Music Hall Cruise Control 33/45 RPM Outboard Control & a 1st-gen Linn LP12

Any forum members have experience with this product:

Music Hall Cruise Control 33/45 RPM Outboard Control?

Here is the Amazon link:

http://www.amazon.com/Music-Hall-Cruise-Control-2-0/dp/B004OAIUK4

I have downloaded the pdf of the owner's manual, which only speaks to Music Hall TTs.

An email to Music Hall's Leland Leard ("Will this speed control device work with a Linn LP12 that has the original 60hz motor ["1st generation" LP12]?") received this brief reply:

"The speed control should work fine with the early LP12."

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Of course, I'd love to hear if any SHf members have first-hand experience?

Your replies are much appreciated!

Cheers, Chaz

 

Um . . . bump?

 

It probably WON'T work with the LP12, since it is 16v. The Clearaudio Synchro and VPI SDS are designed to operate the 110V motor. For 45 rpm, on the internal circuit board within the LP12, the capacitor's value for the second winding would have to be bypassed (switchable) to a (lower?) value, so the motor will run smoothly, otherwise, the second winding will be out of sync and cause a vibration at the 81hz frequency. It might sound a bit complex, but that's the best way of doing it. I do remember something about the Heed Orbit power supply, but have no idea how that would work.

Alternatively, if one wants a fixed speed 33 and 45 speed Hercules II, they are available in 60hz form (as well as the common 50hz), just PM me for further details.

 

Thank you, Paul, for your time and the analysis.

(BTW, I haven't forgotten about the Hercules II. It just seems likely to be the source of much frustration--I'm not the handiest with a soldering iron, for instance. Nonetheless, I have acquired a second LP12 crossbrace [drilled for the Valhalla], just in case. . . .)

On another forum, I did find a couple of Thorens TT owners who were using the Music Hall CC to good effect (with TD-150s, IIRC). Does that change your opinion about whether the CC could work with my LP12?

Thanks again,
Chaz

 

The Cruise Control has a 120v output in addition to the 16v output. Just make sure you buy it from somewhere you can return it if it doesn't work.

 

Whether the unit has low or high voltage AC outputs, the problem I see is that it is still just a regular old two wire variable frequency AC supply. The motor in most AC turntables, including most Linn Sondeks, is actually a synchronous four wire, two phase (quadrature) unit that is opersted on single phase power by using a run capacitor.

The key to smopoth operation in this setup is the correct value of motor run capacitor. This varies with frequency, so it is correct at one frequency only.

The more sophisticated systems like the Linn Lingo generate quadrature power, or what used to be known as two phase power, when utilities offered two phase power. (It was replaced with three phase power because that is smoother and more efficient.) If I am not mistaken the Lingo is actually built around a Robert Pease natSemi tech note and generates triangle or sawtooth waves rather than sine waves. I have never had one to play with and so do not know that as fact but several people have said that.

Some time ago I wrote a thesis on piano tuning and had to vary a recording in pitch by a small amount, thirty to fifty cents. I used a piano tuning record (yes, there were such things), a record changer pulled from a defunct console, and my father's Crown stereo amp with a HP sine wave generator and counter. It worked fine to vary it by that much but significant changes were accompanied by growling and shaking of the motor.

The Lingo and other commercial four wire units run this motor at 45/33rds of rated speed to change speed without pulley change.

 

Never heard that one before. Got a link to the paper?

jeff

 

In case anyone is wondering, the Music Hall Cruise Control 2.0 DOES work on the vintage Thorens models such as TD-160, TD-150, TD-165, TD-166, TD-166 MKII and TD-160 Super. Basically, any with the 120v/60hz ac synchronous set up. Will NOT work with the auto-shut off models: 145, 146, 147. Will NOT work with walwart models. Will NOT work with TD-125/126. Installation is much more simple than with a Mose-Hercules...just plug the ac cord into the back of the Cruise Control and set the belt to 45rpm. That's it! On the 3 models I have tried, all were dead on at both 33 and 45. It did start at both 33 and 45 (Mose-Hercules needed a push at 45) but it takes a few rotations to get there at 45. Would advise starting at 33, then switching. Consistent with my listening experience with all speed controllers/power supply upgrades, the use of the Cruise Control helps the music to just jump right out the groove. There's a vividness that made almost every record I played more involving. Across genres. At $299 this should be a serious upgrade consideration for Thorens tables cited above.

