mix, or was it left off... or wiped for a part Taylor added or had contributed earlier during the session. No way to know for sure. Ron

 

Rocks Off I can see, I suppose, but I wouldn't touch the studio version of "Tumbling Dice", which I think is a great, great track. Keith's fills, so simple and melodic, with the interplay with Taylor's bass, are so iconic they are as much a part of the track as the lead vocals. Wouldn't change it. Live, Taylor's solos have impact because the original is so familiar.

 

Slightly off topic but does anyone know which parts Mick Taylor plays on the Sticky Fingers version of Brown Sugar? This song has lots of early takes on Youtube with quite a variety of different lead and rhythm guitar parts. I actually prefer a few of the early versions, Take 1 is really raw but I like it. Take 2 features some obvious Taylor lead bits in place of the famous Bobby Keys sax.



The SF version has 2 electrics playing rhythm that sound both like Keith, some acoustic guitar and electric lead that again is very Keith sounding.

 

The unusual hours are exactly why the players are shuffled.