Record Cleaning using Mobile Fidelity products

I have used numerous products over the years and for the last couple settled on Disc Doctor followed by 2 washes with distilled water and a finishing with MFSL's Record Wash. However I've never been totally ahppy with the results. Even with 3 washes following the DD sometime a film remains.

During a conversation with a Music Direct salesman, he strongly suggested leaving the MFSL Deep Cleaner on for 2-3 minutes. Based on this, I've changed my cleaning method. Using the following method records that have previously had been cleaned and still have surface sound, now play silent. It does require a RCM.

1. Liberally wet the record with MFSL's Deep Cleaner and using a VPI bristle brush, spread the liquid using a steady even pressure for 3/4 revolutions. Avoid brushing on the dead wax simply because the brush will leave fine marks.

2. Shut the machine and wait 2/3 minutes for the liquid to work. Turn the RCM back on and again scrub the record with the VPI Brush for 3/4 revolution.

3. Suck up the liquid for 3 revolutions.

4. If possible switch to a second vacumn tube before the next step.

5. Wet the record using MFSL's Record Wash and using either a MFSL or DD velvet brush, spread the liquid for 3/4 revolutions and then suck up the liquid.

Every record that I have done this with comes out playing at least 90% quieter than before. Plus I don't have the sudsy mess that DD created.

Last night I played what appeared to be a mint copy of Curtis Mayfield's "Curtis Live" which previously after cleaning with my original DD method still sounded like rice crispies. After using the above outlined method it now sounds like listening to a tape. BTW this is one great and well recorded LP.

 

Tommy,

I'm guessing that the MFSL cleaning fluids that you are referring to are the Record Research Lab (RRL) fluids that are now branded MFSL. I use the same fluids with excellent results.



Ed Hurdle
HeavyDistortion

 

Yep, the real secret is leaving the Deep Cleaner on 2/3 minutes, to allow it to work.

 

If some of the magic in that cleaner are enzymes, then time is needed for them to work. I am currently doing lab work with amylase enzymes but also checked out info on protease which I assume is what's in those cleaners. Yeah, they don't do much in 30 seconds if we are discussing stubborn or difficult cleaning.

 

The salesman is right, you MUST leave the Deep Cleaner on a number of minutes. The Deep Cleaner will have done nothing if it is removed as soon as you apply it. I usually wait at least 3 minutes, depending on the muck, sometimes 5 minutes. With any vinyl side needing an extended soak, I will wash the side twice with the DC. With those products (vinyl willing) I get CD quiet backgrounds. I love the RRL fluids, ahem, I mean MOFI fluids.

 

I had a great experience with a really dirty copy of Zen Arcade. I did the Super Deep MFSL wash, left it for about 5 minutes, did the regular MFSL wash, left it 2 minutes, then did a good distilled water rinse. With 4 sides to do, it took me a good half hour but now those records are clean as a whistle with hardly any surface noise.

 

Understand that the SRW is just the final step in the two step cleaning process, the final wash. There is no point to another rinse with distilled water after the SRW. The SRW is triple distilled, double ionized and has received UV treatment to kill all bacteria and enzymes. Odds are you are probably reintroducing something back to the surface of the vinyl with the distilled water wash after the SRW. Just a thought.

 

I recently bought a bottle of the MOFI enzyme cleaner since I noticed the Super Deep and standard cleaners weren't getting all the gunk off. I'll try waiting longer during cycles during my next cleaning session.

Eric

 

We're talking about the Deep Cleaner here and not the Plus Enzyme Cleaner, right? Because the enzyme cleaner clearly instructs the user to leave it on 3-5 minutes before vacuuming, while the Deep Cleaner does not. I only use the enzyme cleaner with really mucked up vinyl, of which I don't have many. I've never heard about benefits of leaving the Deep Cleaner on for several minutes until this thread. Interesting. Anyway, just wanted to clarify.

 

I'm pretty sure there aren't enzymes in the Deep Cleaner.

 

Yes, definately leave the Super Deep Cleaner sitting on the record for a number of minutes prior to vacuuming. You are right Sam, it does not specify a waiting time prior to vacuuming on the label, but allowing it to sit and work on the vinyl for a number of minutes is how it was designed to be used.

 

If the solution is kept on the records for 3 minutes or so, does it dry up. And if so, what do you do then. I read that you should not let any cleaning solution dry on a record because it will be hard to remove.

 

..

 

I can't recall, we may have touched on this subject before. Depending on the purity of water used as a final pass/rinse, it may well be beneficial. The SRW still has low levels of surfactant and a stylus lubricant. Mobile Fidelity themselves recommends their utra pure rinse for exactly this reason-it is just ultra pure water.

I like the Super Deep and have used it for a few years. The SRW I've dispensed with entirely as I have unlimited access to ultrapure water. IMO (and some others have experienced this as well-although you'll also find those that can hear no difference) the SRW leaves an undersirable sonic signature that ultrapure water does not, rolling off highs and masking detail. So it may well be worth experimenting with high purity water in place of the SRW.

With respect to keeping the fluid on a record for a few minutes, I agree that better results will be obtained this way. Depending on humidity levels when cleaning, that may be easier said than done, but it's worth doing as suggested.

 

I use the Deep Cleaner, but don't have a RCM yet. I always just use one of my MOFI soft record brushes to put it on, but I take it right back off. I will try waiting a few minutes and see how it goes. I worry about it drying up though.

Pat

 

The key is the use of an enzyme cleaner I am told.

Another alternative and my current fave is the Audio Intelligent line.

Walker Audio also gets good reviews.

 

Tommy, I will have to give MFSL a try, I have been using DD and at times get rice crispy sounds from it, always assumed I did not rinse well enough. When you say the VPI bristle brush (Step 1), I assume you mean the thing with the wood back and what looks like nylon bristles. Is that correct? If so, is that the brush you scrub with in Step 2? I would be reluctant to scrub with it, it seems to stiff and I would be afraid of scratching the vinyl in the grooves. Please help me understand on this point.

 

Tommy, Thanks for sharing your experience here. I'm going to try this method asap. I bought a VPI 16.5 about a year ago and have been less than enthusiastic with the results.......I've tried Disc Doctor, and the Mobile Fidelity was, but have never left it on for a few minutes. I also have been mostly using the DD brush, over the VPI brush during the 1st cycle. I'll check out the VPI brush........I'm always wondering as I'm cleaning then forget to ask here. Do most of you just press firmly with the brush and leave it in one spot while the platter spins, or do you scrub back and forth while the platter spins?

 

Tommy:

Thanks for the tip. I've been using the RRL/MoFi Deep Cleaner and Record Wash with good results, but I've generally allowed the Deep Cleaner to sit only for about 30 seconds. I usually use a DD brush to scrub it in rather than the VPI brush (which I use at the rinse stage). I'll give your technique a try.

 

Thanks for pointing that out Blake. Well it seems with the MOFI products it is an evolving process, which to me is a good thing. You are right in that the SRW is in fact a very mild version of the SDC. I had gotten myself a bit turned around on that....I definately don't want to be misleading anyone. This record cleaning business can get a bit crazy!

What Tom had mentioned about the enzyme cleaner has got me curious. So after talking with MD today, I am going to change my methods a bit. I am going to try out first using the MOFI Plus Enzyme Cleaner followed by the SRW then a final step with the MOFI Pure Record Rinse. And depending on the record, I may or may not use the SRW as a second step. It was recommended to me to definately be using the PEC on new vinyl as well as used.

 

Tommy, thanks for the update. Although I have been using Audio Intelligent cleaners, I don't think I have been leaving the cleaner on long enough, since I was still getting a lot of hash. I will try the MFSL Deep Cleaner.

 

Jim Pendleton, the Audio Intelligent guy, told me to leave the cleaner on 2-3 minutes. I tend to do 2-2.5. It seems to work fine. I may try the MFSL soon.

 

I've had the same problems using DD. So I used the method tommytunes suggested with MFSL products. Excellent, the difference is unbeliveable. Soundwise its like a veil was lifted off the records and most of the rice crispies cleared up.

 

Well I have now been using the new fluids I bought from Music Direct for a couple weeks now, and I am convinced these new fluids and methods are the best I have found yet.

Previously I had been using the MOFI Super Deep Cleaner and Super Record Wash as a two step cleaning process. Now that the MOFI Pure Record Rinse and Plus Enzyme Cleaner are available I have included them in the process, and I have dropped the SDC.

So, now I am starting with the PEC on both new and used records. Once on the record, leaving it to soak for 3 minutes. I then use the Super Record Wash as the second step, then a final rinse with the Pure Record Rinse.

I cannot believe the differences I am hearing. It is now clear to me that records that have not received this new treatment have some of the high frequency detail masked. Where I am hearing the biggest improvements is in microdynamics, the subtle shading and harmonics now really being exposed, coming through as never before. On a few records so far, something interesting has now been brought out as well. Some of the odd things within the mix, such as having a soundstage within a soundstage (sorry, don't know how else to explain it). I can now plainly hear the different acoustical environment one player has from another in the mix. If it was coming through before, I never noticed it like now.

This has been one of the cheapest, and best upgrades to my listening, ever. This is really sending home the idea of how important it is to having an extremely clean record. Having a clean record is EVERYTHING.

 

I just use the mofi super record wash with my 16.5. I'm not doubting the two step would be better, i just like the one step and most records look and sound great