Project P2 or Rega Planner 1

I looked up the manuals of if not your exact table, the closest table I could find to yours on Vinyl Engine. Pro-ject 2 - Manual - 2-Speed Belt-Drive Turntable - Vinyl Engine
According to the manual the counter weight supports cartridges up to 7.0 grams of weight, so 0.2 grams less than any current colored Ortofon cart. If it makes it impossible to fit I can not say, but according to the manual it is slightly outside the comfort range. Getting a heavier counter weight like Bob suggests would be ideal if you decide on an Ortofon Blue or Bronze for example.

 

Now now, we are just exploring possibilities. If you read the thread we discussed your option as well.

 

It just gets so confusing as you get much in the way of conflicting but good advice. Also adding the Rega Phono stage takes the cost up to around £400 and my budget has been reduced somewhat to around £300 tops.

PS
I asked around and some were wondering why I would need a Phono Stage when the one in my Marantz Amp is considered very good.

 

The prospect of adding a separate phono stage is not a bad idea however. To combine cheaper alternatives in both areas such as lets say an Ortofon 2M Blue with something like a Schiit Mani MM phono stage might yield a more sizable upgrade than just a stylus or cart. These things are nearly impossible to know before testing however and differ for everyone's setup.

 

The idea is to buy the 530 stylus, which is the equivalent of the Bronze, and not require any tinkering with your rig. So instant upgrade for under your budget there. Then, in a month or so, add the extra few pounds needed to buy the new phono stage. Yes, the one in your amp is OK, and you will notice a difference with the upgraded stylus alone, but the built-in phono will also suddenly become the weakest link if it isn't already. The 530 is a significant upgrade and the Fono MM will be as well. It takes all of the following to complementary upgrade an analog front end: turntable, arm, cartridge, phono stage. They are all important and you will have left no stone unturned and remain so darn near your budget that it would make little sense to do otherwise.
-Bill

 

Since you seem very confident in the 530 stylus may I ask about carts in general. Are the internal part of a cartridge not bigger determining factors for putting out a hifi sound? Could I just put in a higher end stylus and cantilever for my Nagaoka MP110 such as the one on the MP500 and recieve an equally good cart as buying the whole MP500 cartridge? Or is this just a feature pertaining to the Ortofon series?

 

The stylus is typically the most important and most expensive component of a phono cartridge. I am not sure where the break in body designs is in that line, but it is common for a maker to offer two or three stylus upgrades for the same cartridge body, thus making possible 2 or 3 cartridge models from one base body and stylus carrier design. Then, there are typically some changes to the motor design inside of the body to make the cartridges from there on up even higher performance. In short, if the better stylus will fit the current cartridge, it will make it a better cartridge.
-Bill

 

What do you mean by the motor design in the body? Arnt carts just magnets or coils that measure the movement of the cantilever and send the phono signal through the cables?

 

In a MM cart, there is a magnet or two coupled to the rear of the cantilever. The body in this MM design contains the coils. The two parts together make-up a generator system, ie motor, but you can only change the magnet end via the stylus, the rest of the motor is fixed within the body.
-Bill

 

Thanks again Bill, looking like this is the way forward.

 

Just trying to help. It's what I would do if in your shoes. Please tell me you have clean shoes...
-Bill

 

Thanks everyone for all the help. I have decided to order the 530 (thanks, Bill) upgrade, after finding a great price on it and the ability to just swap out the stylus without further adjustment.

 

Easy to do, better tracking and you wont need to change anything else to install. Overall a good option Id say. Good luck!

 

This is best, for four comfort zone and for the familiarity you already have with the sound of the cartridge design. @KT88 is right, especially as my 2M Bronze suggestion now appears to be just a wee bit too heavy for the tonearm on your P2.

The phono preamp built into your Marantz is pefectly acceptable, but it is not letting you hear everything the cartridge is extracting from the LP groove. A Rega Fono MM or a Graham Slee Gram Amp 2 among other excellent and very favorably priced external phono preamps are excellent and inexpensive. By comparison, the internal Marantz phono preamp will sound slightly muffled.

 

I think I understand. So the overall sound is produced mostly by the magnets? There is no way just changing styli profiles change the actual music besides picking up more detail, reducing surface noise and tracking better right?

 

Any stance on the Schiit Mani MM phono amp?

 

Anything that resembles this, is going to be better than anything costing >$800 brand new.

It will also cost >$175.

#blanketstatement

 

Same for an SL 1200, if you can find them that is. Not so easy for some of us. In good condition especially.

 

No, the magnets are just a means to an end for the MM. The real movement is between the groove walls and the styli, so the stylus profile is actually of the highest importance. You cannot reproduce more than what is impressed into the record but you can leave some behind, so the better the profile can trace the groove, the closer to the original recording you can get. The magnet is attached to that, so when the movement is more accurate on the stylus end, so it is on the magnet end and that results in finer resolution ability of the motor. The voltages produced become more well defined and consistent than with a larger stylus profile. It is similar to painting tiny shades, lines, and dots with a fine tip brush vs using a larger brush and more broad strokes. You want the better profile, but it'll cost two or three times that of the standard conical or elliptical.
-Bill

 

So I could just buy a MP500 stylus to fit on my MP110 cart and it would be as good? Would I get a sound difference as displayed in this video for example where the presence and sound staging is so much greater on the MP500?

 

Personally, I’m not a fan. I like several other Schiit products including the Gungnir (Multibit version) DAC, Ygdrassil DAC and both of the Schiit power amps. I think Schiit needs to take another kick at the Mani design - it doesn’t sound good to me at all as it is. That said, Schiit has a considerable number of happy Mani customers. Mainly, I think Graham Slee in particular, and Rega too, among others, simply know a lot more about phono preamps than Schiit. It’s possible that will change over time, but for now companies such as Graham Slee are pushing forward with excellent designs and superb sound at reasonable prices.

 

Whether a magnet is moving between two coils or a coil is moving between two magnets, the important thing to understand is that the movement generates electricity - typically anywhere from 0.1 millivolt up to 5 millivolts, depending on the design. In general, moving coil designs generate lower voltage than moving magnet designs.

The movement is caused by the action of the stylus in the groove.

 

So then whats to stop me from buying an MP110 body and only the stylus and cantilever of the MP500 to get the performance of buying the normal MP500 but at a lower price?

 

Nice with some new perspective. Im really interested in the upcoming review of the Rega FONO MK3 by Ian from HiVi news. Especially since I mostly have EU branded equipment and a Rega table it might be best to stick with whats familiar, especially if Ian also has good things to say.