Peggy Lee On Record (1941-1995)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Ridin'High, Dec 29, 2016.

  1. Ridin'High

    Ridin'High Forum Resident Thread Starter

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    No knowledge on my part about that particular case, alas. I do feel confident, though, that the matter will be eventually investigated, if it hasn't been already. By "eventually," I mean "within the next five or ten years." For various reasons (including the fact that a movie about Peggy is currently in its pre-production stages), we might see a few releases of hers in the near future, unissued stuff potentially included.

    For the benefit of everybody reading these comments, let me clarify that .cristalised. and I are talking about a Burt Bacharach song that Peggy Lee seems to have recorded in 1957, on three different occasions.

    (A photo down below shows Bacharach & Lee together, some 13 years later. "Uninvited Dream" is not one of his more obscure songs. If you are curious to hear it, try the YouTube clip that is also below.)

    So, Peggy recorded all three versions of "Uninvited Dream" in 1957. The third was released that same year, on a 45-rpm single.

    The second version remained unreleased for half a century. It finally came out on the CD set The Singles Collection (2002; front cover photo right above).

    Those two issued versions of "Uninvited Dream" make for a very curious pair because they are quite different. The one on the The Singles Collection is a doo-wop piece, while the one on the 45 is a ballad.

    We fans are actually very lucky that we are able to hear the doo-wop version at all. It made it into The Singles Collection entirely by mistake. The makers of that set thought that they were using the rendition from the 45.

    .Crystalised. was obviously referring to the earliest, still unreleased version. It would be neat if that mysterious version turned out to be in an entirely different style ... Mind you, my guess would be that it is in one of the same already known styles. Still, I'm amused at the thought that it could instead be, say, in a rock 'n' roll beat!




    As far as chances go, this primeval "Uninvited Dream" could very well suffer from the same status as "Every Night."

    I must interject here that I've changed my mind about one of the points in contention. I no longer feel that the word for the status of those two masters can be "non-existent." Now I am more inclined to call them "lost." (Either lost somewhere in the vaults, or lost for good.)

    I changed my mind on this matter after I remembered that I had consulted the AFM reports for both the April 13 and April 22 sessions. Both reports present sessions that lasted three hours or longer. Hence, due to their duration, my feeling is that each must have produced three or four masters.

    Also, I've found additional details in my personal notes about one of Capitol's inventories of Peggy Lee tapes. Listed on that inventory are several takes of these unissued versions of "Uninvited Dream" and "Every Night" which we are discussing ...... (Now, I do not have, um, "carnal" knowledge of the tapes. The takes in question could have been excised from those reels. Or the reels themselves could be currently untraceable. But, whatever the case may be, there's enough detail and "substance" here for me to believe that Peggy did record both of those masters, and that they were once in the vaults, if not anymore.)


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    Last edited: Apr 27, 2018
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  2. .crystalised.

    .crystalised. Forum Resident

    Location:
    Edmonton, Alberta
    Well, now, would you look at that. There's new uploads on YouTube that compare both versions of "Uninvited Dream" and "Baby, Baby Wait For Me". How fortuitous for our conversation. :)

    Uninvited Dream (two versions)

    Baby, Baby Wait For Me (two versions)

    After comparing the two renditions of each side by side, I actually think I prefer the "rejected" versions of both! Here's why:

    The doo-wop version of "Uninvited Dream" has a very pretty arrangement, and Peggy sings it better. The endearments of this early Burt Bacharach composition are better showcased in this initial attempt, I think. Granted, the ballad is nice and tender (and very compatible with the style of Peggy's "The Man I Love" album) but it's in too high of a key, and Peggy doesn't sing it with as much conviction as she reaches for those higher notes. Still, both performances are effective and noteworthy.

    The single version of "Baby, Baby Wait For Me" has a more appropriate tempo for the composition, although it sounds more like a Louis Prima record than it does something by Peggy Lee. The doo-wop version is more soulful, and its sax solo feels more natural, spontaneous and improvised. That said, I enjoy the amplified guitar on the single version, along with all of those little obbligato details in the arrangement (pity it's not in stereo).

    The irony, though, is that the imaging of the single feels more "crowded" even though it's a smaller orchestra. (My guess is that the mike placement was inadequate for the stereo mix like other early Capitol stereo records, and that's why the rejected version sounds more empty despite having a larger ensemble).

