Odd EAC Question

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by The Albino, May 3, 2014.

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  1. The Albino

    The Albino New Member Thread Starter

    Hey:

    This is a little odd but Why is it that if I copy a CD with Nero BR 2011 and then re rip that CD with EAC, AccurateRip does not recognize it where it did with the original, and it has different CRC values than with the original CD rip? Oddly enough with the cue tools CUETools DB Plugin V2.1.3 it does recognize the copy with accurate rip 683/703. This is with the Pink Floyd discovery set The wall cd 1. (btw not fake bought at wallmart)

    I have noticed it doesn’t do this every time. I have the Beatles original studio albums set (again authentic) and if you copy one of those and re rip one of those it reads it like the original CD and with the same CRC values…


    It also says it can be repaired with cue tools. Can someone tell me or point me in the direction to do this if it is incorrect (Curious). Or is it a good rip with maybe dif gaps? And if that’s the case why does cue recognize it?



    AccurateRip summary



    Track 1 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [9087E9CD], AccurateRip returned [6ECBB718] (AR v2)

    Track 2 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [7830F215], AccurateRip returned [0B9CC31C] (AR v2)

    Track 3 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [BB5FCFD6], AccurateRip returned [03739E5C] (AR v2)

    Track 4 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [ED98EB8D], AccurateRip returned [7BF67BB1] (AR v2)

    Track 5 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [E2459B1F], AccurateRip returned [FF9E4CF7] (AR v2)

    Track 6 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [ABC58C1A], AccurateRip returned [CA83C527] (AR v2)

    Track 7 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [6A30D9C4], AccurateRip returned [8A10FD02] (AR v2)

    Track 8 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [37BE50EF], AccurateRip returned [4A74E824] (AR v2)

    Track 9 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [F6458E8C], AccurateRip returned [4F5075F3] (AR v2)

    Track 10 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [6F1BF5EA], AccurateRip returned [A20CB2E8] (AR v2)

    Track 11 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [E603EA7E], AccurateRip returned [BC0815CE] (AR v2)

    Track 12 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [48BF237D], AccurateRip returned [A6B10E2C] (AR v2)

    Track 13 cannot be verified as accurate (confidence 200) [7C27FFDD], AccurateRip returned [7D8F6EED] (AR v2)



    No tracks could be verified as accurate

    You may have a different pressing from the one(s) in the database


    End of status report


    ---- CUETools DB Plugin V2.1.3


    [CTDB TOCID: n92sCGjxn.xYbNL18Fo8Zc6ziI4-] found, Submit result: already submitted

    [e5a7af4c] (683/703) Accurately ripped

    [f71110e2] (001/703) No match

    [632960e7] (001/703) No match

    [b2aaa9f2] (002/703) Differs in 58 samples @38:21:68-38:21:69

    [0ef4c30d] (004/703) Differs in 173 samples @29:49:10-29:49:11

    [c05ea30c] (001/703) No match

    [9dc18e75] (001/703) No match

    [3b055c89] (001/703) No match

    [e483d0e8] (004/703) No match

    [34777423] (001/703) No match

    [d2290a8a] (001/703) No match

    [cfb0dd58] (001/703) No match

    [0a019bc6] (001/703) No match

    [bd57a22d] (001/703) No match

    You can use CUETools to repair this rip.
     
  2. The Albino

    The Albino New Member Thread Starter

    nobody? I got a trophy for my 1st post....
     
  3. therockman

    therockman Senior Member In Memoriam

    I am sorry that I can't help you, but welcome to the forum. I come up with weird Accurate Rip results on occasion and I still do not know what they mean.
     
  4. GreenDrazi

    GreenDrazi Truth is beauty

    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    You’re mixing Secure Rip software with non-Secure Rip software - you should expect mixed results. Non-Secure software do not consider all the aspects of a CD (ex: Offsets) that Secure rippers do.

    To have CUETools repair files you select the “repair” pulldown option after selecting the Action\Encode button.
     
  5. Goratrix

    Goratrix Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Slovakia
    There are many versions of the disc out there, with different offsets. EAC only looks at the first record in the AR database when ripping, but not at all the others. So if your CD's offset is different than the offset of the first AR record, EAC will not confirm it as accurate. You can use CUETools (the application, not the EAC plugin) to verify the rip and it will show you all AR records with different offsets.

    But you shouldn't rip with Nero, burn and re-rip anyway, what's the point? Nero probably doesn't have read and write offset correction or secure ripping so you risk introducing errors into the whole process.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2014
  6. The Albino

    The Albino New Member Thread Starter

    Thanks for the replies.

    I have recently discovered EAC and before that would rip important CD's to archive them. I just noticed that the copied CDs acted differently with regards to the AR database the 2nd time around. Nero it seems to me shouldn't make a difference as far as the gaps go since it was a copy of the CD not a track by track rip. It should be an exact copy of the disc shouldn't it? It should rip the same in EAC as the original I would think?

    I got cue tools and it seems really interesting. I did notice to repair it has to be the original wav file uncompressed. I'll have to rip another one as a wav and play with that. So in the above rip log, it is accurate but just not the most popular and doesn't show up in the AR data base because of that?

    So now with EAC and Cue tools, what is the best way to archive a disc instead of ripping a copy of the CD. Is the above log how you all are archiving your important CDs? It includes a single wav file image, log and a cue sheet. I did notice it has to be kept in a different location than your music files because the media player includes it in the library. maybe store them on a flash drive or another location on the HD. what do you all do?

    again thanks for the replies.
     
  7. Beattles

    Beattles Senior Member

    Location:
    Florence, SC
    Check your Nero settings for Normalize. And are you ripping individual tracks and then burning, you could have a difference in the Gap (2 sec or 0 with Disc-at-Once) between tracks when re-burning the CD.
     
  8. Goratrix

    Goratrix Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Slovakia
    It is an exact copy, but unless you have both the read offset in your ripping software and write offset in your burning software set correctly, the copy will have a different offset. I suppose Nero does not allow setting a write offset, therefore your copy is offsetted. For more info, please read this:

    http://www.exactaudiocopy.de/en/index.php/support/faq/offset-questions/

    No, it doesn't need to be WAV, it can be any format supported by CUETools. But I think you are misunderstanding what "repair" means. The repair functionality is only for repairing errors in the data. A different offset is not an error.

    Again, as I explained, EAC does not look at the entire AR database when ripping. It only looks at the first entry, and if that first entry has a different offset, then EAC gives you the result that it gave you. When you use CUETools, and select "verify", it will verify your rip against the whole database. It would be best if you could do this and post the CUETools log so it can be explained better.
     
  9. boiledbeans

    boiledbeans Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    Yes, as Goatrix mentioned, the reason the CD-R does not give the same CRCs and AccurateRip results as the original CD is because the read offsets and write offsets are not configured properly when using Nero.

    You have two options to solve this.
    1) Rip and burn in two stages using EAC. The read and write offsets in EAC must be configured properly if you want the CRCs of the CD-R and original CD to match. The advantage of this method is using EAC to rip, which allows you to check for AccurateRip matches or rip errors. This is the method I use when I duplicate a CD.

    2) Since you have already ripped with Nero, so use CUETools and select "fix offset". You may need some trial and error in the "Advanced Settings -> Accurate Rip -> Fix Offset" section in order to force CUETools to fix the offset to the original values.
    The drawback here is that since you did not use EAC for ripping, the rip may have errors. You may need to "repair" first if errors are present, before using the "fix offset" option.

    Did you use the same CD drive for both cases? Some CD drives have a write offset of zero, so they can produce a CD-R with the same CRC values without additional settings.
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2014
  10. The Albino

    The Albino New Member Thread Starter

    I am starting to see the problem with the offset. I guess the main reason is so you can check your rips with others for accuracy. yes they were done on 2 separate drives, but the offset corection had different values on both neither said zero. too bad it cant just look at the file without relating it to a cd and tell you if there are any errors. thanks for pointing out the fix offset of cue tools. I guess there are 2 more questions if anyone has time.

    1. the cuetools plug infor EAC sometimes doesn't provide the info at the end of the eac log. wonder why? when it does and says something like 677/800 accurate rip. along with a list of non matches does that mean the top values relate to my rip? it doesn't come out and say your rip was.....

    2. instead of using a hard copy backup for my most important cd's that started these questions, what it the best way to save it as a file? with the image, cue sheet etc? having those allows one to burn the file to CD and have an accurate CD just like the original? can you tell me exactly what needs to be in that file? does the cd as 1 big wave have to be in there?

    I downloaded a few HDtracks and had some questions about those but think I'll start another post about those.

    you all are great.
     
  11. boiledbeans

    boiledbeans Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    For the offset, I'm referring to the "Write Offset". From my experience, it is zero by default. I think you're reading the "Read Offset", which usually is non-zero and non-adjustable (greyed out) if you're using AccurateRip. Both these offsets have to be configured properly if you want exact CDR duplicates with matching CRCs.

    To answer your 2 questions

    1) If you're using the CueToolsDB plugin which came default with EAC, that version is outdated. If your CD has a pregap, it gives a strange result (like your 677/800) and says it's not supported or words to that effect.

    An updated version of the CueToolsDB plugin is available here, all the way at the bottom of the page. This version works with pregaps.
    http://www.cuetools.net/wiki/CTDB_EAC_Plugin

    2) As long as you have the Cuesheet (which contains all the index locations), you can duplicate the CD. You can rip to Image+Cuesheet, where the Cuesheet references to a single image file. Or you can rip to individual tracks+Cuesheet. In this method, you need to generate the Cuesheet separately, "Action -> Create Cuesheet -> Current Gap Settings". This Cuesheet references to all the individual tracks.

    More info on the different types of Cuesheets here
    http://wiki.hydrogenaud.io/index.php?title=Gap_settings
    and
    http://wiki.hydrogenaud.io/index.php?title=EAC_and_Cue_Sheets

    When you want to burn a duplicate CD, go to "Tools -> Write CD", then load the Cuesheet and burn. Take note, the file must be in .WAV format for burning, not .FLAC.

    Personally, I save to Image+Cuesheet since there are less files to handle.
     
  12. The Albino

    The Albino New Member Thread Starter

    thanks for the replies. you all really helped me a lot!!!
     
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