Rega Naiad – cost-no-object turntable – first impressions at The Ear

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by raferx, Mar 26, 2015.

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  1. tomd

    tomd Senior Member

    Location:
    Brighton,Colorado
    But I was told the glass platters still "ring" Are you saying the ceramic sounds better than Delrin and doesn't ring?
     
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  2. KT88

    KT88 Senior Member

    I am saying that you have been lied to if someone says that the Rega glass or the ceramic platters produce a sound. They are not dead and do not absorb sound energy as do acrylic and Delrin but they are also decoupled with felt mats that isolate the Lp. The rigid coupling is not through the platter to the LP but through the platter to the plinth. Basically, any energy being transmitted throughout the plinth gets dissipated very quickly due to the light and rigid design of the plinth and the hardness of the platters. That is still decoupled from the record and thus the stylus interface. By contrast, with an acrylic platter, the energy is not transmitted as quickly and so not dissipated as quickly. That delay in release of stored energy results in a softer, fuzzier sounding delivery than with hard platters.

    In either case, the record is better served by not being supported directly by the platter. Some table designs (not to be confused with aftermarket accessories) have the record being coupled directly to the platter as part of the intended playback chain. I had a Sota Sapphire table with that design here once. It came with a wool mat and the platter, which was a metal and acrylic hybrid, with what I think they called a "supermat" or something bonded to the top surface of the platter. You could use the platter to rest an Lp on directly as it had a portion routed out for the record label recess or you could use the felt mat between. It seemed like a good idea to combine the properties of the metal and acrylic but it wasn't such a good idea to bond them together in terms of longevity. It was also way more expensive than a simple, thick piece of glass as a platter.
    -Bill
     
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  3. jupiterboy

    jupiterboy Forum Residue

    Location:
    Buffalo, NY
    Even the Comet platter is two pieces with a soft sandwich in the middle, which can become partially delaminated and need to be replaced. Although seemingly not as critical, the spindle would seem to play a role in energy transfer to the LP surface.
     
  4. Analogman

    Analogman Well-Known Member

    What he is saying about the platters makes absolutely no sense whatsoever from any sort of objectively quantifiable perspective based on anything remotely resembling physics or mechanics
    It's sales talk and quoting press
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2015
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  5. Raylinds

    Raylinds Resident Lake Surfer

    You wouldn't happen to sell Rega TT would you?
     
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  6. jupiterboy

    jupiterboy Forum Residue

    Location:
    Buffalo, NY
    It seems like everyone sells Rega tables.
     
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  7. missan

    missan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Stockholm
    I am not, I really am not.
     
  8. jupiterboy

    jupiterboy Forum Residue

    Location:
    Buffalo, NY
    I never see you pushing your wares. It does seem like many people choose Rega as a jumping in point and are enthusiatic about their purchases.
     
  9. missan

    missan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Stockholm
    I don´t know if I dare to say this, but I believe You are correct here,
     
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  10. james

    james Summon The Queen

    Location:
    Annapolis
    Wouldn't someone who works with Rega turntables all day be more likely to comment on what they know than comment on things they're less familiar with?
     
  11. missan

    missan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Stockholm
    There is not really any connection between commenting on something we know nothing about and commenting on the Rega TTs per se. All comments must always be seen in the context of how they are being done, just normal scrutiny.
     
  12. Analogman

    Analogman Well-Known Member

    Physics, mechanics and material properties work the same regardless of brand
    Coherent, sound (proven and demonstrable) engineering principles always trump marketing hype and pseudo-science as well (well for me anyway)
    Often times, in today's world, the implementation and use of materials and processes described with well worn platitudes such as "space age" (that one's a bit dated now) "revolutionary" "proprietary" "unique" "harmonious" "synergy or synergistically" "break through" etc etc et al are little more than thinly veiled cover for the fact that the manufacturer has found a cheaper way, or material(s) with which to make something or reduce weight and shipping costs

    Tightly laminated materials (of dissimilar resonance frequencies) generally will afford a better prospect of reducing unwanted resonance, if not completely, to at least offer the opportunity to tune those frequencies (get rid of the ones you don't want)

    Plywood is a preferable material for speaker boxes than hardwoods and high density MDF is preferable to both, this is demonstrable and can be measured.............but, I don't know if this is a good approach to turntable platter building, in the long term

    Anything lamented requires the use of pressure and adhesives, acrylics are plastics, including the world's current favorite for what seems like everything "Delrin" (which is nothing more than a trade name for polyoxymethylene, a material that's been around since the 1950s)

    I must admit, "Delrin" sounds much more reassuring when read in the context of contemplating an eBay purchase or the description of some "exotic" "high performance" bearing thrust washer than "polyoxymethylene plastic" so I can well understand the current high profile revival this old DuPont trademark is currently enjoying

    It is an excellent structural product short term, but like all plastics it is relatively unstable under pressure and it will eventually out gas and change shape with time as ALL plastics do, even if it takes years, it will happen These sorts of materials are also potentially prone to undesirable thermally induced problems as well

    I can't think of any turntable that has employed the heavy use of plastics that doesn't eventually develop problems because of that fact, warped plinths (several British decks went with the "plexiglas" craze back in the 1980s, they were expensive, the plinths all "bowed" from the weight of the platter; maker's name escapes me now) wobble, run out, crazing, cracking and just flat out breaking

    Plastic is plastic

    I am perfectly happy with the traditional platters and materials used to make them, metals and glass; there are other equally, if not more, effective methodologies to address turntable platter resonance issues and I personally find them preferable to the current trends
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2015
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  13. CARPEYOLO

    CARPEYOLO Forum Resident

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Modern tt manufacturers could benefit from hiring some designers that understand aesthetics and visual design. VPI TTs look like a bad HR Giger interpretation, Rega TTs look cool if we were still in the mid 90s. It's why many turn to vintage and are willing to deal with the technical issues - because they look so much better.

    For the price, the vast majority of modern record players just don't look good. IMO, of course.
     
    DeRosa likes this.
  14. The Good Guy

    The Good Guy Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    I bet this new deck would sound amazing in your current system & you already have a decent support rack.
     
  15. blakep

    blakep Senior Member

    :laugh:

    I'm not quite sure that comment is "tongue in cheek".

    I tend to be a "source first" guy too but I would have to say that, based on price alone, this table makes absolutely no sense in Rafe's system, unless he wants to a) spend a similar amount of money on other components and b) buy some new real estate that would provide him with a huge listening room appropriate for and to take advantage of those components.

    It should sound amazing for the estimated street price (unless I have misinterpreted what I've read of this table) of $44,000 U.S. ;)
     
  16. tomd

    tomd Senior Member

    Location:
    Brighton,Colorado
    Well,the Rega tables (RP-8,RP-10) sure look better than a lot of new tables from other manufacturers (and old ones too)
     
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  17. The Good Guy

    The Good Guy Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    I didn't realise it was that expensive sorry.
     
  18. CARPEYOLO

    CARPEYOLO Forum Resident

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    I love the look of the discontinued RP9.
     
    jon9091 and Turntable Fan like this.
  19. dianos

    dianos Forum Resident

    Location:
    The North
    Have you seen them live? The foam plinth really look cheap. Don't like them at all.. My RP6 look much more expensive.
     
  20. Don Parkhurst

    Don Parkhurst Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    The Naiad was a project that Roy Gandy started a couple/few years ago to carry his design beliefs to the limit, with no regard to cost. He had planned to use it to trickle down technology to his then top tables.

    Several UK customers insisted that he build one for him, which he didn't want to do, due to the inherent cost involved. More people asked about buying a Naiad as they wanted something that was state of the art. This has been documented in a couple of articles over the last few years.

    Any time you get near the bleeding edge, it gets very expensive.

    I don't think we should be too critical of Roy Gandy for selling an expensive table that he never intended to be available to the public.

    I also suspect that Rafe wasn't going to buy one, that he was only interested in the design

    Unless you've been hiding tens of thousands of dollars, Rafe? Winning lottery ticket
     
  21. The article reads like a giant Thank You note to Roy Gandy for bringing it over and letting the writer have a listen. It's hype.
     
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  22. Long Live Analog

    Long Live Analog Forum Resident

    Location:
    West Tn. Mid South
  23. DeRosa

    DeRosa Vinyl Forever

    With the frame on the rp8 it's doesn't look like a foam plinth. I take your point, the rp6 is a clean looking
    Design, but in terms of sound, the rp8 so completely smokes the performance of the rp6 it's not in the same
    League. (Nor pice!). this senerio where the appearance of the rp6 looks better than the 8 might drive one
    to the rp10 if you can afford it. The ceramic white platter and the polished arm make for a stunning combination.
     
  24. Colin M

    Colin M Forum Resident

    No it's more the Rega Bugatti Veyron...though I don't think they'll be making a loss on each unit.

    Personally I believe it can be a proof that their "lite" philosophy is works at the extreme. Thus validating the whole product line.
     
  25. DeRosa

    DeRosa Vinyl Forever

    Exactly, it's "halo" product. Rega could use a bit of a bump in market perception. The RP8 is a fantastic product,
    but I think many potential buyers think 'that much for a Rega?'.
     
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