    I get shivers at the end of the doo-wop version, when the orchestra stops and Peggy brings the lyrics to an a cappella closing before the song's end. Lovely version, in spite of a tempo that feels wrong for the song. I feel compelled to point out that "I'll be home... too-ooh... naa-ight..." before the band comes in is a very Patsy Cline thing to do at the end of a song (looking at you, "So Wrong"). I approve.

    Also, how neat would it be to sit in on the doo-wop session and watch the great Mr. Nelson Riddle waving his baton to this bluesy, soulful music! ;)
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2018
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  3. .crystalised.

    .crystalised. Forum Resident

    Location:
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    I'm now wondering about the "Sweetheart" / "Light of Love" recording session from September 14, 1958. If Capitol had not yet combined mono/stereo mikes by the time this session was recorded, there must have been a specific reason for rolling stereo, same as for the April 1957 session. Is there a possibility that Capitol had planned these titles for a stereo 45? Or perhaps the label had considered making the Alright, Okay, You Win EP a stereo disc? Once again, one of these titles might have been considered for inclusion on a Peggy Lee album, or more likely a various artist compilation LP, which could explain the multi-track capture for both performances.

    It seems like a series of fortunate happenstances gave rise to more early stereo of Peggy Lee than there would have been if she was signed to a different label in the late 1950s. It's pretty darn rare for anybody's singles to be recorded in stereo during that period.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2018
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  4. .crystalised.

    .crystalised. Forum Resident

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    So "Where Or When" was the third track from September 11, 1958, and it was for an album, while the other two were intended for the singles market?

    So we can infer that "Monique" and "How Did I Change" are only available in stereo mixes because they were recorded during album sessions. Further proof that Peggy's stereo sessions of April 13, 1957 and September 14, 1958 are anomalies, since all material recorded at both sessions were clearly intended for singles, and if Frank and Nat weren't getting a stereo capture for their singles sessions in this era, chances are good that no other Capitol artist except Peggy did, either.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2018
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  5. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
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    Regarding Sinatra's Sept. 11, 1958 session, which includes Where or When, I would not say that it's written in stone that it was meant for an album, but it certainly does not fit the typical singles mold, either.
    I think that the fact that this session was recorded in stereo has more to do with this bit, already quoted:
    Assuming the July, 1958, date is in the ballpark, September of 1958 clearly comes after the all-stereo mandate came down.
    I think that the inference can be made for the 1957 session, yes. For the September, 1958, sessions (including Peggy's session of 9/14/58), I think that we can infer that they came after July, 1958, plain and simple. As far as the April 13, 1957, session goes, are we (you/y'all) 100% positive that 1.) no selections scheduled (even if unrecorded) were intended for album release; and 2.) the session was 100% Peggy Lee, and not a shared situation such as @jtaylor mentioned for the Cole session of November 20, 1957?
     
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  6. .crystalised.

    .crystalised. Forum Resident

    Location:
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    According to the Capitol Label Discography, Peggy Lee was the only artist that recorded a session on April 13, 1957. There was a Dolores Gray session with Van Alexander the day before, and Nelson Riddle headlined the next session on April 15. Peggy only recorded three songs on April 13, making it entirely possible that a split date was planned to get the usual four masters per session. And check this out:

    PEGGY LEE:
    Peggy Lee(vo) with Orchestra arr. & cond. by Nelson Riddle.
    (Session #4960) LA,April 13,1957

    16840 Ev'ry night Cap.F3722,CD 5-27564-2
    16841 Uninvited dream rejected (see session #4980)
    16842 Baby,baby wait for me - -
    16843: no information.

    ^ Master number 16843 was likely reserved for a performance that wasn't attempted/recorded, and the number went unused (hence the "no information" disclaimer). But, take note of the orchestra leader for this Peggy Lee session. Nelson Riddle returned to Capitol two days later to record four songs:

    NELSON RIDDLE AND HIS ORCHESTRA:
    Orchestra & Chorus arr. & cond. by Nelson Riddle.
    (Session #4961) LA,April 15,1957

    16844 Matinee theme Cap.F3717,(E)CL148802,45CL14802
    16845 Theme from "New Girl in Town" -
    16846 In a small forgotten town Cap.F3794
    16847 Rue Madeleine Cap.F3758,(E)CL148802,45CL14802

    ^ judging from the catalogue numbers, these tracks ended up on singles only. It's entirely possible, though, that one of these performances had been planned for recording on April 13, since Riddle and orchestra were already on hand. Perhaps there were plans for a Riddle album of these songs...far more likely for the Riddle material to be album worthy than what Peggy recorded on April 13.

    Another possibility is that a fourth Peggy Lee master was planned, and perhaps it was this unattempted performance that was envisioned to have potential as an album cut, because Ridin'High makes a valid point about the other three (Peggy is not known for her doo-wop prowess, although she certainly holds her own in the genre).
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
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  7. Vinylfindco

    Vinylfindco Forum Resident

    Location:
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    Just stopped into this thread because I wanted to check reactions to the EMI vinyl reissue from the mid 80s CAPS 26 0005. Not sure if I have a bad copy but I’m finding the sound on this issue very disappointing. Vocal sound a little glassy, or brittle. Too bad.
     
  8. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA
    This?
    R-4514124-1403435884-8964.jpeg.jpg
    I'm guessing I have literally not played that LP since 1987, but I liked it a lot at the time, sound and performance.
     
  9. Vinylfindco

    Vinylfindco Forum Resident

    Location:
    Miami
    Yes that’s it. Maybe I forgot to push the mono button! Actually I didn’t, but although I do lie the song selection and vocal performance, I think the orchestration is a bit overwrought compared to most other work of Nelson Riddle. Perhaps if he conducted it, it might have been better in that regard. I know and love his work from a few years later on Nat King Cole and Frank Sinatra titles. Don’t know what happened here. I’ll definitely give it a listen in another format.
     
  10. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
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    If you go back to this post, a very lengthy discussion follows.
     
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  11. bluemooze

    bluemooze Forum Resident

    Location:
    Frenchtown NJ USA
    Please. o_O
     
  12. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
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    ????? (I am apparently confused by your post. Probably my own poor mental wiring.)
     
  13. bluemooze

    bluemooze Forum Resident

    Location:
    Frenchtown NJ USA
    I mean please take the trouble to identify the record using more information than just "CAPS 26 0005." Even though it is an exact identification, nobody will know what "CAPS 26 0005" means without having to look it up.
     
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  14. Ridin'High

    Ridin'High Forum Resident Thread Starter

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    Makes sense to me too. Only one "proviso." We would have to check the memo to make sure that the mandate was to be applied to all types of vinyl, rather than just long plays. The stereophonic Peggy Lee session in question (9/14/58) consisted of just two songs ("Sweetheart" and "Light of Love"), recorded with the clear goal of producing a 45 single.

    By the way, I went to check the Frank session that you mentioned, Matt. It turned out to be an intriguing one for me. Depending on where we look, anywhere between three and five songs are listed. The other two numbers are "Who's in your Arms Tonight?" and "The Way I Love You." At the Sinatra Family forum, the former has been identified as an orchestral track only (i.e, no Frank vocal).

    And looks like the latter has been deemed an error?? So I am gathering from a note found elsewhere, to the effect that the master has been deemed to not be by Frank. (I'm left to wonder what's going on with that track, then. It is supposedly attached to one of the session's numbers, E 30098. Could it actually be another orchestral, voiceless track? Or was it a master that had been planned, yet never actually attempted?)

    Anyway, the OP of this thread has gone off track yet again, deviating from the main subject of discussion ... Let me go back to Peggy.




    On that note, we should probably point out that Peggy Lee has more "stereophonic Peggy Lee material" from the pre-July 1958 period -- material not yet mentioned. In addition to what we have already discussed (the Riddle session, the Jump for Joy album, and the The Man I Love as a possibility), there is another full album, as well as a single (the latter recorded during that same album's sessions).




    In my opinion, none of them would have qualified as album material. Those April 13, 1957 numbers clearly belong to the brand of ditty which publishing agencies were contemporaneously peddling to all labels, and which the labels were in turn imposing on their rosters. Stuff squarely aimed at the popular singles market -- usually mindless lyrics to an often great, catchy rock 'n' roll, doo-wop, rhythm & blues, or rockabilly beat.

    I mean: in just in the same way that "Two Hearts, Two Kisses" would have not been meant for one of Frank's original albums, "Every Night" would have not been meant for one of Peggy's original albums.

    For anyone curious about those two songs ...

    "Two Hearts, Two Kisses" was a #8 r&b hit for Otis Williams & His Charms on DeLuxe Records, in 1955. The song publisher and the other record companies were hopeful to also have success with it, because there were cover versions by not only Frank at Capitol and Doris on Columbia but also The Crew Cuts (Mercury), The DeCastro Sisters (Decca) and, no surprise, the ubiquitous Pat Boone (Dot).

    Co-written by future Capitol labelmate Ed Townsend, "Every Night" was recorded not only by Peggy and Ed (Aladdin) but also Tex Williams (Decca), Etta James (Modern), and a Rene Renee on Liberty.





    Interesting finding (i.e., back-to-back Lee-Riddle) and possibility (a stereo Riddle album). I'd like to keep the possibility in the back of my mind, even if right now it is not resonating with me. (But I've been known to change my mind!)

    One of the matters to look for: whether any of numbers from that Riddle session is known to exist on three-track.

    Another matter to consider: the fairly similar pattern of Peggy's next session.

    Despite the similarity between the two sessions (April 13 & April 22), we would be hard-pressed to try anything resembling the April 13 hypothesis (i.e., the possibility of a fourth track meant for another artist) on April 22. Here are the details about that session of remakes.

    PEGGY LEE:
    Peggy Lee(vo) with Jack Marshall and his Orchestra.
    (Session #4980) LA, April 22, 1957
    16860 Every night
    16861 Uninvited dream
    16862 Baby, baby wait for me
    16864: no information.

    Session #4981: no information.

    TOMMY SANDS: Tommy Sands(vo) with ?
    (Session #4982) LA, April 23,1957
    16865 Let me be loved
    16866 Fantastically foolish

    By the way, master number 16863 was (re-?)assigned to Frank's performance of "Where Are You?" (E 16863, recorded May 1, 1957).


    Yes, but we would have to contend yet again with the fact that the April 22 date bears such a closeness to the April 13 date. In both cases, we found ourselves without any solid evidence that a fourth master was even attempted. And we would need to figure out why the hypothetical 4th master was not attempted on April 22. (Of course, we could speculate that plans for a fourth track had been abandoned by then, and hence the master number was quickly reassigned to Frank. But we can as well come up with many other possibilities.) We would also have to explain #16864 ... That's the problem with speculation ... not to say anything of lack of enough information, aye! ...)




    I'd like to think so. But .... here's one of my lingering suspicions. What if there were many more mono/stereo 1957-1958 sessions than those we know of? What if tons of other sessions were also taped to stereo, and the tapes were at some point discarded (due to really poor sound) or mislabeled (due to lack of enough regard for stereo)?




     
    Last edited: May 11, 2018
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  15. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

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  16. CBackley

    CBackley Chairman of the Bored

    Looks like there’s a Japanese SHM-CD reissue of Sea Shells coming out in a few weeks. Sorry if this has been posted already; I searched and didn’t see anything.

    I just discovered this album. As in a day ago. It’s fantastic.
     
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  17. bluemooze

    bluemooze Forum Resident

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    Wouldn't happen to have a link to that, would you? :tiphat:
     
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  18. CBackley

    CBackley Chairman of the Bored

  19. bluemooze

    bluemooze Forum Resident

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  20. bluemooze

    bluemooze Forum Resident

    Location:
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  21. CBackley

    CBackley Chairman of the Bored

    Sorry about that. Not sure what happened. Just search Amazon for “Peggy Lee Sea Shells CD.”
     
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  22. CBackley

    CBackley Chairman of the Bored

  23. bluemooze

    bluemooze Forum Resident

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  24. CBackley

    CBackley Chairman of the Bored


    @Ridin'High , all the info I can find online implies that Classics & Collectibles has only 50 tracks. In your post you say it has 52, but that an easy pressing omits two songs. Was there a later pressing that *added* two songs? What are the two songs on the 52-track version that are missing from the 50-song collection?
     
  25. CBackley

    CBackley Chairman of the Bored

    Regarding this quote: “That having been said, both numbers are available in many other Peggy Lee CDs and LPs. They are "Do I Love You?" and "Guess I'll Go Back Home Next Summer.")” — I saw that “Do I Love You?” is on the 2003 Love Songs compilation. Where can one get “Guess I’ll Go Back Home,” especially on a easily available and affordable source?
     

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