New Hendrix cd "People Hell and Angels" coming in November

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Big pete, Sep 6, 2012.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Maidenpriest

    Maidenpriest Setting the controls for the heart of the sun :)

    Location:
    Europe
    I am begining to wonder whether they actually have the master tape to the brilliant 'lifelines' version ??
     
  2. dino77

    dino77 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    But that's no mystery. Aside from Billy or Noel possibly they were not up to scratch for such a time-consuming and frustrating process and likely not interested. Mitch overdubbed a new drum track to "Somewhere" in 1971 with Kramer and did a terrible job (this is the version on the purple box of course). Douglas asked Mitch to overdub a drum track to "Stepping Stone" for "Voodoo Soup" and Mitch declined. Check out the overdubs by Mitch and Noel that Chas Chandler supervised in 1987; that is not quality playing.
     
  3. dino77

    dino77 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    It seems the Crash Landing version was created from the 1971 version with the Mitch overdub, if that is any clue.
     
  4. Lownote30

    Lownote30 Bass Clef Addict

    Location:
    Nashville, TN, USA
    They must have the lifelines version multitracks, or they wouldn't have been able to pull the vocals off of that take of the song and put them on the other instrumental version for the EH VoN. The Lifelines mix has boosted bass frequencies in the guitar to make up for not having a bass track, but it's the same take that EH pulled the vocals from.
     
  5. Lownote30

    Lownote30 Bass Clef Addict

    Location:
    Nashville, TN, USA
    If Buddy's original drum part was erased, I would guess that it happened during the production of Crash Landing rather than when Mitch did the 1971 overdub.
     
  6. dino77

    dino77 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    Why is that? Just wondering.
     
  7. slane

    slane Forum Resident

    Location:
    Merrie England
    I'm sure I've read that Mitch's drums erased Buddy's original part, can't remember where. Also the same thing on 'Stepping Stone' and 'Room Full Of Mirrors'. For the latter, I read that Kramer had to use a rough mix for the 'Rainbow Bridge' album because Mitch made a failed attempt to improve the drums, which erased Buddy's parts. So the multitracks don't include the original parts IIRC, a reason Douglas overdubbed new drums on SS and RFOM on his 'Voodoo Soup' album.
     
  8. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    Well, when it came to Crash Landing, Douglas did not feel Hendrix's original sidemen had the skill set to do the intricate work he felt needed to be done to craft new recordings out of the outtake material. That is why he chose skilled session players. My impression is that he never considered asking Billy, Noel or Buddy to get involved - so, I don't think it was ever an issue of those guys having interest or not. And while Mitch may have been asked to lay down a drum track for Voodoo Soup (almost 20 years later), it is doubtful he was ever considered for Crash Landing overdubs based on Douglas' lack of respect for talent of Hendrix's original sidemen.
     
  9. Lownote30

    Lownote30 Bass Clef Addict

    Location:
    Nashville, TN, USA
    I just feel like Douglas would more likely do something like that. He had little care for what was already on the tapes.
     
  10. Lownote30

    Lownote30 Bass Clef Addict

    Location:
    Nashville, TN, USA
    If Buddy's drum track was erased by Mitch's on Stepping Stone, that was while Hendrix was alive. Also, Room Full Of Mirrors does not sound like a rough mix to me at all! Having a drummer do new parts on both of those songs was tragic to me when I heard Voodoo soup. Yes, the drum parts overdubbed were nice and steady, but lacked the groove that Mitch and Buddy had in a big way. Both songs sounded so sterile on Voodoo Soup with those new drum parts. I think the drums that were already there are great, and I'm glad we're back to Mitch on those (even though Buddy would have been fine as well).
    Whenever it happened, regarding Somewhere, I don't think that song was worth overdubbing any drum part onto. Hendrix abandoned it for a reason called Earth Blues (at least lyrically).
     
  11. slane

    slane Forum Resident

    Location:
    Merrie England
    I recall Kramer saying that he wasn't happy with the drum sound on RFOM, saying it was too 'squashed'. Maybe that was the reason they tried to overdub Mitch. I think the original session (including Buddy's drums) was produced, ironically, by Alan Douglas.

    I agree that Hendrix recycled 'Somewhere' in 'Earth Blues', not sure for the better though (song wise).
     
  12. BIG ED

    BIG ED Forum Resident

    Just The Facts, Jack!

    On this release (topic) please.
    My eyes hurt from all this what-was-done-previously EH/Douglas bashing & I'm not even a fan of either.
     
    ranasakawa likes this.
  13. Doctor Flang

    Doctor Flang Forum Resident

    Location:
    Helsinki, Finland
    According to McDermott, the multitrack of Stepping Stone has both drum tracks.
     
