"Put the Compact Disc Out of Its Misery" article. Comments?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Steve Hoffman, Jan 22, 2003.

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  1. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter

    Put the Compact Disc Out of Its Misery
    The new CDs: Neither compact nor disks. Discuss.
    By Paul Boutin


    This spring, the compact disc celebrates the 20th anniversary of its arrival in stores, which puts the once-revolutionary music format two decades behind Moore's Law. The IBM PC, introduced about a year and a half earlier, has been revved up a thousandfold in performance since 1983. But the CD has whiled away the time, coasting on its Reagan-era breakthroughs in digital recording and storage. The two technologies, the PC and the CD, merged not long after their debuts—try to buy a computer without a disc player. But the relationship has become a dysfunctional one. The computer long ago outgrew its stagnant partner.

    To the new generation of music artists and engineers, "CD-quality sound" is an ironic joke. In recording studios, today's musicians produce their works digitally at resolutions far beyond the grainy old CD standard. To make the sounds listenable on antiquarian CD players, the final mix is retrofitted to compact disc specs by stripping it of billions of bits' worth of musical detail and dynamics. It's like filming a movie in IMAX and then broadcasting it only to black-and-white TV sets.

    It doesn't have to be this way. The modern recording studio is built around computers, Macs or PCs. Beefed up with high-performance analog-to-digital converters and super-sized disk drives, they digitize music up to 192,000 times per second, storing it as 24-bit data samples. That "192/24" standard captures more than a thousand times as much detail as the CD's "44.1/16" resolution. Moreover, this music data is just another computer file, an icon on a desktop. Double-click it, and it plays. It would play on your home computer, too, if you could get your hands on it. All you would need to enjoy studio-quality sound at home are high-end speakers or an amplifier with digital connections to your computer. That's the "digital hub" scenario touted by Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, and others. Plug everything into a home network, load up the computer with tunes, and press play from anywhere in the house. A three-minute pop song in 192/24 format fills about 200 megabytes of hard-disk space, which means Dell's latest 200-gigabyte drive could hold nearly a thousand of them.

    But instead of gearing up for digital home hubs, record companies have rolled out two more shiny-disc formats: DVD-Audio and Super Audio CD. Both sound great, but you're forgiven if you haven't heard of them. Following the radical makeover of consumer electronics in the past two decades, these discs have wandered in like Rip Van Winkle, unaware how behind the times they are.

    In sound quality, at least, each disc brings the listening experience up to modern standards. DVD-A, developed by an audio industry working group, pumps up the old CD format 500 to 1,000 times in data density to match that now used in studios. SACD, on the other hand, is based on a new form of digital recording developed by Sony and Philips that converts sound waves into bits (and back again) more smoothly. Both bring studio data to the listener, bit for bit, and include extra surround-sound channels for home-theater systems. Properly engineered, their improvement over CD sound is striking. Can the average person hear the difference? Instantly. As Fred Kaplan noted this past summer in Slate, it's enough to make you buy new speakers.

    Yet both kinds of discs, despite being developed in the 'Net-head late '90s, are odd throwbacks to the pre-PC era. Most obviously, they're the same size as the original CD. Can you name any other digital device that hasn't shrunk in 20 years? The players for them are bulky, closer in size to Sony's first CD decks than to Apple's iPod, which holds 400 albums rather than just one.

    Flip one of the players over, and you'll find another retro sight: analog output jacks. To prevent buyers from running off bit-for-bit copies of the new discs, gear-makers have agreed not to put digital ports on either DVD-A or SACD players. Yet old-fashioned analog connections erode pristine digital sound and are prone to interference from televisions, lights, and computers—the objects they'll be placed next to in modern homes.

    The real deal-breaker is that a stand-alone player is the only kind available. By manufacturers' consensus, there won't be any network ports on the players, nor will there be any DVD-A or SACD drives available for computers. Some makers are promising a digital link from the player to a home-theater console, but it'll be deliberately incompatible with any of the jacks on a computer. In bringing the CD up to date with the PC, the music industry is also trying to split the two technologies asunder again.

