Re-wrapped CDs sold as "NEW"

Discussion in 'Marketplace Discussions' started by Joy-of-radio, Nov 10, 2015.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Please refer to my first reply to you - I am not questioning the motivation of a person like you who wants to buy accurately described merchandise.
     
  2. Joy-of-radio

    Joy-of-radio Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Central ME
    I understand this very well having purchased imports. I'll use Bear Family as an example; I used to buy a lot of their product from an eBay dealer who specifically stated in his item description that items may not be shrink-wrapped, but are guaranteed brand-new as evidenced by my careful inspection under strong narrow direct light upon arrival. In the United States however, it's very uncommon for brand-new CDs not to be precisely wrapped before leaving their factories. The precision of such wrapping is clearly evident with very precise corner folds on the top and bottom of the cases, which are very difficult to replicate as opposed to the sloppy homebrew efforts to shrink-wrap by unscrupulous dealers trying to pawn off used product as "NEW".
     
  3. rjp

    rjp Senior Member

    Location:
    Ohio
    i worked at shop in the 90's in which the owner re-sealed....he would re-seal things he bought used for $2 - $3 and sell them new for $12 - $15........quite few customers caught on, and we (the employees) did not dispel their summations. it was the beginning of the end for that store, as he closed not long after that.

    also, time traveler in akron was doing this too, also very noticeable. i personally saw a couple that i traded in myself. he also began a very quick demise once this started happening.
     
    Joy-of-radio likes this.
  4. Malina

    Malina Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC
    What I do is remove the cellophane and then use a razor blade to cut across the top of the case. This won't damage the case, but it cuts the seal in half, then it's much easier to pull off the two halves without leaving residue on the case.
     
    Joy-of-radio likes this.
  5. Malina

    Malina Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC
    See my method above, it works very well. As to why we have them in the US, I guess we have more criminals in the US who like to reseal stuff. I've even received reseals with the top seal still intact because they use the flip up the bottom hinge trick. Compact Disc World in New Jersey used to pull this scam.
     
    Joy-of-radio likes this.
  6. Maggie

    Maggie like a walking, talking art show

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    I think how common this is has been overstated. It has happened to me a couple of times, it's true. However, i think most of the time that Amazon sellers -- or even Amazon itself -- sell "NEW" product in this condition, it's because they are selling UK-sourced product (which is almost never sealed) sealed for export. These items, often from Germany, Italy, or France by way of the UK, are almost always heat-sealed (shrink wrapped) rather than wrapped in y-fold cellophone. Some are left unsealed when they leave their country of origin for customs reasons. And, of course, for stuff in unusual cases -- such as DCC or Audio Fidelity or Mobile Fidelity releases -- you basically can't tell for sure.

    I have actually received sealed Y-fold stuff that looked like reseal too -- stuff with fingerprints on the disc and/or booklet. I assume this was because of mishandling in the factory, and it was from Amazon itself, not a third party seller.
     
  7. Joy-of-radio

    Joy-of-radio Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Central ME
    I want to emphasize that getting rewraps happens to me when purchasing long OOP items. I'd estimate at least 30% are rewrapped used CDs. This has never happened when buying in-print items from Amazon or its Marketplace dealers. I keep a log of those dealers who do me right and those who do me wrong. As I said, I seem to have resolved this issue by simply writing the Marketplace dealers beforehand and asking them to verify packaging details. I suspect those dealers who are unresponsive to my inquiries are probably engaging in fraudulent practices. Recently I did get an answer back from an Amazon Marketplace dealer who described perfectly a rewrap. I knew how the disc was originally packaged having previously owned a copy.

    Incidentally, I appreciate member Malina's tip for removing the sticky labels from the tops of jewel cases. GOLLY SARG! It works! I wish I had known this years ago. Thank you.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2015
    Malina likes this.
  8. Maggie

    Maggie like a walking, talking art show

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    I don't know what you're buying, but that figure seems unbelievable. I too buy mostly OOP stuff (why else would I be buying from a third-party seller?) and the number of suspicious items I've gotten has been way lower than that. Like in the order of 2 or 3%, if that. I've gotten more CD-Rs than reseals TBH.

    Discs are packaged differently in different parts of the world. Color and type of jewel case, presence or absence of hype stickers, presence or absence of white barcode sticker, and yes, presence or absence of wrapping vary depending on territory. And the longer an item has been OOP, the older it is likely to be, and if it's Euro sourced, the less likely it was to have been wrapped on initial manufacture and the more likely it is to have shelf wear.

    A lot of Euro sourced stuff in shrink wrap has actually been wrapped simply to make the stuff more presentable to US importers and buyers. Most European consumers don't expect that kind of antiseptically pristine condition from new CDs. Or at least they didn't until about 15 years ago.

