Not what this thread shows, quite the opposite. Not me for sure. PLX is not that bad but it has flaws that old Technics doesn't. Not admitting them but saying it is fine creates wrong standards for the new generations of users and makes no pressure on the manufacturer for improvement. Still a good table for the money in the current market, if you get a problem-less one. If mk2 version solves these issues - even better. But what I dislike about the PLX is the fact it being a blatant copy of a 40 years old original, feels like a bootleg. And the way Pioneer conducted it was below any decency expected from such major brand. They went to a pirating turntable factory, Hanpin, who even themselves as such restrained from copying the Technics externals, and did what? Tweaked the existing Technics copycat to be even more of a Technics copycat! Bravo! What a clever move, who would thought of it. And now they get praise for "even MAKING such great tables", like, they did justice to the turntable part of humanity. Out of mind.
It's called meeting a market demand. Technics had dropped out of the game. It may be that they realized their folly once Pioneer entered the market. Like it or not, this is how global commerce works. Since the Pioneer rubs you wrong, the ATLP120 must really get under your skin.
Market demand for Technics by Pioneer? They could have at least do some less Techy own external design keeping the functionality which was the actual market demand for. But it's understandable - Technics design is that eternal beauty many lust for, as proven by those happy PLX owners enjoying it secondhand. Oh yes, AT 120 Lp owners, too.
Really? If Pepsi quit making Mountain Dew and made no mention of coming out with a better recipe and there was lots of demand, would it not be stupid on Cokes's part to not start selling it? That's just smart business. Technics shut everything down. Pioneer saw an opportunity. Simple as that.
We gotta remember that this Pioneer is marketed to DJs. They used the Technics but once Technics quit they had no options with good quality in the unused market. Pioneer made a clone, so DJs used to the Technics could play it feeling at home. Just like great guitar manufacturers like ESP for example make good quality clones of Gibsons and Fenders, so people who like these guitars have one more option to play something they're used to. Pioneer did fill an empty space left by Tecnhics. A lot of DJs use Pioneer gear. That space would still be empty today since the new SL1200s are for a different market. Some Tecnhics fans can be upset that the Pioneer copied the design. I'm not. Tecnhics SL1210 are just stunning and I'm glad Pioneer used almost the same design. I could buy an old Technics SL1200 if I wanted to. They cost the same as the PLX-1000 here in Brazil. I didn't only because I didn't want to take a chance on a used turntable that I had no option but to buy online without testing. But I think the old SL1200s are terrific. I'd like to have a SL1200 myself. They must be great since several reviews state that they and the PLX-1000 perform similarly and I know very well how great the PLX perform. The Hanpin and QC subjects belong in the past. Check the first 50 pages of this thread if you want to go through that again. It's over. Actually, I wanna prove that I'm not a Pioneer fanboy. I'll trade my PLX-1000 in a brand new Technics SL1200G right now. Anyone interested PM me please. Shipping costs on me.
If Mercedes shuts down, should BMW hire a Mercedes copycat factory in China and sell the cars as Mercedes? Or pick a brand. Would you call it "taking an opportunity"?
Why not? All new Volvos imported to the US are now made in China. I don't want one. If someone else does, that's their money and their business.
That's different and OK, like if the Chinese bought Technics from the Japanese and move the production to China. Btw edited one word in the post you quoted to reflect the parallel.
This I agree with. For some reason it really irks @RPM that Pioneer take a successful (and abandoned) formula and run with it. For shame. And it's still an abandoned formula. Technics could have actually retooled the factory and fired it up building the same old same old. They would have spent less money and generated revenue (and hopefully profit) quicker. They didn't- they decided to build an even better product. Good on them.
And good for all of us too. The more options on great turntables the best. I'm glad Pioneer filled that space and I'm glad Tecnhics went on to something even better. We should all celebrate instead of being bitter about it. I really don't get the hate on Pioneer.
Just FYI that Super OEM by Hanpin was on the market some 10 years before the PLX. And the PLX is not the same but is worse than 1210 in DJ context too (digital vs analogue pitch, high torque good only for scratch djs but otherwise not so etc.). Time will tell. Let's hope for the best.
I stand corrected. Not all models apparently. My bad. I've not been interested in a Volvo since the C30 was discontinued. There's only one Chinese-made car you can buy in the US — and we drove it
Must say you guys have some strange views on business ethics. Hope you don't see those Chinese Mercedes copycat manufacturers as heroes too because they also fill some spaces on the car market and make many people happy.
Let me understand. You think Pioneer was unethical by copying the Technics design and by filling a space they left blank. OK, ethics is a complex subject, I won't say your claim doesn't make sense. It makes even more sense if you think, as you do, that they made a worse quality clone that is nothing but a Hanpin DJ5300. I can accept your view. I disagree that the PLX-1000 is so much worse or bad quality because of so many reviews saying it's not and because of my own experience (I don't feel cheated by Pioneer). I also disagree that the PLX-1000 is a DJ5300 because, as the specs suggest, it's very different, although maybe made by the same manufacturer. This was the subject until now as I was understanding it. About the ethical issues I won't argue, I'm sorry. I hold a bachelor's degree in Philosophy and it's enough for me to know how complex an ethical discussion may become. I prefer not to go that route, but I register that I accept that your opinion about it might be correct.
Not ignoring them, but there are opposite experiences that show there is something not always right with this tt and therefore it can not stand on par with Technics 1200. In a world where Volkswagen massively cheats on emission tests I wouldn't rely much on specs, that, btw were once corrected by Pioneer, claiming a typo for the w&f figure. Anyway, this word "same" should be taken elastically, because, as said before, Hanpin does tweaks to the DJ5500 model per customer requirements, so some specs differences noted do not mean it's not a Hanpin.
I checked again. If I square the cartridge in the headshell with 54mm from stylus tip to headshell washer, it alligns perfectly (as much as I can see of course) to the outer null point but if I try the inner null point the cartridge is slightly twisted to the center (clockwise looking from the top). So yes, I was wrong when I said I reached Baerwald with 54mm. I didn't. If I could use more than 54mm, the cartridge would twist less in the inner null point. If I would need almost 3 millimeters more to make it straight to the inner null point (to measure 56.817mm), then, according to my measurements, the stock headshell won't allow it and neither will my Ortofon SH-4 both by very little. You're right again. I should have payed attention to this before since it was previously discussed in this and also in other thread that I visited here at SHF. Maybe this is why I have IGD with the Ortofon 2M Blue in a couple of used records. These records play fine with my Nagaoka MP-110 with the same 54mm though so not sure. Maybe the records have some damaged inner grooves that the Nagaoka is able to surpass. I ordered a Jelco HS25, should be here next week. I'm about to order a 2M Black too. Let's see how this new combo will play.
I tried pushing the 2M cartridge all the way to the front of the SH-4 headshell as some of you did to good results. I reported my experience to the PLX-1000 set up dedicated thread: Questions re Pioneer PLX-1000 set-up
Rather than starting a new thread, I would like to ask those of you who have owned this table for recommendations for a cartridge. I just got this table and am a relative novice when it comes to turntable setup what to look for in a cartridge. Price wise I’m looking to spend no more than $200. I bought this table for music listening only and I mostly listen to rock music from the 60s and 70s.
Thanks. Do you use the stock Pioneer headshell with it? I like the idea of buying the version that is preinstalled to a headshell assuming it will fit the PLX arm.
