Rega introduces the new Rega Planar 6 Turntable

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by btf1980, Jul 15, 2017.

  1. gov

    gov Active Member

    Location:
    NYC
    Listened to one of these yesterday so I'll offer a few thoughts from a non-rega guy who doesn't espouse audiophilac terms ;) ...
    • Finish is VERY nice--much nicer than photos and IMO, the nicest Rega I've seen (seen all recent except RP10)
    • Heard it with an 20x2--it was much more nuanced than other rega's i've heard. Less forward and driving if that makes sense. Most Rega's I've heard have been a bit to "headed off the rails" for my tastes--exciting at first but for me, that excitement has seemed to fade over more extended time spent with it. This one feels different (for better or worse).
    • Build quality looked great--the subplatter looks solid
     
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  2. Rix__MIX

    Rix__MIX Member

    Location:
    UK
    I'm kinda tempted by this, but the reported issue with Ortofon cartridges is an annoyance. Apparently the tonearm needs to be raised to accommodate them, a spacer can be purchased but by having the spacer in place results in the counter weight hitting the lid when the lid is closed.

    As I am planning on keeping my Ortofon Bronze for a while, this is not ideal. A new counter weight could be purchased.. but on a table of this cost, it's not really a work around I'd feel happy about.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2017
  3. Shivermetimbers

    Shivermetimbers Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
  4. Drewan77

    Drewan77 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    UK
    Two small silicone dots on the rear corners (as used on cupboard doors) will raise the cover sufficiently to clear the counterweight if a 2mm shim is used for an Ortofon 2M.
     
  5. David Carr

    David Carr Member

    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    New counterweight is reprofiled so that it is less likely to come in to contact with the dustcover when shimming. You should be able to use a 2mm shim (appropriate for Ortofon) without any clearance issues. BTW, I've heard from plenty of authorities that you don't need a shim with Ortofon, and if you do shim it is very minimal.
     
    displayname likes this.
  6. David Carr

    David Carr Member

    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    Listened to a P6/Ania last night for a few hours. I thought it was nicely balanced, no edge or sibilance. Enough excitement up top to be interesting but not hyped up. Great body and dimensionality. Very 'mature' sounding.
     
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  7. David Carr

    David Carr Member

    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    It really is quite pretty. I was pleasantly surprised at how good the finish looks in person. Two thumbs up.
     
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  8. Dan Steele

    Dan Steele Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Chicago suburbs
    What do you think so far?
     
  9. GoldprintAudio

    GoldprintAudio Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lexington, NC
    This is great to hear! (about the new weight with shims) I've not tried to put any other cart on the P6's I have yet....so good to know for the future.

    As an fyi, having installed quite a few Ortofons on Rega's in the past, yes you can run without shims. But, if asked, Ortofon will tell you that you do need to shim on a Rega table.
     
    David Carr likes this.
  10. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    This is ludicrous. The Ortofon 2M series have a tip to mounting surface dimension of 18mm and the Rega carts are 14mm tall. This is a difference of 4mm, which might as well be a mile in cartridge VTA adjustment terms. Right now my cartridge is sensitive to 1/2mm changes and is running at level +1/2mm, which would mean a 4-1/2mm shim.
    If Rega would like to build an adjustable height tonearm with some allowance in the cover and counterweight I might be tempted to give them a try.
    Cartridges dimensions chart
     
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  11. revolversoul

    revolversoul Active Member

    Location:
    NOVA
    Just received mine today! Upgrading from a U-Turn Orbit (Let's keep it civil). I was looking at other options, but then after reading up on the Rega's, and thought I would give this one a go. I ordered it with the Exact cartridge, and in the little testing I have done tonight, I am happy with the purchase.

    I have only played a couple of albums, Dean Martin - Dream with Dean (Mono), and From Elvis In Memphis, and the sound is excellent! The vocals on DWD were clear, and right in front. Sounded like Deano was in the room. FEIM is probably one of my favorite Elvis albums, and it just bowled me over how great the vocals were, and how strong the instruments came across.

    Will do some more listening tomorrow, but so far, I am really glad I went with the P6.
     
  12. Mazzy

    Mazzy Forum Resident

    And it will only get better. Give it 30 plus hours
     
    jon9091 likes this.
  13. Dhreview16

    Dhreview16 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London UK
    Rega and Elvis in Memphis....doesn't get much better than that ! Nice one.
     
  14. emjel

    emjel Active Member

    Location:
    Liverpool
    Elvis and Rega. Great combo. I think you have sold me on the idea of upgrading my turntable now. Do you have Elvis Is Back? Two great albums from the start and end of the 60s.
     
  15. revolversoul

    revolversoul Active Member

    Location:
    NOVA
    I do have Elvis is Back as well, and that one will be on the playlist today.
     
