opinions on abdication to a yamaha a-s2000?

wow - excellent feedback, lashing. well written, spot on about vintage gear (imho), and insightful. thanks!

can one compensate to a degree with tone controls? i'm not a bass-head by any means. however, i do treasure my highs (and mids, to some degree). i listen mostly to acoustic and electric jazz, so the thought of more seperation and detail is very appealing.

i heard the 2100 in tokyo last week through some b&w 600 series floorstanders and was pretty happy with what i heard (deatil and spatial depth not present in my sansui). i would have preferred a shade more heft down low (those mids and highs were, for me, right on the money) but i think it was being run flat so i imagined that a turn of the tone control knob would have easily resolved that.

 

I have not had the chance to demo the 2100. It certainly has the look.
One can compensate with the tone controls. On the 2000 the tone controls are completely bypassed in the middle. Its a dead stop in the middle and then turned either way you'll hear a cut and the pot come into the circuit. I personally don't like tone controls and prefer to run flat. I have played with it though and can dial in a much bassier overall sound that gets closer to vintage. I will add that the bass remains tight too. The "heft" as you say is probably what I was calling "bark". There is a certain lightness or politeness I guess overall. I wouldn't call it weak but it lacks that "felt in your chest" of the big silverface monsters. Yamaha has always been like this, Neutral to a fault, no exception here. I like the life of my old SX-1250. Its very pleasant and "human". However without doubt the AS2000 is purer. Two very different amps. I too think the highs and mids are very good. Many times modern hifi scoops the mids which bothers me. Not the case here. Very well balanced.

For Jazz I certainly would say the 2000 is better than any of my vintage units. Again for reasons of detail and separation. When highs are good they're real good on this amp. When bad this amp makes no cover up or apologies. Fortunately the EQ once again actually works and I have had a few recordings that simply had bad highs. Turning the treb down tamed this without knocking out all the treble or getting muffled. EQ does actually work well. I have not put a vintage unit back in my system since I got it. The detail has been worth the trade offs for me. Plus it runs so silent. No signal bleed, no noise of its own. Remote sucks if that matters to you. You have to be pretty close and aim carefully or the remote is useless.

I am running Sonus Fabers with it and the amp seems to have no problem despite its 90WPC rating. I get all the clean volume I need. That certain "heft" though might leave you wanting.

I paid $1500 USD at hifiheaven.

 

How did you get one for $1500? Their web site price is $1999, demos are $1599.

 

$1,500? i almost said yes when they offered me one at $1,299... (and yes, this was a demo/refurb/what have you)

 

I tried to buy a demo. They then offered me a new one at that price. Lower than published. So I said yes. Email or call them.
First one arrived damaged. Had issues. They replaced it. Both were factory sealed. First one must have been damaged in shipping. It kept going into protection and the MC didnt work. At least I learned this model has a very good protection feature. Anything goes wrong it shuts down immediately. The factory packaging is not enough for shipping in my opinion. If I were a retailer I'd be double boxing surrounded by peanuts. The weight was 57 lbs. You know what happens when shippers set down a 57lb box ... they don't set it down, they let it fall. I watched the Fedex guy do that with a box at my door yesterday. Fortunately it was just liquids that couldn't be harmed but the lazy bugger leaned over, dropped it a few feet on the porch and off he went. Wonder how many times UPS did that with unit #1 during its trip.

Anyway it cost me an extra $100 to send back the bad unit but I still give HifiH credit. They confirmed the issues and sent another without trouble. I did get totally raped by UPS for their "brokerage" fees as well. They are ridiculous with this. USPS charges $8. UPS charged me over $100 ... thats their cut not taxes. UPS needs to be avoided at all costs for cross border shipments. I insisted the replacement come Fedex because UPS almost always damages things, rips me off for brokerage and even leaves stuff 3 blocks away with my address on it. No kidding, another rant but that guy actually knows me from the stuff UPS leaves at his house for some inexplicable reason.

 

I'll throw my $0.02 in, and ask a question ...

I have a Yamaha A-700 (ca. 1984 vintage) that was my main amp for several years (driving 3-piece sat/sub '2.1' system, PASSIVE sub tho). I liked the A-700, nice lateral soundstage and good clarity, but not much if any 'depth' to the soundstage. A friend offered to let me try his '60s vintage Dynaco SCA-35 integrated (I bought it for $100 and delegated the A-700 to driving the sub only).

I'm curious if the new Yamahas have decent 'depth' and 'space' ... I'm tearing into my system this weekend, I may haul the A700 from the garage and try it again. My current system has some good depth/space and layering, along with lateral imaging etc.. I couldn't do without that.

I don't know if tone controls are a must, but seeing you like jazz and acoustic ... what about adding tubes to the mix? I recommended the Rogue Audio Sphinx to someone http://www.rogueaudio.com/Products_sphinx.htm ... but I haven't heard one ... reviews are very positive, and one can roll tubes to 'flavor' the sonics. This seems to be in the same price range as the Yamahas y'all are discussing.

Stereophile recently reviewed it too http://www.stereophile.com/content/rogue-audio-sphinx-integrated-amplifier and loved it ...

 

tone controls are positively a must for me. i'm far from a purist for uncolored sound - and my spatial restrictions are severe at current. so...

lashing; can you address depth and space?

fortunately, i've never had problems with UPS, but a good friend has - and they sound indentical to yours. that makes them a no-option if the choice of shipper is mine.

 

Need Phono? I just got a Parasound P 7 preamp, which has lots of bells and whistles, but is over your price point. Their new P 5 preamp might just be something you'd want to look at. It's $1095 list ($963 demo price from Audio Advisor) ... then add a power amp for $500 or something ... Parasound 2125v2 power amp, $591.25 'factory refreshed' (like my P 7). These carry the full as-new warranty too, pretty cool.

Would this combo sound better than the Yamaha integrated? Of course, I have no way of knowing! but - "spatial restrictions are severe at current" so the separates may not 'fit'. Marantz makes some well regarded integrated amps too in this price range, personally I'd look at those as well.

http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=1MAPM8005 MAY be a very good deal ...?

 

In spades! I've had the Yamaha in my system for around a month now and it's been a revelation. I don't know if it's synergy or what, but for the first time, I feel like "I've arrived". All the gear swapping over the years has paid off and I've reached a new plateau. No desire to change amp or speakers.

The Yamahas detail is fantastic, but it is not at all bright or harsh. A very major difference coming from a Brio-R is timbre. Instruments have so much more tonal color and life. A piano sounds like a piano. Brass sounds like brass. A drum head sounds fleshy.

Couldnt recommend the A-S2000 enough.

 

You started this thread three months ago. What did you end up buying?

 

I know that te AS 2100is about 1 grand over your price point BUT if anything performs like it is entioned in the reviews I read (from HiFi magazines I trust) and it delivers according to inner parts, build quality this is THE amp to get at that price point.
It is a lot like the mighty 5 grand AS 3.000 but they have cut a few corners to keep prices at bay-Plus the costs for research + engineering from scratch have already been paid with the AS 3.000. That is an ap that is truelly among the very best integrated solid state amps you can buy and ranks among the gear you can get from Luxmann or the entry level Accuphase stuff. The 2.10o comes pretty close to that and more points on value/performance ratings than any other tested integrateds in the ball park like the Musical Fidelity M6i, Cambridge audio 851 or Marantz SA 15.2 .

 

see post #24....

 

i doubt i'd be using one, but a sub can be run from the pre outs on a 2000, can it not?

 

I missed that.

Well, since you're still looking, are you sure you're no longer interested in a Marantz 22xx receiver. I've got lots of equipment, and right now I enjoy listening to my 2238b more than anything. Just sayin'.

 

i have a 2270...

 

I'm using one sub right now. Will be adding second for stereo subs

 

wow. perfect. so you're enhancing the low end. i swear - i feel *this* close....

 

I thought I needed the sub when I was using an amp with less watts. The Yamaha added a bunch of grip and impact so the sub doesn't feel as mandatory. Since I already had the sub, I figured why not hook it up. It's one of the inexpensive 8 inch sub from the Pioneer Andrew Jones line, so a second won't be much of an expense.

 

I used to have a 717 too. Great amp, very contemporary sound. I had enough of the visits to amp hospital as well and it went back in 2010 or so. Tried a few others, but it stacked up, from memory, quite comfortably with the Exposure 3010s, Leema Pulse and Harman's HK990 - all cracking amps.

The Yammy ought to be good, but do try a few others. Some find the Cambridge sound a little bright, but I've no experience of their gear beyond the (very clinical) DACMagic 2. Their later stuff is apparently excellent (Alan Sircom considered the 650A/650C pairing one of the systems of the year three or four years back), and I expect that prevails with the 851A amp.

Work out what you want or need from your amp, draw up a shortlist, see if you can listen to a few at home, then take it from there. Happy shopping!

 

Space and depth are strong point of the A-s2000. I have a hifi store near me that tried to sell me lots of different pieces in many price ranges. He frowns on Yamaha (doesnt sell it, we dont even have this line in Canada)

WHile I could not compare side by side - the Yamaha is very very good in the space and depth depts. I cant say I demo's anything that beat it. And I demo'd some fairly expensive units, concentrating on under 5k used and new. The Yamaha is very clean, great depth ... you hear everything.

 

thanks again. everything you've noted is right on par with what i heard in tokyo on the 2100.

 

I am very curious to hear the 2100 myself. If they improved the 2000 it must be a fine amp. HiFi publications shun the whole line. Thus resale is terrible.

 

well, i can't imagine it being a sea change over the 2000. and the soft resale works in my (our?) favor as buyers.... therefore, i'd be likely to snag a preowned 2000 at a good price. saw one on that e-auction site in the $700 range before i left for japan, but i was too scattered to give it a serious go.

 

$700!!!! man that's a giveaway. One thing to consider with used in Yammy fails huge in support. I mean they are absolutely terrible. In that way, a good dealer will be your salvation if a new unit goes bad. I contacted Yamaha when the first unit arrived bad and they were incredible jerks. Really bad response starting with irrelevant canned responses to pretty much telling me to shove it. They have one option - send it to NY. I talked to a repair guy that said Yamaha ships all their stuff to whoever bid the cheapest for repairs. So the units literally pile up until they have a container then off they go to whomever. Don't know if that's accurate but my local store said that's why they wont sell the stuff.

Buying from a good dealer turned out to be the right move for me. All dealt with at store level.

 

you raise a good point. otherwise i could find myself back in the perpetual drive to the shop that the sansui has been in...