    It's no wonder that gearheads who buy the latest, greatest everything have ignored DVD-A and SACD in favor of MP3 players and CD burners. Computer-friendly music formats let you archive hundreds of albums on a laptop, create custom playlists that draw from your entire collection, and download them to portable players smaller than a single CD jewel box. Today's fans want their music in a form that fits the pocket-sized, personalized, interconnected world of their computers, cameras, phones, and PDAs. Asking digital consumers to give that power back in exchange for a better-sounding disc is like offering them a phonograph needle.

    Paul Boutin is a technology writer and reporter.
     
  2. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    If CDs sound so "bad", why do I enjoy listening to them so much?
     
  3. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    Not all CDs sound bad at all.
     
  4. Ed Bishop

    Ed Bishop Incredibly, I'm still here

    Uh...he's full of it, basically. Despite best attempts, the majors couldn't kill vinyl; CD's are too entrenched; SACD and DVD-Audio are probably destined to be audiophile-mainly formats, but they won't go away, either. The notion that all people want is music on their PC--with nothing to hold or touch, with sound quality obviously inferior to a good, well assembled analog audio system--is wishful thinking. All well and fine for teenagers and others who think everything's disposable, but the rest of us won't buy into it. To us TT's and carts and huge, full-range speakers aren't ancient technology; they're companions in a journey. PC's are nice for what they do, but I can't believe that outlook holds any water. Next they'll be saying the future of television is on the net. Methinks not.

    ED:cool:
     
  5. Jamie Tate

    Jamie Tate New Member

    Location:
    Nashville
    Nicely put. But does the general public even care? These people complain about VHS being phased out.

    I totally disagree. Most people can't tell the difference between mono and stereo. I got a song demo pitched to me last week by Sony publishing. I recorded and mixed this particular demo and was shocked that the CD Sony made for me was in mono. Nobody in the room noticed except me. Even when I pointed it out and they listened intently between the speakers they didn't know what I was talking about... and these are music industry people. We finally found the problem in their software. I think they saw the effort spent fixing the problem as wasted time.
     
  6. RetroSmith

    RetroSmith Forum Hall Of Fame<br>(Formerly Mikey5967)

    Location:
    East Coast
    Well, the Cd IS at the end of its marketing life cycle.

    I think the industry as a whole knows their profits are going to be in" on line " distribution, which is a small fixed caoist that has a MUCH higher profit margin than manufacturing anything and selling that product to distributors.

    For the first time, a title or band that might only sell 5,000 "copies" (now called downloads) becomes worth keeping and not dropping....to put their music on line for d/l cost them almost nothing.

    I expect the majors to set up "Oldies Want Web Sites" where every week, a different obscure artist or LP from theitr vaults becomes available for Download. Those tapes that have been sitting in the vault for 30 years will finally make some money for them.
     
  7. Ed Bishop

    Ed Bishop Incredibly, I'm still here

    Re: Re: "Put the Compact Disc Out of Its Misery" article. Comments?

    You're so right, Jamie. Not only does the average person not give mono or stereo any thought, neither do most label execs, apparently(not surprising; a lot of 'em started out as managers, agents or attorneys).
    People like us care, but we're such a small minority they could care less. The guys who do care--Steve, Bob Irwin, Little Walter, Ron Furmanek, Steve Kolanjian, the Bear Family and Ace UK gang, the late Bob Hyde--are responsible for most of the best sound and tape sources we'll ever have.
    The notion that kids ripping MP3's even notice sound quality is laughable.
    Redbook digital audio may have its limitations, but it's been proven you can get pretty fine sonics out of it despite that.

    I wouldn't trust Mr. Boutin's crystal ball much. As for the general public, they seem to have embraced DVD/VHS combo players. With DVD recorders coming down in price, why anyone would want both I can't imagine. If anybody can explain that one to me....

    ED:cool:
     
  8. Gary

    Gary Nauga Gort! Staff

    Location:
    Toronto
    To me, this sounds like the "new, modern" philosophy where the Pentium 1.8 Gig computer is outdated and a "boat anchor" because the Pentium 2.0 computer is out.

    Silly.

    My P166 is still going strong. I'm using it now.
     
  9. RetroSmith

    RetroSmith Forum Hall Of Fame<br>(Formerly Mikey5967)

    Location:
    East Coast
    Ed, its simple......People HAVE a lot of VHS tapes that they want to still play, AND there plenty of movies and TV shows that are not on DVD yet.

    Example "The Glen Miller Story" Fantastic movie. Great Soundtrack. Jimmy Stewart wins an emmy.

    The flick is only availabe on VHS.
     
  10. Michael

    Michael I LOVE WIDE S-T-E-R-E-O!

    I love all my Cee Dee's and they ain't going nowhere.
     
  11. R. Cat Conrad

    R. Cat Conrad Almost Famous

    Location:
    D/FW Metroplex
    The MP3 fad may have it's advantages for young folks on the move who aren't really interested in music unless it's disposable; of course the trade off is that too often modern music is viewed as disposable by almost everyone, including the record industry and hip fans, and as a result fewer and fewer bands are groomed and developed beyond their first album if they don't break big with their first release. These two elements probably play as much of a role in the gradual decline of record sales as the oft cited laments about possible illegal pirating.

    As with most things, including reality TV and politics, the pendulum has a tendency to swing back over time when folks age and history influences change. Eventually those teens and twenty somethings who dismiss audiophilia will look forward to relaxing in the luxury of their living room with high-end HT and listening systems with great sounding audio "status symbols" or driving in their comfortable hard earned Lexus-mobiles with classy futuristic stereo or surround sound systems playing well mastered CDs, SACDs or eventually DVD-As.

    Cat
     
  12. Michael

    Michael I LOVE WIDE S-T-E-R-E-O!

    I agree...:thumbsup:
     
  13. Ed Bishop

    Ed Bishop Incredibly, I'm still here

    Good point, Mikey, although I prefer the separate components; putting both together seems kinda pointless, but I guess people want convenience and don't care much about overall quality. Jamie's point, in a nutshell.

    The attempt to kill VHS has about as much chance of working as killing the CD. I can't share your outlook, that the format is going to fade away. Just not gonna happen, and it goes beyond what's available in one format isn't with another. As Michael says, his CD's ain't goin' nowhere; neither are mine. You can't invest the kind of cash most of us have in this stuff and think we're gonna embrace all this stuff inside a computer. It's funny how every time a format's doom is predicted, it almost never happens. 8-track was an exception, but something that inferior had obsolescence written all over it; just a matter of time.

    ED:cool:
     
  14. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    Don't tell the people who frequent 8trackheaven.com that 8-track is an inferior format, Ed.
     
  15. Jamie Tate

    Jamie Tate New Member

    Location:
    Nashville
    Re: Re: Re: "Put the Compact Disc Out of Its Misery" article. Comments?

    It's frustrating when you find out the music industry isn't being run by music people.:cry: The A&R guy I deal with at one label is a lawyer yet I have to take his advice on song selection and vocal takes. The fun part is he's easy to fool. If I want him to like a particular vocal take, I'll just edge it up a little louder and he'll pick it every time. :shh:
     
  16. Roland Stone

    Roland Stone Offending Member

    How many CD-playing devices are there between dedicated home stereos, boomboxes, portables, car stereos, computers, DVD players, alarm clocks, video game consoles and Bose-style one-box units? A hundred million? A billion?

    What is the casual consumer supposed to replace all those CD drives with? With memory sticks or tiny discs or a satellite connection that hooks all these things up to their home base computer? Sounds pretty complicated to me.

    The CD succeeded because it was transportable from the home to the car to the Walkman; sounded decent; and was relatively indestructible unless you did something stupid with it. I'm not sure any of these new technologies offer something beyond that. And I don't think incremental improvements in portability or sound quality are enough to launch a new format.
     
  17. Michael

    Michael I LOVE WIDE S-T-E-R-E-O!

    Re: Re: Re: Re: "Put the Compact Disc Out of Its Misery" article. Comments?

    Thats why your in the business your smarter than him...We need people like you! Great Job. The Music business is just that BUSINESS. We sometimes forget that. Money and sales..talent means nothing to them. MONEY talks!:thumbsup:
     
  18. lv70smusic

    lv70smusic Senior Member

    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    The guy obviously has an axe to grind and is struggling to support his opinions. The argument about the need for smaller discs doesn't even make sense from a compatibility or marketing standpoint, in my opinion.

    I'm not sure what he's trying to say anyway. He seems to be in favor of higher-resolution audio yet he wants it delivered via the Internet? The reason for mp3's existence was that it facilitated file swapping over the Internet. How long would it take to download a song sampled at 192K with 24 bit resolution? Even with a broadband connection this would be slow.

    I would still want a physical object anyway, even if technology had advanced to the point of transferring 60 minutes of DSD-quality audio to my hard drive in one minute.
     
  19. Dave

    Dave Esoteric Audio Research Specialist™

    Location:
    B.C.

    I love it Jamie![​IMG] Then hopefully you lower it back again.[​IMG]
    Keep up the good work![​IMG]:shh::laugh:

    I can't see the CD, vinyl, or SACD going anywhere right now. Sounds like wishfull thinking to me.
     
  20. lennonfan

    lennonfan New Member

    Location:
    baltimore maryland
    OK, I'll be first to say I -HATE- cd's. Always have, since I bought my first player in '83.
    At that time, we compared the MFSL 1st Doors to the cd counterpart...the cd sucked.
    It's true the cd had advantages over vinyl, but the sound quality just wasn't there for me. Even today, I'll grab the vinyl before I'll pluck down for the cd. Cd, to me, is a last resort format....I only get it if I just can't get it any other way (I don't bother with cassettes at all, except for my vehicles which still have that antiquated format..and all those are generally homemade jobs or cheapo 50 cent tapes I find at the flea market). I don't find any current cds that sound better than their vinyl counterparts, I bought the Hives' Veni Vidi Vicious as a cd first because there was no vinyl of it in this area, and when I snagged the vinyl off ebay, I was amazed at how much better it sounded, now the cd is a frisbee.
    I have no interest in storing music in a laptop, none at all. I love the hi-rez format of DVD-A and hope, that if they can't settle the format wars soon, that combo players become the standard so all hi-rez discs can be enjoyed regardless.
    I think cds stink, period.
     
  21. lennonfan

    lennonfan New Member

    Location:
    baltimore maryland
    I'd rather hear the 8-track than cd anytime. Even with the hiss and bandwidth compromise, the sound is warmer. Played on the 'cadillac', (akai cr80-dss), 8's are quite enjoyable and can kick booty without being strident like cds.
     
  22. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam

    Er, what Luke said!:righton:

    Bob:)
     
  23. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    You'll fit in right at 8-Track Heaven
     
  24. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    Lennonfan, you are, of course, also welcome here.
     
  25. lennonfan

    lennonfan New Member

    Location:
    baltimore maryland
    Oh, I've been there plenty over the last 6 years;)
    Just like the audiophiles here, they've often discussed which tape copies sound better on certain titles, they've waxed rhapsodic endlessly on THE FABS, and once upon a time they were very anti-big$ for titles and would often trade worthwhile stuff for peanuts.
    To this day, there are certain rarities that appear on 8 and nowhere else.
    Pink Floyd Animals has an extended Pigs on the wing, which has never appeared on any other formats of Animals. It did appear on a Snowy White cd comp recently but without the rest of the Animals album! The UK Dark Side quad smokes -EVERY- other version out there, and I have the MOFI, Jap Pro Use, quad vinyl, domestic (awful), UK and German presses. NONE can touch that quad tape, which is probably why the last one I saw on ebay went for over $700!
     
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