    Look, I am just as obsessive as you seem to be about condition and original provenance. One of the busiest threads I ever started was a consumer advisory along these lines ( http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...ng-re-pressed-as-cd-rs-list-them-here.444883/ ). However, the scenario you describe doesn't sound credible to me based on what I know of the international CD trade. Most of the third-party sellers on Amazon are high-volume dealers blowing out warehouses full of stuff acquired from the original manufacturer or from shuttered bricks-and-mortar shops. Their pricing is often automatic and their customer service people often don't have access to their warehouses.
     
    Lost In The Flood likes this.
  9. Joy-of-radio

    Joy-of-radio Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Central ME
    I hear ya, and I don't doubt you. Perhaps I've had a very unlucky streak lately. I don't want to come off as a whiner. I'm happy to report that my positive experiences greatly outnumber the negative ones. I'm not trying to alarm folks either. I detailed how I'm endeavoring to circumvent this obvious and growing problem and want others to enjoy joyful and fulfilling CD shopping experiences, especially with regard to OOP items.
     
    Maggie likes this.
  10. curbach

    curbach Some guy on the internet

    Location:
    The ATX
    Exactly what I was thinking. But never underestimate the power of OCD :laugh:
     
    dkmonroe likes this.
  11. Spanish Prisoner

    Spanish Prisoner Forum Resident

    Location:
    Central New Jersey

    Absolutely. The entire issue here is that the disc has been misrepresented, not that a used copy won't perform as well as a new copy.

    I buy plenty of used cd's that are lightly scratched and smudged on the playing side, and the vast majority play fine. But, unless the disc is rare, the price is generally lower for discs in this condition.
     
    Joy-of-radio likes this.
  12. Jasonb

    Jasonb Forum Resident

    I think I'm with you on this one. I stick a CD in the player, I never look at it, it plays perfectly. That's all I'm looking for.
     
    dkmonroe likes this.
  13. Malina

    Malina Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC
    9 times out of 10 or more an in print cd is cheaper from a third party seller on Amazon.com than from Amazon itself. I don't think Amazon wants to be selling cd's. They want to sit back and take their cut. Sometimes a third party seller has an oop cd that is Fulfillment By Amazon so it's free shipping when you hit 35 bucks. I have to go through my Wish List of in print cd's with a ton of cd's in there hunting to find something cheaper on Amazon - not easy!
     
  14. Spanish Prisoner

    Spanish Prisoner Forum Resident

    Location:
    Central New Jersey
    I used to work in the music department of a Borders, and that was the trick that our music manager showed us in order to open a CD that we didn't have a promo of in order to play for a customer.

    We had a re-wrap machine in the back of the store and would periodically re-wrap these CD's, mark them down and place them out for sale.
     
  15. Malina

    Malina Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC
    Amazing. Don't these people realize this is fraud and it's a criminal act? That's what I told the seller I was complaining about. At first I got attitude, then I got an apology and an offer to send every cd I bought from him going back two years for a full refund plus my return shipping. I'm sending back stuff that is still sealed from 2014 because I think they are reseals and open stuff that are reseals. Cry me a river, con artist.
    ______________

    Hello,

    Please reframe from ordering from us in the future.
    Full refund has been issued.
    I have already contacted Amazon about the issue,
    We will not accept any more orders from you.
    _______________

    Me: Are you out of your mind? Fraud is illegal. This cd was ordered before I caught on to to you and I just got it yesterday. You're lucky I'm not pushing this further.
    ____________

    Me: Resealing used cd's and selling them as new is a criminal act.
    ______________

    We do not re-seal anything.

    we buy and sell like any other business struggling to make a living.
    If you think that's what we do, or you are not happy with your items you bought from us, please don't purchase from us again.
    I can offer you can refund on ALL your orders you've ever placed with us
    (even the ones older than 90 days)
    If you still have them please send to: ....

    Reply with tracking info, and I will issue a full refund including S&H charges.

    P.S.
    I didn't mean to offend you with my previous email,
    I admit it may have came off too strong, I apologize.
     
    Joy-of-radio and Dave S like this.
  16. Spanish Prisoner

    Spanish Prisoner Forum Resident

    Location:
    Central New Jersey
    I think there's a huge difference between a store re-sealing a CD and marking it down and someone on Amazon listing a re-sealed CD as new.

    The fact is a re-sealed CD is easily identified, and it had a lower price, so I don't really see the problem.

    Would it have been more ethical for the opened CD to have been simply marked down, maybe. I don't think anyone would buy an obviously re-sealed CD, that's been marked down with the expectation that it is brand new.
     
    Maggie likes this.
  17. Malina

    Malina Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC
    I'm not sure what you mean by "easily identified". How would a buyer know it's marked down and could the buyer just think it's a sale? What might be easily identified to someone like us might not be easily identified by the average person who buys a couple cd's a year. I think if cd's are being opened, played and then resealed that should be specifically noted. "Store copy, previously played." or something along those lines.
     
    Joy-of-radio likes this.
  18. classicanders

    classicanders Active Member

    If you bought these through Amazon did you have to pay the $4 shipping charge ten times?

    I am actually pretty annoyed with some of the third part sellers I buy from when an item comes not as advertised (or resealed CDs) I will tell them about it and they will not reply to emails. I'd have to resort to the A-Z dispute and I think you are only allowed a certain number of them.
     
    Joy-of-radio likes this.
  19. Spanish Prisoner

    Spanish Prisoner Forum Resident

    Location:
    Central New Jersey
    Malina, this occurred more than 15 years ago. I actually don't remember if there was any notification on the sticker to identify the CD as previously played.

    I think you're missing the point here. The reason these CD's were opened in the first place was at a customer's request, when there was no promo available. If the customer decided to buy the CD, that we opened at their request, they obviously paid full price. If they didn't buy the CD, it went into a stack, which was periodically re-sealed and marked down.

    These resealed CD's had a different appearence than a factory sealed CD. Any customer who was not visually impaired should have been able to tell the difference.

    Again, I didn't set this policy, But, I don't think this compares in any way to someone selling a resealed CD on Amazon as a new CD. That is completely different.
     
  20. Malina

    Malina Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC
    I paid shipping charges on all of them because I was buying from a third party seller. My shipping charges are going to be refunded - this guy is afraid of me because we are in the same state and I told him I'm an attorney. I was wondering about a limit on the A-Z thing - I've only used it a few times after having an issue with the seller. I make so many complaints that I go through the seller first because I'm concerned that Amazon might ban me. I'm showing about 800 orders starting from 2013 and I'm constantly having problems, used reseals sold as new, cutouts not listed as cutouts, the wrong cd - I think that covers it. Almost always the sellers responds quickly with - sorry and keep it. Between Ebay and Amazon I'm probably close to 100 freebees the past few years.

    Just yesterday I got the wrong cd from an Amazon seller. After I sent my complaint email they actually sent me a picture of the cd that they mailed me sitting on the mailing slip - amazing! She told me they do that for inventory control and to keep it and the correct cd would be coming to me and please don't hold it against them. The day before that I got another wrong cd from an Amazon seller and they told me to keep it as well. That's a good one too that I'm happy to add to my collection. A Sony big band comp, it was supposed to be a Time Life big band comp.

    Also yesterday from Ebay a seller sent me a cutout not listed as a cutout (said she didn't notice a big spine cut) and she also sent me a 3 cd set with no booklet. I almost always buy new but the one with no booklet was used. She is giving me a hard time because I am request a prepaid label for the return on the cutout. My complaint email always says, "Please send me a prepaid return label and I will drop this in the mail to you." I'm not going to the post office and standing in line because they did not do their job. Sometimes this turns into a fight, but I always win and do not give negative feedback - maybe done that twice.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2015
    Joy-of-radio and classicanders like this.
  21. Malina

    Malina Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC
    First, I'm not blaming you or calling you a bad guy. You're just doing your job and don't make store policy. I'm not missing the point, I understand exactly what you're saying. One thing I'm not sure about is what happens when you open the copy? Do you then give it to the customer who walks over to a listening area and puts the disc in the player? How does this all happen? My opinion is that if these are reseal jobs then they should segregated in a small section where it is specifically noted, "Store play copies, mint condition, marked down price." or something along those lines. Marking it down without explaining why it is marked down is lying by omission.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2015
    Joy-of-radio likes this.
  22. Spanish Prisoner

    Spanish Prisoner Forum Resident

    Location:
    Central New Jersey
    We had a listening station at the music customer service desk. So, if someone asked to listen to a CD that we didn't have a promo of, we opened it on the bottom hinge, leaving the top seal unbroken and put the CD on for them.

    If they decided to buy CD, we took them up to the front register and they paid full price. If they didn't buy it, the CD went into a stack or a drawer and at a later time was re-sealed and marked down.

    From my recollection, the re-seal never looked identical to a factory seal.
     
  23. classicanders

    classicanders Active Member

    Thanks for the detailed write up. I was curious if there was some way to combine shipping with third party sellers.
     
    Malina likes this.
  24. Malina

    Malina Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC
    Come on bro, that is a straight up con game! That's is why you leave the topseal intact. It is an attempt to mislead. This is the scam that my local store used to pull on me and I didn't catch it for awhile until I got wise. The reseal in shrinkwrap (heat seam) is not the same as cellophane (Y fold) but your average citizen does not catch it. It fooled me.
     
    Joy-of-radio likes this.
  25. Spanish Prisoner

    Spanish Prisoner Forum Resident

    Location:
    Central New Jersey
    Please don't call me "Bro".

    Once again, I'm simply relating what was done at the direction of the Music manager. Let me reiterate the fact that the re-sealed CD never looked identical to a factory sealed CD. I can't stress that enough, so if you could not differentiate between the two, then that's on you.

    Would it have been better to simply mark the CD down, maybe. Would it have been a better policy to not open CD's for customer to preview, maybe. But, no one forced the customer to buy the re-sealed CD at a lower price in our store. They had the choice.

    I don't think this compares to a seller on AMAZON resealing a CD and selling it as new. That, clearly is wrong.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine