Monacor / IMG Stage Line SPR-6 Pre-amp / Phono Stage Owners' Thread

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by LivingForever, May 2, 2017.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Benzion

    Benzion "Cogito, ergo sum" Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY
    Agreed. The output is WAY below what is listed on the box (450 mV).
     
  2. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    Your wasting your time. Needle drops don't tell the whole truth. I don't know why some people need to keep digging. It's OK up to about £80 but the output is too low for many MM cartridges and not as specified. I've just done another comparison. With enough gain and without superior product to hand it sounds decent. You couldn't describe it as bad value for the asking price. That's all.
     
  3. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    Here it is — I recorded some pieces with my Mac through an RME FireFace connected directly to the pre-amp's outputs. The only parameter I've [accurately] adjusted is the gain, directly on the FireFace, since the Monacor's output is lower than the Schiit's (when the Schiit is set on the suggested nominal MM settings), and by the way there is still some difference in volume in the final documents. Same records, same cartridge (Ortofon 2M Blue) on the same turntable (Pro-Ject Debut Carbon) with the same cables.

    It's easy to spot which is the Monacor and which is the Schiit, especially if you are used to at least one of the two devices — anyway, I let you guess which is which (I named them just "1" and "2") :)

    These are in 96kHz 24bit AIFF format:

    Dropbox - Samurai - 1.aif

    Dropbox - Samurai - 2.aif

    These are in 48kHz 16bit AAC 256kbps format (originally recorded in 96/24):

    Dropbox - Amore - 1.m4a

    Dropbox - Amore - 2.m4a

    Dropbox - Calling From Tokyo - 1.m4a

    Dropbox - Calling From Tokyo - 2.m4a

    Dropbox - It Can Happen - 1.m4a

    Dropbox - It Can Happen - 2.m4a

    Dropbox - You Do Me - 1.m4a

    Dropbox - You Do Me - 2.m4a
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2018
    bever70 and katylied like this.
  4. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    I would say the second file is the Schiit but frankly the sound is pretty poor in both cases even allowing for the file quality. BTW never heard the Schiit Mani in the flesh.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2018
  5. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    "1" is the Schiit and "2" is the Monacor.

    96kHz 24bit AIFF is a very good "file quality" anyway.
     
  6. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    Well I would say for some reason your sources sound Schiit :) then. Perhaps there is another issue in your set up causing the Mani to sound bad. Basically I'm saying both files don't sound great and there is little between them. Could be the digital interface used to convert the needle drops? Check out the youtube videos of the Mani - it sure can sound better even with Youtube compression. Perhaps using a better recording as an example (something AAA from an audiophile label) would provide a more accurate picture.
     
  7. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    Actually, the RME FireFace 800 is a top notch professional device — now out of production, but still highly regarded (the used units sells for almost as much as they costed new, sometimes more — new was about 1200€). Besides, Marc Johnson's album "Bass Desires" is a high quality and well renowned recording edited by the ECM label — pratically an audiophile recording. Ryuchi Sakamoto's "Beauty" is also highly regarded amongst audiophiles.

    What equipment did you use for listening to those files? And by the way, of course you downloaded them first...
     
  8. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    I'm not familiar with that music - not my thing. Perhaps if you listed your equipment as SH keeps asking people? Will stream them through the Oppo when I have time. As I said through computer and cheap chinese DAC the sound is relatively unimpressive and differences small.
     
  9. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    Listening again (this time to downloaded higher res files) I think your cartridge might be overloading the Schiit slightly (lack of headroom). Too much gain? (I believe Ortofon is fairly high output). On the Monacor file I heard some nasty distortion like mistracking in the middle. Certainly the gain of the Monicor is rather low for my AT100E. Ortofon has 25% more output. Any chance of doing 96khz WAV files?
     
  10. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    I listed all the equipment used, in detail.

    96kHz 24bit AIFF files and 96kHz 24bit WAVE files are both uncompressed PCM streams, thus identical as far as quality is concerned. You should easily be able to listen to AIFF files with pretty anything — and in any case, AIFF format is easily converted in WAVE format, with no loss of quality.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2018
  11. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
     
  12. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    As I said, I listed all the equipment involved — you had all the information.
     
  13. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
  14. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    For the third time: I provided in detail all the information needed.
     
  15. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    Might as well put you on my ignore list. Pointless circular argument!
     
  16. bwalk63

    bwalk63 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Champaign, IL
    agreed , could have just listed it after the question, could have saved 4 posts saying he did
     
  17. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    Actually, Classicrock could have saved half a dozen of posts (his reiterated questions and my repeated answers) if only he had read the detailed list I wrote exactly where it was meant to be — in the relevant post.
     
  18. Calm down lads
     
    robegian and bwalk63 like this.
  19. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    Recently I inspected the two 96kHz 24bit AIFF's recorded from the Schiit Mani's and the Monacor SPR-6's outputs (Samurai - 1.aif and Samurai - 2.aif) through a frequency analysis tool and this confirms visually that the Monacor's definitely features a stronger presence of high frequencies.

    This image is a section of the Mani's sampled audio, this one shows the same music section but from the SPR's sampled audio.

    Finally, this is an animated GIF showing the two spectrum displays in sequence.
     
  20. Benzion

    Benzion "Cogito, ergo sum" Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY
    For God's sake, you're talking about a phono stage - an analog device, and you're using digital files as some sort of proof. It's like discussing the tactile texture of brush strokes on an old oil painting by looking at a black-n-white Xerox copy of it.

    Use your ears! I used mine, and my ears tell me the Monacor is mediocre. I still own it - I use it as a temporary stand-in, would not put it to daily use in one of my full systems. And I don't need the "oscillating spectral analyzing Big Hard-on Collider" thingy to prove my ears wrong.
     
    PGdrumming likes this.
  21. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    Those "digital files" are recorded and measured events. It's called science ;-)

    Of course I used my ears first, and then I used "science" to check the results. As I work professionally in multimedia, analysing audio is a common and quite straighforward process, and if you can read those diagrams, they tell a lot.
     
  22. Benzion

    Benzion "Cogito, ergo sum" Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY
    No science will tell me something sounds good when my ears tell me it doesn't. In audio - it's quite common. If you look at the scientific specs, SET tube amplifiers should sound like crap - there's so much distortion. Yet, when properly executed and tuned by ear they sound magical, and people pay a lot of money for all that distortion.

    Science still has found no equal substitute for a good pair of ears when it comes to tuning pianos.
     
  23. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    But my ears and science tell that the Monacor has a stronger presence in high frequencies — which is not a good thing per se, of course.

    Besides, my ears and science confirm that the Monacor has good dynamics too.

    My ears tell also that the Monacor sounds rather good. Science can't though ;-)
     
  24. Benzion

    Benzion "Cogito, ergo sum" Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY
    Ears are subjective, we all hear differently.
     
  25. robegian

    robegian Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    Of course — as these overly long exchanges testify ;-)
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine