Queensrÿche - Operation: Mindcrime, what's the best sounding version?*

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by old school, Sep 19, 2010.

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  1. shaboo

    shaboo Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bonn, Germany
    As expected, the French Axe Killer Remaster is extremely compressed, but I'll have to give it another listen to see if it actually sounds as bad as the DR values look.

    ORIGINAL:

    foobar2000 1.2.9 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1
    log date: 2015-02-01 22:24:39
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Analyzed: Queensrÿche / Operation: Mindcrime
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    DR Peak RMS Duration Track
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    DR15 -10.19 dB -30.45 dB 1:18 01-I Remember Now
    DR12 -2.58 dB -16.26 dB 1:28 02-Anarchy-X
    DR13 -0.47 dB -15.58 dB 4:40 03-Revolution Calling
    DR14 -0.43 dB -15.87 dB 4:45 04-Operation: Mindcrime
    DR13 -0.60 dB -15.41 dB 3:43 05-Speak
    DR14 -0.56 dB -15.76 dB 4:07 06-Spreading The Disease
    DR13 -0.53 dB -15.27 dB 5:48 07-The Mission
    DR13 -0.46 dB -16.36 dB 10:40 08-Suite Sister Mary
    DR12 -0.94 dB -14.32 dB 3:09 09-The Needle Lies
    DR13 -1.01 dB -17.47 dB 1:23 10-Electric Requiem
    DR13 -0.53 dB -15.19 dB 4:34 11-Breaking The Silence
    DR13 -0.26 dB -15.45 dB 4:24 12-I Don't Believe In Love
    DR10 -9.54 dB -22.78 dB 1:06 13-Waiting For 22
    DR11 -5.33 dB -22.24 dB 1:32 14-My Empty Room
    DR12 -0.32 dB -14.78 dB 6:38 15-Eyes Of A Stranger
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Number of tracks: 15
    Official DR value: DR13
    Samplerate: 44100 Hz
    Channels: 2
    Bits per sample: 16
    Bitrate: 864 kbps
    Codec: FLAC
    ================================================================================

    AXE KILLER RELEASE:

    foobar2000 1.2.9 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1
    log date: 2015-02-01 22:24:19
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Analyzed: Queensrÿche / Operation: Mindcrime/Queen Of The Reich - Edition Collector De Luxe
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    DR Peak RMS Duration Track
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    DR15 -1.29 dB -21.37 dB 1:18 01-I Remember Now [Remastered 1999]
    DR7 -0.01 dB -8.18 dB 1:28 02-Anarchy-X [Remastered 1999]
    DR6 -0.01 dB -7.81 dB 4:40 03-Revolution Calling [Remastered 1999]
    DR7 -0.01 dB -8.04 dB 4:45 04-Operation: Mindcrime [Remastered 1999]
    DR7 -0.01 dB -7.60 dB 3:43 05-Speak [Remastered 1999]
    DR7 -0.01 dB -7.97 dB 4:07 06-Spreading The Disease [Remastered 1999]
    DR6 -0.01 dB -7.63 dB 5:48 07-The Mission [Remastered 1999]
    DR6 -0.01 dB -8.63 dB 10:40 08-Suite Sister Mary [Remastered 1999]
    DR6 -0.01 dB -6.82 dB 3:09 09-The Needle Lies [Remastered 1999]
    DR7 -0.01 dB -9.82 dB 1:23 10-Electric Requiem [Remastered 1999]
    DR7 -0.01 dB -7.56 dB 4:34 11-Breaking The Silence [Remastered 1999]
    DR7 -0.01 dB -7.75 dB 4:24 12-I Don't Believe In Love [Remastered 1999]
    DR10 -1.28 dB -13.92 dB 1:06 13-Waiting For 22 [Remastered 1999]
    DR9 -0.01 dB -13.93 dB 1:32 14-My Empty Room [Remastered 1999]
    DR6 -0.01 dB -7.32 dB 6:38 15-Eyes Of A Stranger [Remastered 1999]
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Number of tracks: 15
    Official DR value: DR7
    Samplerate: 44100 Hz
    Channels: 2
    Bits per sample: 16
    Bitrate: 980 kbps
    Codec: FLAC
    ================================================================================
     
  2. DiabloG

    DiabloG City Pop, Rock, and anything 80s til I die

    Location:
    United States
    Are there supposed to be band signatures in the liner notes of the original? I'm asking because I bought the original CD for $3 today and it looks like each band member autographed the final page in the booklet. The marks look genuine.
     
    Gus Tomato likes this.
  3. JPagan

    JPagan Generation 13

    Location:
    South Florida
    You're not. I've said this before – whether by accident or by design, the sound of the original CD fits the story to a tee. As I listen to the album, in my mind I see a classic film noir: black-and-white, stark, cold, unsettling. You might say it's making lemonade out of lemons; but I gotta tell ya, it's pretty damn tasty lemonade.
     
  4. Jimmy Agates

    Jimmy Agates CRAZY DOCTOR

    I'm with you 100%
     
  5. Simon_LDT

    Simon_LDT Forum Resident

    Location:
    England, UK
    Yeah, the original CD sounds great to me. Obviously it's production is not the best but it has a cool vibe about it, is supposed to be like that and to me it just sounds good.
     
  6. DiabloG

    DiabloG City Pop, Rock, and anything 80s til I die

    Location:
    United States
    :wave: Could anyone shed some light on this please?
    Oh yes; I am enjoying the original much more than the '03 remaster. The original is digital and sterile, but it's much more involving and dynamic. The RM is going to become some random dog's chew toy now. That's how bad it sounds IMO.
     
