Paul Simon - The Paul Simon Songbook. Why no US release?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by irwin69, May 16, 2017.

  1. irwin69

    irwin69 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    France
    I picked up a beautifully clean copy of the mono Paul Simon Songbook from a bargain bin a few weeks back to add to my growing collection of Simon & Garfunkel US and UK pressings.

    I already own the first pressing with matrix numbers 1A1-1 & 1B1-1 with the 33 labels. This copy was the second press with 33 1/3 label and A2/B2 matrix endings.

    The cuts are very different. The 1st press has the guitar and vocals both very central. At times they compete so much that there is distortion on my system. Whilst there is still some sibilance in the A2/B2 pressing the balance between voice and instrument is, to my ears at least, a real delight. I would rate this as a terrific example of just how delicate and spatial mono can sound.

    I decided to check out what the US pressings where like and, lo and behold, I learned that it was only briefly released in the States, seemingly as an import, before being withdrawn by Simon.

    Does anyone know the story behind this? And whether indeed only UK copies made their way to the US?

    And where does the Canadian version called 'The Sounds of Simon' fit into the story?
     
    mikrt17 and CrazyCatz like this.
  2. JamieC

    JamieC Senior Member

    Location:
    Detroit Mi USA
    AFAIK its mono only. As to why it was never released in the US, its because Paul didn't want it out here and mono only was not helpful. It IS however the link between Wednesday Morning 3AM and Sounds Of Silence.
     
    bluemooze, Jimmy B. and CrazyCatz like this.
  3. MicSmith

    MicSmith Forum Resident

    I think the UK copies remained on catalogue until the late 70s but that Simon was successful in getting Columbia to delete it over here. I can only assume he was disowning the album as he preferred the S&G treatments of the songs common to both. I wasn't aware that it was never issued in North America or why he was so against it. To me it's basic in content but nothing to be embarrassed about.
     
  4. JamieC

    JamieC Senior Member

    Location:
    Detroit Mi USA
    IIRC part of it was that he got no money for it. He did it when he was starving in England. It was done on the cheap.
     
    McLover likes this.
  5. lightbulb

    lightbulb Not the Brightest of the Bunch

    Location:
    Smogville CA USA
    In the context of Paul Simon's career, as a solo artist and with Art Garfunkel, it's interesting how he decided to limit and then eliminate distribution of this title, which explicitly gives him sole credit, and thus undivided attention for his compositions.
    Yet very deservedly so.

    I was reminded how Simon felt jealous after Garfunkel would get audience accolades after singing solo, live on "Bridge Over Troubled Water".
    An envious Simon would think, "that's my song, man"...

    "A Most Peculiar Man", indeed...
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2017
  6. tim_neely

    tim_neely Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Central VA
    I am pretty sure that the first official release of The Paul Simon Song Book in the U.S. was as part of the 1981 box set Paul Simon: Collected Works (Columbia C5X 37581).

    In the late 1960s or early 1970s, a U.S. bootleg emerged on a label called Silver Platter. Like some other 'legs of its era, it was sold in a white cover with the title rubber-stamped on the front.

    Of course, today it is easily found on CD in both Europe and the States.

    Simon recorded the album in England in 1965. At the time, Simon & Garfunkel was more or less on hiatus after Wednesday Morning, 3 AM had stiffed in 1964. Paul went to England, Art went to college. There was no guarantee that S&G would ever make another record together. Then "The Sounds of Silence," with its overdubbed electric guitar and drums, became a hit, and the rest is history.

    For the next year, Simon basically used Song Book as a demo album for the duo. There really wasn't any point in releasing it in the U.S. by then.
     
  7. irwin69

    irwin69 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    France
    There is a stereo version listed on discogs and this version has the 33 labels so would suggest an early pressing Roots Vinyl Guide

    Given that the album was allegedly recorded with one microphone for both voice and guitar I wonder what the stereo sounds like. Maybe CBS reprocessed it for stereo?
     
  8. The Hud

    The Hud Breath of the Kingdom, Tears of the Wild

    Isn't the stereo version what is on the CD?
     
  9. mikrt17

    mikrt17 Life has surface noise.

    Location:
    BROADSTAIRS UK
    Two microphones were used one for the voice and one for the guitar for the stereo the guitar was panned half left or half right with the vocal in the middle the studio didn't have stereo reverb only a mono plate which was panned centre so the stereo mix is very narrow
     
    MLutthans likes this.
  10. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    A stereo mix was actually released?

