PONO Hands-on Review

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Bowie Fett, Nov 15, 2014.

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  1. jy3iix

    jy3iix Forum Resident

    Planar magnetics produce a flatter response across the spectrum. Which translates as better bass because by comparison most other types of headphones and IEMs taper off on lower frequencies.
     
  2. Ham Sandwich

    Ham Sandwich Senior Member

    Location:
    Sherwood, OR, USA
    That's like asking why do some people like Magneplanar speakers? It's a certain style of sound that does some things well and appeals to people looking for that.

    I like what good planar magnetic headphones are able to do. I'm able to forgive the things they don't necessarily do so well. Like everything in audio it involved trade-offs. There's also good planar magnetic headphones and bad ones. Just being planar magnetic doesn't automatically make it good or doesn't automatically make it sound like I think a planar ought to.

    The Audeze planars are able to do a good quality bass that is clean and reasonably fast. The bass is able to layer. It doesn't become just a blob or one-note style bass. That's possibly helped by the Audeze headphones having lower distortion in the bass region than most other headphones. The Audeze bass is there, but isn't overdone. It works for me. And I like listening to pipe organ music. And the Audeze do that well for me.

    Planars are also able to have a certain style of coherence that I like. Coherence in the soundstage and coherence in the way different areas of the sound and frequency range come together. Done right it makes it seem like you're listening to a single driver behaving well. I'm a bit of a soundstage junkie in the way I look for a certain style of soundstage (and the PonoPlayer does that style of soundstage). The coherence lets that style of soundstage happen. But at the same time planar magnetics tend to have a more boxed in soundstage than other really good headphones (like the HD800). That's likely due in part to all of the magnets and the magnet structure in front of and behind the driver. All those magnets creating an obstruction in front of and behind the driver is going to make it sound less open. Which is a compromise I've accepted to get the rest of the sound I'm after. And with the right amp the planar magnetics can sound open enough for me. But still, I've compromised.

    I've got an HD600 and HD580. I had a Denon D2000, but killed it. I replaced it with my LCD-2. I'm thinking about getting an HD800. Looking at other planars that are out now to complement my LCD-2. We'll see. It's easier for me to find headphones I don't like than to find headphones that I do like.

    I've tried in-ear IEMs. I don't like that style of sound. I'm a soundstage junkie and they don't do that well enough for me. Plus some other issues. So I haven't gone down that path of having IEMs. They're very convenient for portable use. But they're just not for me.
     
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  3. Rockos

    Rockos Forum Resident

    I get that with my Fiio X1.
     
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  4. Brother_Rael

    Brother_Rael Senior Member

    Had my Sony Xperia Z1 Compact on at work for about six hours non stop yesterday. Same feeling here...
     
    Rockos likes this.
  5. cdash99

    cdash99 Senior Member

    Location:
    Mass
    Any thoughts on powered speakers for a Pono? One of the reviewers (Atkinson perhaps) mentioned that a Pono + powered speaker combination would create a great budget or office system for $750 or so.
     
  6. jy3iix

    jy3iix Forum Resident

    I've been using Pono + rCube in my home office and main listening room - it's a stunningly good combination. Speaker placement is especially important though with this one (best facing out of an uncluttered corner of the room). There's a port on the speaker so you can charge Pono during playback, great for preserving battery life.
    http://www.amazon.com/Arcam-Portable-Speaker-System-iPhone/dp/B0047ZGFYY/

    Unfortunately Arcam have taken the rCube out of production. Hopefully they eventually replace it with a similar quality product in the same price range.
     
  7. NHT SuperPower 2.1's would be ideal in this application. They sound very, very good and each speaker has a 90 watt Class D amp. I have been looking for a DAC with volume control to use with my SuperPowers, but perhaps Pono is the way to go.
     
  8. htom

    htom Senior Member

    Location:
    Montreal, Canada
    I have a pair of Oppo PM-2 planar magnetic headphones and the Pono player can drive these well enough. I don't push these past the 4 O'Clock level of the onscreen volume indicator and maybe no higher than 5 O'clock for balanced mode. As it is these levels I would find too loud for extended periods. I didn't think I could ever drive them at 100% without damaging them.
     
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  9. Steeve

    Steeve Forum Resident

    Location:
    East of Australia
    I received a pono player last week and took away on holiday for 4 days.
    I used with Ultrasone Signature Pro headphones.Perfect 2 piece combo for travel.
    I selected playlists from my j river (cd rips and 24/96 downloads approx 100gb with sd card ) within a couple of hours ready to go.
    The sound is detailed,relaxed and thoroughly enjoyable.
    I'm very happy with what pono has achieved for its price.
    Well done Mr Young and Pono.
     
    joelee, jeffsab, Dino and 1 other person like this.
  10. Poxy Bowsy

    Poxy Bowsy Well-Known Member

    What about the Pono Revealer? Does it reveal anything, like, can you hear the difference when changing the resolutions?
     
  11. Barnabas Collins

    Barnabas Collins Senior Member

    Location:
    NH
    Yes, you can hear the difference.
     
  12. The Pono costs 4x what the X1 sells for, I should hope it sounds different. I am more curious in a head to head comparison with a FiiO X3 gen 2 which sell for half the cost of a Pono.
     
  13. conjotter

    conjotter Forum Resident

    Very happy with my Pono purchase.
    It replaces my old Creative Zen MP3 player that I bought nine years ago.
    Hi rez files on Pono sound awesome on my very basic headphones ($50 IGrados). I've also ripped CDs, and they sound great too.
    Looking forward to getting some better headphones and a cable so I can go the balanced route and hook it up to my stereo.
    Can't understand negative Pono reviews.
    When the Zen came out in 2006 it cost almost $400 - the same as Pono.
    Perhaps people don't appreciate that the Pono shines when it is used with decent headphones and, most importantly, well recorded music.
    I don't think any audio player can make low resolution recordings sparkle.
     
  14. Ephi82

    Ephi82 Still have two ears working

    Location:
    S FL
    This has been my take on PONO, and now that I own one I can re affirm:

    Its the best digital, and portable player I have encountered. With a very good set of headphones, ($250) it plays back well reordered and well mastered music at a quality level that will blow you away IF you appreciate quality audio. Hi res, dynamic mastered files sound incredible, better than through my OPPPO players DACs. and I have listened to a limited number of redbook level WAV's, and they sound awesome as well. (Had the Beatles Abbey Road pumping through last might.)

    This is a great product Big question will be if there are enough consumers for its value. I really hope so.
     
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  15. Dino

    Dino Forum Resident

    Location:
    Kansas City - USA
    PonoMusic Player has the best sound that I've heard from digital.

    I think it's biggest problem is that many people who have not heard one, kind of hate them. (I find that odd.)
     
    Charles Buxton likes this.
  16. Charles Buxton

    Charles Buxton Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Antonio, Texas
    I've developed a theory on the "hate" subject. I *do not* want this do delve into politics.

    I believe it basically boils down to Neil Young. He has, inadvertantly, acted as a lightning rod for this this thing.

    Anybody here old enough to remember Ronald Reagan? Anybody remember him running for President? Here was one school of thought on the subject: "He's an actor, he has no business running for President." Yet, whether or not you agreed with any of his policies he did have a grasp of the issues and there was a reason he was a referred to as "The Great Communicator". 'Nuff said on that subject.

    I think the same thing applies with Neil Young. I think there is a line of thinking, largely unspoken that goes, "He's a musician, he has no business making an audiophile product!"
    It's tempting to think the whole thing would have had a completely different reception had it been spearheaded by Charles Hansen.

    And, yet, why not Neil Young? He is a recording artist, fer cryin' out loud. Isn't it natural that he would care about how his recordings are heard?
    He didn't just wake up one morning and decide he needed he needed a new revenue stream. He has track record, of caring, from withdrawing pressings, due to bad sound ("Comes A Time") to being an investor in HDCD.
     
  17. oneway23

    oneway23 Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY, US
    Absolutely, Charles...I couldn't possibly guesstimate the amount of negative posts I've read that include comments like, "his hearing is shot, how could he possibly be capable of hearing the "benefits" of hi-res", and, "He's been standing in front of amps for half a century", etc....

    To be fair, it was also maybe not the most beneficial approach for Neil to be so absolute in his proclamations, either. That seems to have created more than a bit of backlash, particularly among those in the mainstream press...

    Either way, a Ponoplayer is fantastic. It's a downright steal at $400...Everyone who listens to music on any level beyond background noise should seriously consider owning one.
     
    tbugsett likes this.
  18. My theory is that some people (including me) are skeptical of the Pono because of the associated misleading marketing campaign that seems to address an issue that did not even exist -the lack of an affordable portable high resolution DAP and the availability of high resolution music. Both were around before Pono was released, affordable and in good quality. Additionally, Neil's failure to credit the music's mastering as a far more significant factor in music enjoyment than bitrate smacks of either ignorance or dishonesty. I content that even a lossy 320 AAC file ripped from a nice Mobile Fidelity cd will sound better than a high resolution FLAC that was created from an indifferent or poorly-mastered source. So for me I can't get the taste of the BS marketing campaign out of my system. I don't hate the Pono and suspect the sound and build quality are worth the price, but I won't be buying one when other DAPs are around that offer the same or better value without the associated BS marketing.
     
