OPPO BDP-95 Audiophile Universal Blu-ray/SACD/DVD-A player (part 2)

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by MilesSmiles, Nov 17, 2011.

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  1. tribby2001

    tribby2001 Forum Resident

    Errata:

    "Either directly converted to analog (XLR, analog outs) or converted to PCM (HDMI or optical/coax digital outs)."
     
  2. tribby2001

    tribby2001 Forum Resident

    The above DSD discussion applies ONLY to the SA-CD layer of a Hybrid SA-CD of course.

    Redbook is Redbook.
     
  3. SergioRZ

    SergioRZ Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Portugal
    Yes there is DSD-to-Analog direct conversion, and as far as I know the Oppo 95 can do it. And yes, it sure is DSD converted to analog by a DAC (one that is DSD-Analog capable of course).

    Directly converted to analog, or converted to PCM and then to analog, are two completely different things... PCM is still digital domain.
     
  4. SergioRZ

    SergioRZ Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Portugal
    Interesting as it is to discuss differences between DSD and PCM, I would really like to get some insight on my main question:

    I want to make sure I get "DSD-converted-to-Analog" output from the XLR balanced out, and not "DSD-converted-to-PCM-converted-to-Analog".

    If HDMI Audio is enabled, the PCM light goes on which should mean that the audio is "DSD-converted-to-PCM-converted-to-Analog". To avoid this, everytime I play a SACD I need to manually disable HDMI Audio.

    I'm trying to confirm if this is expected behavior and if indeed the Oppo is unable to output "DSD-converted-to-Analog" from the XLR outs when HDMI Audio is enabled.
     
  5. SamS

    SamS Forum Legend

    Location:
    Texas
  6. tribby2001

    tribby2001 Forum Resident

    PAGE 62

    5. SACD Output: To select audio output format for SACD. The options are:

    • PCM – SACD Direct Stream Digital (DSD) data is converted into multi-channel, highresolution PCM data. The converted PCM data is then output through HDMI or the internal DAC (Digital to Analog Converter) for the analog audio output ports. If you use a receiver that supports HDMI v1.1 to listen to SACD, please select this option. You may also want to select this option if you prefer the sound quality of the DSD-to-PCM conversion.

    • DSD – SACD DSD data is output over HDMI without any conversion. For the analog audio outputs, DSD data is converted into analog signal directly by the internal DAC. If you use a receiver that supports HDMI v1.2a with DSD over HDMI, or you prefer the sound quality of straight DSD to analog, please select this option.

    The conversion from "straight DSD to analog" occurs in the Oppo's Sabre ES9018 DAC. This is the option I would choose if I was using the XLR or any of Oppos analog outputs to listen to SACDs.
     
  7. GARCRA

    GARCRA Forum Resident

    Billy Joel, The Stranger, single layer SACD DSD

    With HDMI off, using XLR output, monitor reads, track type: SACD DSD

    With HDMI ON, using XLR output, monitor reads, track type: SACD PCM
     
  8. tribby2001

    tribby2001 Forum Resident

    :thumbsup:

    4. For users who only use the analog audio output, setting "HDMI Audio" to "Off" and "SACD Output" to "DSD" in the "Audio Format Setup" section of the setup menu will now maintain DSD output to the analog audio D/A converters. The previous firmware will force a conversion to PCM if the connected HDMI TV or A/V receiver cannot support DSD.

    Be aware there is a December 21, 2011 firmware release now:
    http://oppodigital.com/blu-ray-bdp-93/bdp9x-firmware-61-1219.aspx
     
  9. SergioRZ

    SergioRZ Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Portugal

    Thanks SamS!

    I have the latest FW that is currently available.

    This is similar to what I'm experiencing, but not quite the same because in my situation I do use both outputs.

    For music, I use XLR output only. But for movies, I like to have HDMI Audio going directly to my TV set (it makes it much easier for my daughter to watch movies without having to turn on any other components such as receivers).

    So, I have HDMI Audio set to "ON", HDMI Audio Format set to "AUTO" (this is in a different menu) and SACD Output set to "DSD".

    If I set HDMI Audio to "OFF", the PCM light goes away, SACD plays as expected and everything is normal.

    My guess is that the Oppo can't do both things at the same time when converting DSD (DSD direct to analog - XLR, and DSD to PCM - HDMI) so it goes with the only option that works on both outputs, that is to convert to PCM first, send that to the HDMI (bitstream) and simultaneously convert it to XLR analog out...
     
  10. tribby2001

    tribby2001 Forum Resident

    Yes, you are correct! Maybe in the next Sabre DAC iteration?
    I don't know any DAC which will convert both DSD > analog and DSD > PCM simultaneously.

    Time to go to work...
     
  11. SamS

    SamS Forum Legend

    Location:
    Texas
    You should be able to still get DSD to analog, as long as the TV is kept off. You can turn HDMI audio to ON. Try that and let us know.
     
  12. mcow1

    mcow1 Sommelier Gort

    Location:
    Orange County, CA
    Just out of curiosity. Have you tried changing "HDMI Audio Format set to "AUTO"" to bitstream to see what happens
     
  13. SergioRZ

    SergioRZ Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Portugal
    Yes I tried that, same result (PCM lights up).
     
  14. SergioRZ

    SergioRZ Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Portugal
    Indeed, if I keep the TV off I get DSD direct to analog as expected, even with HDMI Audio set to "ON" :righton:

    Thanks for that, now at least I know exactly how it works :)
     
  15. SamS

    SamS Forum Legend

    Location:
    Texas
    :thumbsup:
     
  16. mcow1

    mcow1 Sommelier Gort

    Location:
    Orange County, CA
    Funny that only happens with the XLR analog outs and not the RCA
     
  17. SamS

    SamS Forum Legend

    Location:
    Texas
    The behavior should be the same with both types of analog outputs. Although I will admit I have not done extensive testing with this particular situation.
     
  18. mcow1

    mcow1 Sommelier Gort

    Location:
    Orange County, CA
    Mine shows DSD with HDMI and the TV turned on while using the analog outs. Both on the TV and by no PCM showing on the front panel of the 95
     
  19. SamS

    SamS Forum Legend

    Location:
    Texas
    That's because you're running the HDMI through a receiver that supports DSD via HDMI, right? If so, your scenario is behaving as expected. The OPPO's HDMI stream is not forced to PCM because your receiver is not telling it "I can't take DSD", like a TV would.
     
  20. mcow1

    mcow1 Sommelier Gort

    Location:
    Orange County, CA
    That makes sense. Have to try it on my 83se. That's not hooked to a DSD capable receiver (yet)
     
  21. SamS

    SamS Forum Legend

    Location:
    Texas
    BDP-83 and 83SE behave differently than the '93/95 in this regard. With the 83/83SE, anytime you have HDMI directly connected to a TV, and the TV is ON, DSD output is forced to PCM.
     
  22. BIG ED

    BIG ED Forum Resident

    Resolution comes at a cost.
    All so, what you prefer too hear is what you prefer too hear.

    You are hearing the "limitations" of Red Book (vs. HiRez), warts & all.
    Even w/CD's there was always that chance the system would revel the failings of poor mastering/sources.
    The "cheap" Panny was colored more; therefore hiding/smoothing/roundingout ceedees weakness.
    Be happy you now have the resolution too now hear the diff & too take advantage of the Mc & B&W's.
    Get ready tho, too get rid of a lot of discs!!!
    :cheers:
     
  23. rgcoleman9

    rgcoleman9 Member

    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    I have about 100 hours on my BDP-95 and I've noticed the sound on vanilla Red Book CDs has gotten "sweeter." I guess it must be "burn in." I was never a believer, but I noticed the same thing with my Mc pre/power combo. That lean, bright sound slowly burnishes into a shimmering glow. Or something. Even my wife noticed the difference. Now, I'm a believer.

    Anyway, I'm happy to have a front end component worthy of the amps.:edthumbs:
     
  24. TarnishedEars

    TarnishedEars Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Seattle area
    I'd be surprised if the Oppo sounded better on Redbook than does the Esoteric. I tried a 95 out for a month in my system, burned it in for over 100 hours and finally returned mine quite dissappointed. I personally think that the 95 is a vastly over-rated player.
     
  25. rbbert

    rbbert Forum Resident

    Location:
    Reno, NV, USA
    Perhaps true, but still a very cost-effective choice given the available offerings. Much better than cheaper or similarly priced players, not as good as ones costing twice as much or more.
     
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