  16. David Carr

    David Carr Member

    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    You've not got it quite right. The body height is not the factor we are adjusting, although it can be a rough guide. The body height does not take into account the actual motor/cantilever/stylus alignment within the body. Also, so stylus profiles are pickier about SRA/VTA than other.

    Proving my point, I was listening to a Planar 6 with a Quintet Black loaded, no spacers. Had one of the guys from Ortofon sitting right there with me. We both agreed that the deck/cartridge sounded great.
     
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  17. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    I have it absolutely right- nominal height of the Ortofon is 18mm tip to mounting surface, nominal height of the Rega carts is 14mm mounting surface to stylus tip.
    No matter how you slice it, mounting an Ortofon Cadenza on a Rega turntable without a tonearm spacer results in a nominal 4mm tail down installation.
    The setup may sound very good but there is not even a small chance that a shibata stylus profile cartridge is setup to sound its best at nominal 4mm tail down. The potential of this cartridge is being wasted.
     
  18. stonecold

    stonecold Member

    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    I've got a an Ortofon Bronze mounted on my Rega without spacers and enjoy the sound. Would you be able to describe what I'm most likely missing when it comes to sound quality without the spacer?
     
  19. Nick Stylidis

    Nick Stylidis New Member

    Location:
    Greece
    Hallo from Greece.
    I bought the first P6 that has been sold in my country, just a few days ago.
    For the past 16 years my companion was the remarkably good Rega P25 with RB 600 tonearm. After several attempts with various cartridges (Rega exact - Ortofon 2m black- Clearaudio etc) i decided that the best was for me the Benz Micro Ace S 0.4 output.
    I decided to buy the P6 and continue with Benz. When i saw the neo power supply and the new plater and sub-platter of the p6 i thought that it was worth the extra money and the upgrade should be a serious one.
    Please notice that i had no speed problems or any other kind with my p25. Furthermore i have my own kit of adjusment including a Shure stylus force gauge and the Test record from analague audio association. Everything worked quite well. I had to add a 6mm spacer to my P25 in order to fit the Benz at the correct VTA.

    Anyway, back to P6. The promo photos don't come close to how good the p6 actually looks. The grey polaris is truly unique. Mostly the feel of the platter when you touch it. No fingerprints and antiscrath resistance! Nice!
    The RB 330 has also a very smooth look with this mat black.
    I was suprised when i found out that i had to use only one 2mm spacer in order to achieve the perfect VTA for my Benz micro. Without problems of counterweight hitting the lid. But have in mind that this is how far you can go. The propably use a different (taller) base for this tonearm or the body of the Ania rega cartridge is taller that the average (short) rega cartridge. I don't know.

    Anyway i used only the rega protactor to find the right angle, i find the neutral point of the tonearm and had to add a little weight when i measured at 1.75 with the shure gauge. So far so good. Then for the last step, the antiskating, the problem arose. I couldn't measure it! The tonearm kept going towards to the label. I used the the "blank zone" of my test record of course.

    Back to the rega dealer. Same there with his test record. In the end he told me that the problem should be on the benz because of the rebuid i recently did. This was made by Benz through its official distributor in greece. I have no other cartridge right now to see what will happen with it.
    Anyway, back at home i tried a different method of finding the weight. Without the shure gauge. Just find the neutral point of the toneram, then apply the weight via the spring load of the tonearm at 1.75. Finally try to find what happens with the antiskating. Hey! It works. The tonearm stands is resting in the same place inside the blank zone! Well, not quite, not always, but things are much improved now. At least sometimes it stands still. Needless to say that i must put it at 2, the maximum, in order to have the best possible results. Oh, the turntable is absoletuly in horizontal position.
    The thing is that with the same cartridge i had no problem at all with my p25.....

    Mr David Carr shall i start to worry?? Any thoughts? Is the RB 600 much superior from the RB 300 and because of that, this mess was created?

    Finally i have to say that the sound of the P6 it is improved in comparison with the P25. What it worries me is the future and if my quite expensive cartridge is damaged because of the lack of the perfect antiskating adjustment.
     
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  20. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    The bronze has a "fine line" stylus that is somewhat critical to correct VTF (vertical tracking angle).

    I had a cartridge with a fine line stylus and my dealer recommended to run it 2mm "tail down".
    I tried it for a while but the sound was kind of a let down- not as clear or resolving as I had hoped for, OK but not spectacular like this cartridge should have sounded.
    Then I decided to raise the tail 2mm so that it would be level, or close to what the cartridge was designed for. It sounded instantly more focused, had better clarity to the sound, it was more balanced and neutral and had more life to it. Basically no contest.
    Then I decided to dial it in by ear, raising and lowering it by 1/2 mm at a time to see the effect on the sound. It wound up sounding the best at 1/2mm tail up. Raising it any higher and the treble would start to sound edgy. Point is that most cartridges have a position where they sound their best.
    If I had to listen at 4mm tail down like a Rega deck without any spacers I am sure it would have sounded nearly unlistenable compared to the optimized position.
    I would absolutely start with a level position using spacers or shims and then dial in the sound by ear, 1/2mm at a time. I think they do sell 1/2mm shims for Rega tonearms. Good luck!
     
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  21. KT88

    KT88 Forum Resident

    Cartridges do have different heights and consequently effect the appropriate arm height. Arms should be adjusted so that when whatever cartridge is used, the arm tube (or center line of the arm tube if it is tapered) is parallel to the record surface when the cartridge is in play. Many arms are adjustable as to their height, some are not. Rega arms are adjustable via spacers, shims, or washers under their bases. In some cases, the arm board, on which the arm is mounted, can be raised. In other cases, the spacers are added directly under the arm. So you can add any number or fraction of spacers that you have available to achieve this. Rega can mount their arms directly to their tables without any spacers for use with their own cartridges and the height is correct for them. Their cartridges are about 2mm shorter than the industry standard/average so that it is easy to just add spacers to increase the arm height for any other cartridge. Most cartridges are 2mm taller than the Rega cartridges so the typical arrangement for any aftermarket/third party cartridge is to add a single 2mm spacer and call it a day or a decade or two. There are cartridges which are taller still, and so would benefit from another mm or two, so 3mm or 4mm are also common.

    I sell Ortofon cartridges and others, as well as Rega tables, and others, and have done so for 20 years, so I have quite a bit of experience with this. Most cartridges on Rega tables set-up here use a 2mm spacer. Even when 3mm is "perfect" or 4mm is acceptable. It's just easier in the long run to get the table to that standard arm height first and not have to mess with it again later when a customer chooses another brand of cartridge. About half of the Rega tables sold here leave with another make of cartridge and a 2mm spacer under the arm, Bam done. What raising the height of the arm does tonally is to make the overall sound brighter and more dynamic. If you want softer and warmer sound than that, then having the arm set a touch low or "tail down" as some say, helps achieve that. Really there isn't a huge difference from 2mm to 3mm or from 3mm to 4mm, it's subtle and so it's more about audiophiles debating minutia on web forums than about any real sonic impact. The difference from 0 to 4mm is rather noticeable and should not go unaddressed IME. While it might work and sound good in many systems, it'll work and sound better in most if done with a little more attention to detail. When in doubt or when one just wants to have a one size fits all solution, going with the lower setting is probably best. I prefer things to be a bit more warm and rich than bright and bombastic where there is a choice of one or the other. Rega spacers are sold in 2mm increments to suit most cartridges optimum range within about a 1/2 mm rather easily. I do often choose to use some thinner and very flat washers under the newer Rega arms and so can easily achieve fractions therein. The old arms had you with only 2mm or 4mm options. Still very close and very good, but not perfectly optimized. The new designs with their outriggers allow the use of individual spacers (washers) should you be able to find some that are suitably flat. I will not use, nor do i recommend off the shelf washers from the big hardware chains. Most all of that is stamped Chinese stuff that isn't really flat. You want a machined flat surface, ie a true spacer.

    So in summary, the higher the arm, the brighter and more dynamic the sound, the lower the arm, the warmer and softer the sound. Extremes here will be too much one way or the other and require adjustment, where otherwise there is a middle ground that serves well all but the most hardened, audiophile, curmudgeon. (I'm lookin' at you avanti1960 ) ;)
    -Bill
     
  22. stonecold

    stonecold Member

    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    avanti1960 and KT88, thank you very much for clarifying :righton:
     
  23. Drewan77

    Drewan77 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    UK
    Nick, actually that is not the correct way to set antiskate because forces pull the stylus inwards when the stylus is in the groove but not on a blank piece of vinyl - so you may not be setting for actual playing conditions. Having said that, there is no single 'optimum' setting that covers an entire LP surface as this inward drag varies from lead-in to lead-out.
     
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  24. Fishoutofwater

    Fishoutofwater Forum Resident

    Agreed; using a plank vinyl will not give a proper setting. I found setting the anti skate to the same as the VTF and then backing off a bit seems to hit the sweet spot for me. Having said that a friend once changed my anti skate settings and i could not hear the difference!!
     
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  25. Nick Stylidis

    Nick Stylidis New Member

    Location:
    Greece
    I am using the Test record from analague audio association. Not just a blank lp. It has a certain "blank zone" in the middle of side for that purpose.
     

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