    Lownote30 likes this.
  14. SoundAdvice

    SoundAdvice Senior Member

    Location:
    Vancouver
    These names are familiar to you?

    • Jimmy Maeulen – percussion on tracks 1, 3, 5, 6, 7 and 8
    • Jeff Mironov – guitars on tracks 2, 3, 4, 5 and 7
    • Allan Schwartzberg – drums on tracks 2, 3, 4, 5, 7 and 8
    • Linda November – backing vocals on track 3
    • Vivian Cherry – backing vocals on track 3
    • Barbara Massey – backing vocals on track 3
    I've seen Hendrix fans refer to them as "The Gloria Gaynor Experience" since, IIRC, they were her backing band at the time.
     
  15. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    There are plenty of studio session players that I am not familiar with that have reputations of being able to work with a wide-range of studio material, and who quite possibly have professional training. I don't know the resume's of Mironov, Maeulen, and Schwartzberg, but I would guess they had reputations and experience in the studio in handling a major overdubbing and song recreation process. Perhaps they simply made it easy for producers to control the process. Again, it was Alan Douglas who felt he needed studio pros. I assume those couple of guys were experienced studio session players (no sure why you posted names of background vocalists). I am in no way defending Douglas' vision and reasoning. But, clearly he felt some of Jimi's guys were not up to the task.
     
    dino77 likes this.
  16. Judge Judy

    Judge Judy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY, USA
    Schwartzberg was in one of the later lineups of Mountain, I believe.
     
  17. SoundAdvice

    SoundAdvice Senior Member

    Location:
    Vancouver
    Were the royalty lawsuits from Noel/Mitch a factor in the who/why questions regarding those Douglas albums?

    Noel said he was promised that no "new" JHE albums would be created with his playing on it.
     
  18. SoundAdvice

    SoundAdvice Senior Member

    Location:
    Vancouver
  19. Maidenpriest

    Maidenpriest Setting the controls for the heart of the sun :)

    Location:
    Europe
    Probally yes but people like to overlook this fact !
     
  20. dino77

    dino77 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    So what? That's a red herring. Those guys were the top session players in New York in the mid 70s. That's why they played on many records. That's why they were hired for one Gloria Gaynor album and one Hendrix album. It does not mean they were "disco musicians".
    Schwartzberg plays on Peter Gabriel's first solo album, for example. Does that make him a prog rock musician? :)
     
  21. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    Has it ever been disclosed as to what the details were behind Noel and Mitch selling off their future royalties for bulk payments (IIRC, it as $300K a piece)? My impression is that both musicians sold off future claims for a large lump sum (yes, $300K was a lot of dough back in the early '70s when Hendrix recordings were not selling in huge quantities), but I never have seen anything where deals were struck that no additional recordings with their presence would ever be released. A label never would have made that deal.
     
  22. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    Agreed. If you look at Mironov's career credits, the guy has spent 30+ years laying down guitar parts on a wide-range of projects. Clearly the guy was a skilled session pro, a hired gun willing to get a paycheck for any project that came his way. McDermott interviewed Mironov for his Setting The Record Straight book and Mironov basically tells the tale of how difficult it became working on the Hendrix material because most of it came from long jams and incomplete songs where there was a lot of pressure to recreate tempo and recreate Hendrix's guitar parts. Let's face it, as much as we respect what Noel, Billy Cox, and Buddy Miles did with Hendrix - it is certainly feasible that those guys may have had significant trouble working within the technical confines of a major overdub/reconstruction recording process that required precision versus when they were playing live takes/jams with Hendrix in the studio.
     
    tdgrnwld likes this.
  23. SoundAdvice

    SoundAdvice Senior Member

    Location:
    Vancouver
    Press "year" and the album credits will switch to proper chronology.
     
  24. SoundAdvice

    SoundAdvice Senior Member

    Location:
    Vancouver
    Noel said he only got $30,000. I think Mitch got $50,000 or $100,000.

    Keep in mind they were getting nothing and had little resources to fight a record label.

    Noel probably lived off the publishing from the 2 songs.

    Mitch is a mystery to me as I don't know what he did for money/work for a good 20 years. Plus I'm surprised someone like Clapton of Santana never snapped him up.
     
  25. Maidenpriest

    Maidenpriest Setting the controls for the heart of the sun :)

    Location:
    Europe
    I always thought Mitch was in a really bad way with his alcohol addiction that prevented him from working and he wanted to withdraw from the music industry, such a shame :(
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine