Outlaw RR2160 thread.*

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by BDC, Dec 6, 2017.

  1. drseid

    drseid Active Member

    Location:
    DFW
    I purchased the Outlaw BLSv2 RR2160 combo last week. Speakers arrived yesterday and the receiver arrived today. I'll be pairing the R2160 with Martin Logan Motion 40's channel A and Outlaw BLSv2's channel B. Noticed today that the RR2160 is now $849. Glad I bought last week.....
     
    DonnyMe likes this.
  2. cdash99

    cdash99 Senior Member

    Location:
    Mass
    They have a B stock unit for $749.
     
  3. nmesen

    nmesen Forum Resident

    Location:
    Golden, Colorado
    I have been having issues with my 3 month old outlaw 2160. The left channel randomly cuts out and there is an occasional loud pop when powering it on. I am exchanging it for a new unit but curious if any one has had similar problems? Outlaw customer support not been too helpful.
     
    PhilBiker likes this.
  4. JackG

    JackG Forum Resident

    Location:
    NJ
    Not heard of that issue, that sucks. Been about a year I've had mine with no issues. How have they been unhelpful, out of curiosity?
     
  5. nmesen

    nmesen Forum Resident

    Location:
    Golden, Colorado
    They told me to try a factory reset and for any further questions/issues I should go through Music Direct where I bought it. The reset works but I have to reset it every few days.
    Music Direct is swapping it out for another unit. Hopefully that fixes it.
     
    PhilBiker likes this.
  6. JackG

    JackG Forum Resident

    Location:
    NJ
    That's strange, glad MD is swapping it out. Does it happen if you wire the left speaker to the right channel, and vice-versa? Wondering if it's specific to the speaker or stays with that amp channel.
     
  7. nmesen

    nmesen Forum Resident

    Location:
    Golden, Colorado
    Yes I did test that. It moves to the right speaker if I swap the speaker wires L --> R and vice versa.
    I also tested all source settings (tuner, phono, etc) and it happens on all.
    I think I just got a dud.
    The Outlaw replaced a vintage Pioneer SX780 that I love so I was thinking of just going back to that.
    But spending the money to keep it running cleanly down the road seemed like a lot of work.
     
    PhilBiker likes this.
  8. I'm in the same boat as a lot of people in this thread - torn between the Outlaw RR2160 and the Yamaha A-S801. Mine is for a bedroom 2nd system, and will have an Oppo BDP-83 for CD/SACD, a Rega Planar 2 turntable and for speakers KingSound Princess (w/electrostat drivers, @ 83DB). I'd like to give some bass relief to the speakers - which are rated down to 45Hz - and connect an SVS-1000 sub. The Outlaw wins in this regard due to its bass management.

    The problem I'm having is that I have no way to listen to both units together. Or for that matter, listen to the Outlaw prior to purchase (I've heard the Yamaha, but admittedly not in the best of listening circumstances). Above all else, two-channel sound is most important to me and I wish I could have them side-by-side for a comparison.

    I do have the Outlaw 7700 amp in our home theater system, and am pleased with it. So I like the brand.

    If anyone has thoughts I'd love to read them!
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2018
  9. gwompek

    gwompek Forum Resident

    Location:
    Greenville, SC
    I had this exact same issue. Same response on support from Outlaw but they worked directly with me since I purchased from them. They replaced my first unit but my 2nd unit still had the problem. After the 2nd one they told me there was something in my chain causing the problem. Turns out they weren't wrong. I replaced my KEF LS50 with Wharfedale Diamond 225 and the problem has not come back. I know for a fact there was nothing wrong with the Kef as they worked flawlessly in two other systems, but something about them possibly in conjunction with fairly long speaker cable runs made this problem show up. I can't say for certain.

    I wish Outlaw would have worked a bit harder with me to identify root cause. At least I know I'm not the only one who has had this problem.
     
    patient_ot likes this.
  10. nmesen

    nmesen Forum Resident

    Location:
    Golden, Colorado
    Interesting. Thanks for the info.
    My speaker runs are < 15ft and I have B&W 604 towers. Hopefully the new unit will resolve the issues.
     