    Dynamic Ranger and Anonamemouse like this.
  7. Malina

    Malina Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC
    I only have the original. Normally I wouldn't notice sound quality issues, but this is just a horrible sounding recording.
     
    shirleyujest likes this.
  8. FVDnz

    FVDnz Forum Resident

    I think I'm going to track down the Burrn Legendary Masters for the two QR albums they did. Listening to the clarity of Tate's voice not to mention the clarity of the music has persuaded me to go ahead and do this.
     
    JediJoker likes this.
  9. Synthfreek

    Synthfreek I’m a ray of sunshine & bastion of positivity

    Mine has an autograph but I didn't get it autographed...it looks kinda real. Only 1 signature on the first page of the lyrics.
     
  10. Anonamemouse

    Anonamemouse my other pink shirt is black too

    I have a bunch of versions of Mindcrime, and the Burrn version is the best. Definitely worth the money.
     
    FVDnz and JediJoker like this.
  11. mmars982

    mmars982 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
  12. rscotta831

    rscotta831 Well-Known Member

    Has anyone tried the 2015 SHM-CD version?

    [​IMG]

    I've always found the SHM-CD versions of any album to be FAR superior than ANY other version available.

    If no one has yet, I have it ordered and will review when received.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2016
  13. rscotta831

    rscotta831 Well-Known Member

    So I received this version and as I was afraid of (due to the back cover), it is the SHM-CD version of the 2003 Remaster. On a spectrum analyzer, it looks nearly identical to the 2003 Remaster, so it's garbage.

    A crime (pun intended) they did not do a SHM-CD version of the original.

    Now awaiting my 1994 Burrn version from Japan.
     
    JediJoker likes this.
  14. rscotta831

    rscotta831 Well-Known Member

    Received my 1994 Burrn version from Japan. I can't tell any difference from the 1988 USA release.
     
  15. Cooks420

    Cooks420 Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY
    So, I'm assuming the original CD is still the way to go?
     
  16. krisjay

    krisjay Psychedelic Wave Rider

    Location:
    Maine
    Never going to be an audiophile dream. Saying that, the original vinyl is the best to my ears.
     
  17. van1

    van1 Forum Resident

    I originally got into Queensryche at the time Mindcrime was released. I dug out The original Mindcrime cd after a few years without listening to it. its still a great engaging concept that balance the narrative and music well, best appreciated on headphones, but I agree that the overall volume is low and has a flat sound.

    Given that's its 30 years old (which makes me feel old), and the improvements in technology, I'd love to see a remix (with 5.1 too) for this. I'm always hearing that technology means ok sounding CDs from 10-20 years ago now show greater clarity etc but this is something that needs more than a basic tidy up.

    A couple of related questions:

    Were the 'eyes of a stranger' or the 'overseeing the operation' records any better than the 60 minute album or was the damage done at mixing?

    I'm now 100% digital so how improved is Steve's DCC version if the follow up 'Empire'?

    What's on the Empire dvd-a as discogs has no description?

    Ta
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2018
  18. FVDnz

    FVDnz Forum Resident

    Steve's version of Empire is my go-to along with many other listeners in here. Highly recommended! As for Operation: Mindcrime, I concur - I welcome a 30th Anniversary remix and 5.1. I've even brought it up on their Facebook page and they reacted positively. Doesn't mean they'll do anything about it though. :p
     
    Anonamemouse likes this.
  19. sound chaser

    sound chaser Senior Member

    Location:
    North East UK.
    I would say that the original recording is a bit lean sounding which is a real shame for all that is going on and the complexity of the music.

    My way around this is that I tweak the original cd eq by adding a bit more bass and taking out some of the screechy mids, or you could do the reverse to the remaster :)
     
    FVDnz likes this.
  20. Vinyl Fan 1973

    Vinyl Fan 1973 "They're like soup, they're like....nothing bad"

    The original Operation LIVE-crime, is my go to when wanting to hear this masterpiece. I actually prefer the live versions to the studio version of the album. The songs are played a little faster, and sound beefed up.
     
    Silver1973 likes this.
  21. Metalrob

    Metalrob Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sweden
    I did not know Hoffman mastered Empire.But i can not see how he could better the original "Bob Ludwig".
     
  22. gary191265

    gary191265 Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    I'm no Hoffman fanboy (far from it, in fact) but the DCC Empire blows the original out of the water. There is literally no comparison.
     
  23. LEONPROFF

    LEONPROFF Forum Resident

    The DVD-A has the album in hi-Rez stereo and 5.1 surround. I don’t listen to Empire much anymore.
     
    JediJoker likes this.
  24. Natvecal.

    Natvecal. JUST A LOW- FI GUY WHO LOVES A GREAT MASTERING

    Location:
    Oceanside,CA.
    Seeing them live playing this album in it's entirety:D.It was great!:uhhuh:
    Sorry had to put that out there........
    I had this on cassette when released and never on CD. I thought it sounded great(in the day) but, now I'm curious about why "Bad" production/sound is being used here and there for just the CD? Or the production period no matter the format it's on?Cold sounding would fit this cold-vibed story line(even the "love" for Mary was a "Cold Love" IMHO. It is a cold album.:shrug:
     
    old school likes this.
  25. Natvecal.

    Natvecal. JUST A LOW- FI GUY WHO LOVES A GREAT MASTERING

    Location:
    Oceanside,CA.
    Wow, I guess I lucked out when getting my cassette when released.
     
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