 

I have a friend who uses one with his Ariston RD11s. Not only does it give some speed adjustment, but also the motor runs quieter. I'm planning on buying one to use with my RD11s and am thinking I could also use it with the Rek-O-Kut B-12H as well then?

 

Good info and endorsement, Dave. You sold me a TD-160 Super (thanks again, still loving it), but I swear it had a wall wart (can't check it right now). Am I mis-remembering or misunderstanding your comment? This sounds like a great upgrade to get in the future if will work with my table.

 

Yes, some Supers came with wallwarts...

 

Thanks for the info Dave. I might pick one up for my AR XA.

John

 

Just tested the Music Hall Cruise Control 2.0 on a Thorens TD-160 Super with Wallwart! It works superbly! So, since the 166MKII has the exact same supply, it will also work on that! Great news!

 

x2

I have had one for a year or so. Works great on a Sota Comet III.

 

Awesome! This makes me happy. You plug the Cruise Control into the wall and use the umbilical cord into the TT?

 

Yes, umbilical on the wallwart models and the AC cable on the ones with that.

I am selling them for a limited time on Vintage Thorens with a new belt and free shipping. I loved what they did so much, I immediately applied to become a Music Hall dealer...

Dave
www.vintagethorens.com
www.vinylnirvana.com

 

Bumping this thread. I bought one about a month ago and it works with my Pro-ject Perspective by using the DC umbilical from the unit to my 45 rpm motor. No more having to switch between 33 and 45 motors is one advantage. The sound quality did change with regard to soundstaging. I was playing a Lou Rawls record and during the song his voice all of a sudden sank back into the music (not sure if that's a good thing). My Perspective played fast with just its wall wart powering the motor and now it plays closer to 33 1/3. I read that one could test LP speed by trying to match the speed with a CD, which I did, in addition to using strobe discs. The Cruise Control slowed the speed down, again much closer to 33 1/3, but was still slightly faster than a CD but it took about a minute for LP speed to pass CD speed. With my current Cruise Control true 33 1/3 rpm lies between 33.2 and 33.3 as indicated by the unit. I'll still keep it around. For a more accurate speed controller maybe that Phoenix Engineering tach and control unit would be better. I was going to use the Cruise Control to speed up my Marantz 6100 but apparently it doesn't have enough voltage for the AC motor in the 6100. Granted, matching CD and LP speeds might not be the most accurate way to test whether a turntable spins at true 33 1/3 rpm, but the strobe discs I used didn't seem to indicate true 33 1/3 rpm either.

 

For $20 you can monitor speed in real time of actual music, not a test LP or a stroboscope with this.
If you order from China, it is more like $10, but you wait a while if you are US-based.
If you feel that one sample per full RPM is not enough, put on 4 magnets and do the math.
Or spend $72 on this one, and it will do the math for you and offer more decimal point granularity.

Without a variable PSU, I do not believe my pitch pots can dial in well enough to warrant more decimal places, so am happy with the unit below. Not sure how your Cruise Control is stepped and if more decimal points would help or frustrate you...

I put my magnet on my record clamp so clearance is not an issue [a revolution is a revolution, right?], I hang the sensor from above on a telescoping arm, so can move it out of the way easily.

 

Would the Cruise Control work with a stock AR-ES1 ?

Thanks !

 

Yes on ES1.

Note, recently had an issue working on a Thorens TD160 Super. Will report back when that is resolved. For now, avoid use on Thorens with wallwart.

 

It works with my TD 160 Super you sold me--what issue did you have?

 

Not sure why, but one customer reported it not working. I took it as a return. I don't have any wallwart models here to re-test, but from mow on, with every one that comes in, I'm going to test and test and test. See if there's a configuration that won't work.