Never Mind The Bollocks, Here's the Sex Pistols Song by Song Thread

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Musicman1998, Feb 26, 2018.

  1. yarbles

    yarbles Too sick to pray

    Location:
    Darkhan
    So, who did sound and look like punk rock? The Misfits? :laugh:
     
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  2. KeninDC

    KeninDC Forum Resident

    Location:
    Virginia, USA
    I get it. Nothing is punk (including The Clash, Ramones, Pistols, Stiff Little Fingers, Generation X...). Yet everything is punk (like the New York Dolls, Stooges, Lou Reed, and maybe even Bob Wills and his Texas Playboys). Let's not let an overly-academic and taxonomic debate (or worse, a lecture) derail this thread, or we risk...

    [​IMG]
     
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  3. 4011021

    4011021 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brazil
    The concept of "punk rock" being a kind of music that should be written and played according to some rules or patterns didn't exist in 1976 or 1977. "Punk" was a very eclectic movement. What do Television and Ramones have to do with each other sound wise? Nothing. They're both punk though.

    It was more interesting back then, I believe. By the time Never Mind The Bollocks came out, punk as an eclectic esthetic movement was already dying. From its ashes, post-punk, hardcore punk, new wave and oi-street-punk were being born. And all these movements ended a few years later.

    You can still form a punk rock band but that movement is long gone. Paradoxically, to form a punk rock band now you need to follow rules that didn't exist back when the OG punks came out.
     
  4. Randoms

    Randoms Aerie Faerie Nonsense

    Location:
    UK
    I think most of McLaren's manipulation came afterwards, when he tried to claim responsibility for a lot of events that were actually out of his control and largely nothing to do with him.

    Whoever came up with signing for A&M outside Buckingham Palace does deserve some credit.

    Agree totally about John's intellect, and it's no surprise that he bailed.

    Punk or not, I've never tried to categorise music - I either like it or I don't. The Punk do it yourself attitude was great, but the very non-Punk attitude of being told what is good / bad and what you should, or shouldn't listen to, never sat comfortably.

    Who really cares if the Pistols were Punk or more akin to Cliff Richard with (bad) attitude? They made some great music.
     
  5. Musicman1998

    Musicman1998 That Wannabe Music Critic Thread Starter

    Location:
    Georgia
    I agree, and I hate how punk turned into another form of conformity, how you had to be this or that, and that’s not what punk was supposed to be.
     
  6. dlemaudit

    dlemaudit Forum Resident

    Location:
    France, Paris area
    Submission is the best thing they did in my opinion , quite unique and different from the rest and has that groove .
    Thanks Glen for that one .
     
  7. GodShifter

    GodShifter Son of the Morning Star®

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    In my defense, people asked for my opinion and I gave it. I, in no way, meant to steer the thread in a different direction or argue what is punk and is not. This thread is about this particular album and the songs it contains and should focus on that.

    Who cares what I think anyway ? As you were.
     
  8. 4011021

    4011021 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brazil
    This masterpiece deserves its own thread.
     
  9. GodShifter

    GodShifter Son of the Morning Star®

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    We should do that. It’d probably just be me and you but I’d enjoy it. I’ll come up with something and we’ll do it. Seriously.
     
  10. Randoms

    Randoms Aerie Faerie Nonsense

    Location:
    UK
    We asked for your opinion, and you gave it. I've also mentioned that not all Punks liked NMTB (or the Sex Pistols), but agree the discussion is predominantly about the album and songs.

    Interesting to see where Submission falls, as a number will have heard it first on the one sided single.:D

    What a friendly and civilised thread this is!
     
  11. DTK

    DTK Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    Jeez, I'm listening to my one copy. Canadian vinyl from '77, sounds like pure mud.
     
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  12. 4011021

    4011021 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brazil
    For some reason, US and Canadian LPs never sounded so good. CDs, however, are among the best
     
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  13. Veni Vidi Vici

    Veni Vidi Vici Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    Members of the Damned said NMTB sounded like Bad Company, and scorned the Clash debut as having a folky production. It was a glorious era of backbiting as well! I also feel that HNSNSN is an undeniable punk classic, for the record.
     
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  14. Randoms

    Randoms Aerie Faerie Nonsense

    Location:
    UK
    I do remember an interview with Captain Sensible (can't recall if it was regarding Anarchy, GSTQ, or NMTB) where he said that he laughed when first hearing the song, because it was so slow. Even then as a 14 year old, I thought, "so what"!
     
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  15. redsock

    redsock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Reminds me when I first heard the Dead Kennedys. Summer of 1979. I was 15. I read somewhere that this new band was so abrasive and pretty much the most wild, insane, nasty NOISE you could ever hope to hear. ... So I bought the "California Uber Alles"/"Man With The Dogs" 45. Brought it home, put it on, and prepared for the onslaught. ......... I liked it, but I was also mystified because I could hear plenty of pop music in those songs.
     
  16. dsky

    dsky Little Blue Light

    Location:
    Fukuoka
    I don't agree with this statement at all. East Bay Ray and D.H. Peligro were also, I would say well beyond, pretty decent musicians but the Dead Kennedys are one of the iconic punk bands. The whole "punks can't play" or in this case "punks shouldn't be able to play" thing is lame.

    I totally agree with you that Submission is one of the best tracks on the LP, though along with Problems, with the No Future version of New York being my favourite Pistols' track. The hits on NMTB, particularly Anarchy, tend to be my least favourite, but that may just be over exposure.
     
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  17. Musicman1998

    Musicman1998 That Wannabe Music Critic Thread Starter

    Location:
    Georgia
    And Television, those are some great players as well, and if they count, then Husker Du And the Minutemen had some solid chops as well, and Topper Headon, as mentioned before.
     
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  18. GodShifter

    GodShifter Son of the Morning Star®

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    But would you agree that musicianship was not an important aspect of punk? Punk was supposed to be a rebellion to progressive rock and all the trappings of foo foo rock stars. Were there good musicians that played punk rock? Absolutely there were (Captain Sensible is a good example; East Bay Ray a better one), but the idea of punk was to spit in the face of the establishment; whether that be wanky musicians or anything else.

    ::sigh:: I seriously did not mean to derail this thread with this kind of stuff. I truly apologize to @Musicman1998.
     
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  19. Musicman1998

    Musicman1998 That Wannabe Music Critic Thread Starter

    Location:
    Georgia
    Not a problem, I like these sidetracks, they make the threads more interesting.
     
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  20. DirkM

    DirkM Forum Resident

    Location:
    MA, USA
    And to his credit, Lydon (in his autobiography) addressed this very issue. He said that everyone who dressed or acted like the Pistols was missing the point.
     
  21. DirkM

    DirkM Forum Resident

    Location:
    MA, USA
    I think that the key to punk was to not value musicianship over everything else. In other words, it didn't matter if you played well or if you played poorly. What mattered was your attitude (in particular, if you avoided the 70s rock trap of sinking into, "Ooh, look at me!" guitar god heroics).

    That's why the "punk" banner was wide enough to encompass acts as diverse as the Pistols, The Jam, Buzzcocks, Elvis Costello, Joy Division/Warsaw, X, etc. You could have the idiotic brutality of Sham 69, or the virtuosity of Television. They were all honest and exciting in their own ways, and in a way that completely upended everything that rock had stood for in the previous decade.
     
  22. Standoffish

    Standoffish Don't you dare call me an ostrich!

    @GodShifter , your input is always welcome. I think I mentioned it in another thread, but these song-by-song threads would be boring if everybody always agreed.

    My Punk Rock phase was in the mid-80s, so I was late to the party. For me, punk was about snarling at the world and rejecting mainstream music. It was also about putting a Black Flag cassette into your Sony Walkman and skating...hopefully the cops wouldn't catch you :hide:.
     
  23. nodeerforamonth

    nodeerforamonth Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Diego,CA USA
    I never have anything to add that anyone else hasn't already said, so here's my ratings, j:

    Holidays: 10/10
    Bodies: 9.3/10
    No Feelings: 9.2/10
    Liar: 9/10
    Problems: 9.8/10
     
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  24. Musicman1998

    Musicman1998 That Wannabe Music Critic Thread Starter

    Location:
    Georgia
    God Save the Queen:

    We conclude the first side with God Save the Queen, the band’s second single released to coincide with the Silver Jubilee. The song started out as a demo called No Future, and then John got the idea to turn into an attack on the British Empire. Although it outsold the #1 song at the time, Rod Stewart’s “I Don’t Want To Talk About It”, it was kept off the number one spot on the charts.
    Steve kicks the tune off with this dirty, irony riff that really makes the song, while John spits blood in his scathing critique of the monarchy, he is done with them, done with the empire, done with being kept down, and it shows through with every word, and while saying “f*** the government” would not mean much now, holy hell, did he have some serious balls writing this song in 1977, and from what I understand, some members were attacked in public for this song.
    This song is fantastic, one of my favorites on here, this was actually the very first Sex Pistols song I heard, and I am glad I did hear it.
     
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  25. Musicman1998

    Musicman1998 That Wannabe Music Critic Thread Starter

    Location:
    Georgia

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