  11. Nonpoint

    Nonpoint Forum Resident

    Location:
    Raleigh
    I had both. Tough decision. Both great options. I ultimately kept the 2160 for the bass management capabilities (HP and LP filters) your referenced, slightly more powerful amp, and network streaming capabilities (although I ended up not using this feature very much). I think the build on the outlaw is slightly better (e.g., binding posts), but I never had a problem with the Yamaha and people on here seem to be having certain issues with the Outlaw.

    I do miss the usb dac on the 801. Not necessarily b/c of the sound quality, but it would lock in faster to play and didn’t require my iPad/phone to be plugged into a power source to play (I enjoyed this convenience from time to time). I thought SQ was really close but it has been almost a year. If you want to easily blend your sub (go 2.1) I think the Outlaw is a no brainer as the Yamaha only had the sub out cut at 90htz with no high pass filtering for the mains.
     
    Shawn and Hymie the Robot like this.
  12. mongo

    mongo Senior Member

    I steered a friend of mine to both the Yamaha S-801 & the Outlaw.
    He wanted to integrate a sub so I suggested the Outlaw looked to be superior for that.
    He went with the Outlaw and has been very happy.
    BTW, I don't know what you guys expect in the realm of troubleshooting when the gear is in your possession.
    All of the usual items are pretty simple to test on your own.
    Generally if something has gone wrong swapping it out is the only recourse.
     
    JackG and Shawn like this.
  13. gwompek

    gwompek Forum Resident

    Location:
    Greenville, SC
    I offered to take voltage readings as I'm a reasonably competent troubleshooter and have been working on amps for a dozen years. Definitely not an EE or even a real tech, but know my way around somewhat.

    Outlaw support said it would void my warranty which I was OK with, because I felt the issue was somewhere in my system and not necessarily with their amp. I just want to know what was causing the problem and why swapping speakers resolved it. The problematic set of speakers didn't have any issues in any of my other 3 systems.

    Ultimately they were not comfortable helping me out in that capacity, which I understand from a liability standpoint, but as a curious person I still want to know the source of the problem. They were not able to duplicate the problem in their shop so we might not ever know.
     
    patient_ot and mongo like this.
  14. mongo

    mongo Senior Member

    gwompek, that certainly is a strange issue you had.
     
    patient_ot likes this.
  15. BDC

    BDC Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Tacoma
    I just got an e-mail notice for an Outlaw black friday sale and decided to pull the trigger on a pair of their bookshelf speakers. Also I noticed that Outlaw also has out now a set of short floorstanding speakers at 4 ohms. They mention that the floorstanding speakers can be used along with the book shelfs which are 8 ohm. It must be OK to run both at the same time through the 2160? I know I can't run 4 spks @ 4 ohm.......but 2 @4ohm & 2@8ohm? Thoughts?

    I'll be contacting Outlaw and if I like the bookshelf speakers a lot I may buy a set of the floor standings, providing they can be all ran at once.
     
  16. BDC

    BDC Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Tacoma
    Update:
    I received my Outlaw BLSv2 bookshelf speakers today and did about 4 hours listening.
    I must note that I have hearing loss and don't consider myself qualified to recommend speakers, but I'll note my observations.

    1- Soundwise the 2160 loves to run at 4 ohms with four 8 ohm speakers together. In this regard the speakers were worth the money. The Outlaw speakers seem extremely sensitive to wall/corner proximity. The speakers have a switch on the back to get rid of boominess if sitting close to a wall or corner. My space is limited and moving 24 inches off the wall is not an option.
    I listened for seconds and engaged the switch (it sounded terrible unengaged)

    2-The Outlaws are hooked up to speaker to the speaker B outputs on the 2160, and I have Klipsch RF 25 floorstanding connected to A outputs. The Outlaws are sitting directly on top of the Klipsch.
    Running A or B speakers alone the latter plays much louder and fuller, which I'm not sure due to the speakers or receiver. It stand to reason that the Klipsch would be louder and fuller due to size. That said, when speakers A and B are ran together, all 4 seem nearer equal in volume. I not gonna try swapping A spks with B because it's a major pain in the azz getting behind my system to move wires around. I think the Speakers sound good together.

    3- the Outlaws sounded a lot better after 1-2 hours break in.

    4- Subwoofer gain adjustment is necessary if switching between speakers A/B/Both...I set my gain for a nice balance to run with A and B together. It required the gain to be turned up just a bit.

    To summarize, My objective was to run a 4 speaker system, I'm doing that and it sounds better than I had thought it would. I have a much improved soundstage...Again the 2160 soundwise loves running at 4 ohms. To my somewhat blown ears, this configuration sounds really good.
    The Outlaws seem to sound better the more they're played.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2018
    Shawn likes this.
  17. Rentz

    Rentz Forum Resident

    Location:
    Texas
    The outlaw BF sale has be considering the 2160 again, $750 with free shipping.
    Loads of features but some of the issues others had recent make me hesitate over the Yamaha or even a rogue or brio
     
  18. nmesen

    nmesen Forum Resident

    Location:
    Golden, Colorado
    I got my replacement outlaw a few weeks ago and have had no issues with it. So far so good
     
  19. Rentz

    Rentz Forum Resident

    Location:
    Texas
    i guess the price went up slightly for cyber monday its now 779 shipped free, might just holdout for a refurb yamaha deal.
     
    patient_ot likes this.
  20. xrqp

    xrqp Member

    Location:
    los angeles, ca
    LAPTOP USB OUT IS SUSPECT
    I think my weak link now is that I play FLAC from a laptop using digital USB into the back of the RR2160. I am considering buying one of those streamers that have less electronic noise than the laptop, like ultraRendu streamer or similar, and seeing if that is enough to let the RR2160 DAC shine. If it still is not satifactory, then I would think about a DAC. Has anyone improved there sound greatly with a straemer vs computer USB? If so, did you then find the internal DAC to be good?
     
  21. xrqp

    xrqp Member

    Location:
    los angeles, ca
    LAPTOP USB OUT IS SUSPECT
    I think my weak link now is that I play FLAC from a laptop using digital USB into the back of the RR2160. I am considering buying one of those streamers that have less electronic noise than the laptop, like ultraRendu streamer or similar, and seeing if that is enough to let the RR2160 DAC shine. If it still is not satifactory, then I would think about a DAC. Has anyone improved there sound greatly with a streamer vs computer USB?

    Most posts in this thread think the DAC is good, and a DAC upgrade would not make much difference. I am not qualified to weigh in on that, but both sides sound credible. Lately I am being influenced by Darko Audio and The Hans Beekhuyzen Channel. Do they seem credible to you too?
     
  22. unclefred

    unclefred Coastie with the Moastie

    Location:
    Oregon Coast
    You could try a usb to spdif convertor like the Schiit Eitr, or others. That will usually provide a cleaner better sounding result.
     
  23. xrqp

    xrqp Member

    Location:
    los angeles, ca
    thanks. From your tip, I started reading about the Eitr and it has many proponents, is only $180 and seems it may sound as good as a $900 to $1500 utlraRendu w power. But then it occurred to me I want to progress to where I use the ipad to control, with something like a NAS in another room. So that may put me back to a streamer, like utraRendu. But the Eitr price and simplicity of direct laptop that I areedy have set up, is tempting. Not looking forward to setup of ipad, NAS and streamer, but I want to get there eventually, if not now. I am probably deviating too much from the RR2160 topic now.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2018
  24. unclefred

    unclefred Coastie with the Moastie

    Location:
    Oregon Coast
    I haven't gone that route yet either, but I'm sure I will eventually. I'm not certain our wireless is fast enough here so that would mean long runs of ethernet or something.
     
  25. Esquared1

    Esquared1 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Barrington, IL
    Hello all, I could use a recommendation from the community. My set up, used 95% for vinyl:

    Outlaw RR2160
    Elac UC5
    Pro-ject Debut Carbon with accrylic platter upgrade
    MartinLogan ‑ Dynamo 700W 10" 600‑Watt (Not hooked up yet, X-Mas present :( )

    Considering the Pro-ject S-2 Phono
    Pro-Ject Tube Box S2

    Seems like many say the RR2160 build-in preamp is "pretty good". Question: will the Pro-ject preamp (or generally a tube phono preamp) be worth it? Will the difference be more like "OK, that sounds better" or "Holy crap, that is crazy great"?
     

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