  19. oneway23

    oneway23 Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY, US
    Forget the hi-res debate and use it for your CD rips, then...You can't beat the sound quality for the price. I know they had a store to push, but, I do fault the Pono team, in a certain sense, for not making folks aware of how great everything sounds on it...
     
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  20. What other DAPs have you compared the Pono to?
     
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  21. oneway23

    oneway23 Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY, US
    It's appreciably better, IMO, than the FiiO X3 and the Sony A17. I can't speak to the new, recently released, second generation of Fiio devices, however...YMMV
     
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  22. Ham Sandwich

    Ham Sandwich Senior Member

    Location:
    Sherwood, OR, USA
    Neil conceived and launched the Pono project because he saw and believed in a need to make music listening more enjoyable and more pleasurable. To make it more pleasurable and emotionally rewarding to listen to full albums one after another. Where you start listening and just want to keep on listening. We lost that with modern consumer digital playback. So much of modern digital just sounds sterile and flat. Neil aims to deliver music files and hardware that is able to deliver the style of pleasurable listening experience that he envisions. I share that vision too. It's what I want when listening to music. It's the direction that I've been taking my headphone system as I buy new gear. I'm looking to maximize my listening pleasure.

    The Pono vision requires two parts. Better quality source material that doesn't compromise what is in the master. High-res is a way to help achieve that. And better quality playback devices that have the right style of sound qualities that make listening pleasurable, enjoyable, and emotionally rewarding. That's the reason for the PonoPlayer.

    The PonoPlayer is a very necessary part of Neil's vision because there are no other consumer level devices that deliver the style of sound qualities he's after. Sound quality and style that has the right magic at a reasonably affordable price. Players like Fiio and iBasso are able to play high-res and do so reasonably well. But they do not have the style of pleasurable magic in the sound that Neil is after. And those players, and many other similar players, don't even have that sort of sound quality as a design goal. If they don't have it as a design goal it is never going to happen. The only way for Neil to make it happen is to design a player specific to his goals. And he achieved that. In spades.

    I do hear that magic in the PonoPlayer. I hear it in vocals. I hear it in the way a cello plays. I hear it in the way I feel while listening to it. I hear it in the way I'm drawn into the music. The music becomes the experience rather than listening as a technical experience. The PonoPlayer is very much a listening style player with a sound quality tuned to listening enjoyment. And that's a big part of the magic. That magic is obvious to me when I listen to it. The PonoPlayer is the only affordable portable that I've heard that has that magic. Even more expensive desktop DACs and headphone amps aren't able to deliver that magic. Which makes the little PonoPlayer all the more amazing.

    The PonoPlayer also is able to play high-res in a way that sounds better than CD-res. That's another reason why the PonoPlayer is needed. It demonstrates why high-res is better. You aren't really going to notice that high-res is better when listening on something like an iPhone. You may notice that high-res is better if you listen with the PonoPlayer. The Revealer feature on the PonoPlayer will let you test that for yourself. High-res playback makes the music just a little bit more enjoyable. And that's one of Neil's goals. To make music listening more enjoyable and pleasurable.
     
  23. Brother_Rael

    Brother_Rael Senior Member

    "So much of modern digital sounds sterile and flat ".

    No it doesn't. It. Doesn't.

    Some people tell us it does, but in my experience, and that's quite a bit now, they're either flogging something (dead horses apart) or venting their spleen on some old thing they've had going for years and haven't realised the digital world had moved on.

    Digital has been fine for years. Years and years. What's not fine are some production values. Different thing. And a player won't fix that.
     
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  24. Dino

    Dino Forum Resident

    Location:
    Kansas City - USA
    Great post, Ham Sandwich!

    I concur.

    I suspect that some will read your post and think it is hyperbole. I have read enough of your posts to see that hyperbole is not in your nature.
     
  25. Ham Sandwich

    Ham Sandwich Senior Member

    Location:
    Sherwood, OR, USA
    I'm referring to modern digital playback. Not modern digital recording and CDs, that's a completely separate subject. Modern consumer level digital playback is flat. Flat soundstage. Especially for portable listening. It doesn't go holographic and enveloping like great digital playback can and what the PonoPlayer can. Modern digital playback also tends towards sterileness or harsh treble masquerading as more resolving. Great sound is enveloping and pleasurable, not flat or harsh.

    Listen to a PonoPlayer. You aren't going to be able to understand what I'm trying to convey about its sound until you hear it with good recordings and good headphones (especially good headphones in balanced mode).
     
    Vinylsoul 1965 likes this.
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