    The CD reissue notes the bonus tracks were remixed, but I've never heard a stereo mix of any of that material.
     
  11. mikrt17

    mikrt17 Life has surface noise.

    Location:
    BROADSTAIRS UK
    It was released in the UK in 1965 in mono and stereo on vinyl.
     
  12. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    But true stereo? Or reprocessed from the mono mix?
     
  13. Siegmund

    Siegmund Vinyl Sceptic

    Location:
    Britain, Europe
    He was never exactly 'starving' in England: he was making a decent living on the folk-club circuit, he was still picking up royalties on minor hits and his songwriting partnership with Bruce Woodley of the Seekers was reasonably successful. 1965-66 in England may well have been the happiest years of his life - so much so that he was apparently rather conflicted about returning to America when the 'electrified' SoS became a hit.
     
    phillyal1, bluemooze and Regandron like this.
  14. JamieC

    JamieC Senior Member

    Location:
    Detroit Mi USA
    In this case I meant "starving" subjectively not pejoratively. He was getting by and was working to make a name and rep in the British folk scene . Getting a record out there was part of that
     
    905 likes this.
  15. mikrt17

    mikrt17 Life has surface noise.

    Location:
    BROADSTAIRS UK
    It's true stereo .......but obviously it's only voice and guitar so the spread is not very wide, to be honest the
    mono is more natural to my ears.
     
    MLutthans likes this.
  16. JP Christian

    JP Christian Forum Resident

    This was my best 'boot sale' find ever - 20p (about 30c) - when was the last time you ever picked up anything for 20p? It was quite a long time ago mind!
     
    ajsmith likes this.
  17. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    You're...sure? Everything I've ever seen has indicated no true stereo mix exists.
     
  18. mikrt17

    mikrt17 Life has surface noise.

    Location:
    BROADSTAIRS UK
    Okay here is the thing I was the recording engineer on those sessions and I do remember mixing a mono and stereo version from a three track Ampex machine we had discussions about the fact there were only two listening parts and as Paul sang live playing guitar there was not a lot of separation but we did settle on panning the guitar to a half position, now the thing I'm not certain about is did CBS UK issue the stereo and maybe the powers that be decided it wasn't worth it as there was not much stereo information anyway and went with the mono only.

    As far as I know the album was only issued in the UK at that time and in 1965 the UK was still very much a mono world I would suspect only the mono version was released.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2017
    CMcGeek, spyboy, BeSteVenn and 30 others like this.
  19. rstamberg

    rstamberg Senior Member

    Location:
    Riverside, CT
    This is correct.
    I have a Japanese CD of THE PAUL SIMON SONGBOOK from a couple years back. It might also be a Blu-Spec CD ... can't remember offhand.
     
  20. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    Thanks Mike. I had forgotten about this post where you talked about it a bit. I haven't heard a UK stereo LP, so I'm not sure, but I've only ever seen references to mono or fake stereo when it came to LPs. I'm also not sure if the stereo LP was released concurrently with the mono or was released later. If it was released after the fact, it's more likely that it would be fake stereo.

    Anyone have a UK stereo LP?
     
    McLover likes this.
  21. boggs

    boggs Multichannel Machiavellian

    I have the PAUL SIMON COLLECTED WORKS US box. The SONGBOOK lp has a stereo label on it,
    but after careful listening, I can only hear mono. The pressing is very good. Very quite and enjoyable.
     
    mikrt17 likes this.
  22. mikrt17

    mikrt17 Life has surface noise.

    Location:
    BROADSTAIRS UK
    There is one for sale here which proves there was a stereo UK release.

    Paul Simon - Paul Simon Songbook original stereo UK LP
     
  23. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    I don't at all doubt there was a stereo pressing. I just wonder 1) when it was first released and 2) if it was actually true stereo.
     
  24. mikrt17

    mikrt17 Life has surface noise.

    Location:
    BROADSTAIRS UK
    It was issued in 1965 same time as the mono. Yes it was true stereo but as I've
    said before it's a very narrow image because it's just one person singing and playing but to be honest there is not a lot of difference between the mono and stereo.
     
  25. Peace N. Love

    Peace N. Love Forum Resident

    That whole beef with Artie over "Bridge" seems odd to me. Always wondered why Paul didn't simply appear onstage for the last verse to do the harmony.
     
    Ryan Lux, Hey Vinyl Man and lightbulb like this.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine