Sinatra / Capitol Sound Quality (and general discussion): Singles, Soundtracks, Etc.

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by MLutthans, Aug 10, 2013.

  1. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    Yeah, that's what worked best for me the couple times I tried it - using the mid component only. When I've done this on other mono stuff left in stereo, I often do boost the mid component only before splitting/extracting it out and never got more distortion from it (so long as I didn't overdo the boost and clip it). Yes, the tone is better in the mid-component only of these - most or all of the futzed with sounding tonality seemed to exist within the "widening", at least in those few attempts I made.
     
  2. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Just before the final Capitol singles session of 1954, Frank Sinatra recorded a number of movie soundtrack songs. Rather than distract from the flow of the singles discussion, I've started a separate thread for these:

     
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  3. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Re: You, My Love

    First, a little trivial tidbit: Anybody notice that, assumedly due to a tape splice between the first two piano notes of a phrase toward the end of the song, when Frank sings "...my uncertain heart," it comes out "...my uncertain heart - t" -- with a repeated "t" sound?

    Second, I have clips and dynamic commentary* posted: http://www.11fifty.com/Site_108/1954_-_SinglesEtc10.html :)

    (*The commentary is not dynamic; it's commentary about the dynamics of the recording.)
     
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  4. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    (Bad link on page now fixed.)
     
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  5. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    The "mid" component of the version from the Norberg set sounds best. Too bad the mid-side decoder can't remove the noise reduction...
     
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  6. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Capitol Singles 1953–55

    (Release dates† in red; recording dates in blue)

    1953
    1. 04/27/53 #2450
      04/02/53 I'm Walking Behind You
      04/02/53 Lean Baby

    2. 06/15/53 #2505
      04/30/53 I've Got the World on a String
      05/02/53 My One and Only Love

    3. 08/17/53 #2560
      05/02/53 From Here to Eternity
      05/02/53 Anytime, Anywhere

    4. 11/02/53 #2638
      04/30/53 South of the Border (Down Mexico Way)
      04/30/53 I Love You
    1954
    1. 01/18/54 #2703
      12/09/53 Young-at-Heart
      12/08/53 Take a Chance

    2. 04/12/54 #2787
      04/30/53 Don't Worry 'Bout Me
      12/09/53 I Could Have Told You

    3. 05/17/54 #2816
      03/01/54 Three Coins in the Fountain
      12/09/53 Rain (Falling from the Skies)

    4. 06/28/54 #2864
      05/13/54 The Gal That Got Away
      05/13/54 Half as Lovely (Twice as True)

    5. 09/20/54 #2922
      08/23/54 When I Stop Loving You
      05/13/54 It Worries Me

    6. 10/25/54 #2954
      08/23/54 White Christmas
      08/23/54 The Christmas Waltz

    7. 11/29/54* #2993
      09/23/54 You, My Love
      09/23/54 Someone to Watch Over Me
      *Songs first? issued 11/22/54 on EP: Frank Sinatra Sings Songs from "Young at Heart" (EAP 1-571)
    1955
    1. 01/03/55 #3018 (with Ray Anthony)
      12/13/54 Melody of Love
      12/13/54 I'm Gonna Live Till I Die

    2. 02/28/55 #3050
      12/08/53 Why Should I Cry Over You?
      09/23/54 Don't Change Your Mind About Me

    3. 03/21/55 #3084 (with The Nuggets)
      03/07/55 Two Hearts, Two Kisses (Make One Love)
      03/07/55 From the Bottom to the Top

    4. 04/18/55 #3102
      03/23/55 Learnin' the Blues
      03/07/55 If I Had Three Wishes

    5. 06/06/55 #3130
      03/04/55 Not as a Stranger
      03/07/55 How Could You Do a Thing Like That to Me?

    6. 08/29/55 #3218
      07/29/55 Same Old Saturday Night
      07/29/55 Fairy Tale

    7. 10/17/55* #3260
      08/15/55 Love and Marriage
      08/15/55 The Impatient Years
      *Songs first issued 09/12/55 on EP: Our Town (EAP 1-673)

    8. 11/28/55 #3290
      09/13/55 (Love Is) The Tender Trap
      10/17/55 Weep They Will

    †Release dates based on various sources, including mentions in Billboard, may be inaccurate by 1–2 weeks.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2013
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  7. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    From day one, I've considered adding one more little blurb to each of the pages: "Lag time," i.e., time between recording and release. Would that be of interest to anybody? If so, I'll add it. If not, I won't bother. Some tracks, like "Lean Baby," were just about pushed onto the sales floor straight from the editing room, while others didn't see the light of day for years.
     
  8. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    If you look at the singles that were "just about pushed onto the sales floor straight from the editing room," I think you'll find that they were usually competing covers of newly-published songs available to multiple artists/labels (e.g. "I'm Walking Behind You," "Gal That Got Away," "Melody of Love," and "Two Hearts, Two Kisses").

    Many singles were timed to coincide with movie and TV releases (e.g. "Eternity," "Three Coins," "You, My Love," "Not as a Stranger," "Love and Marriage," "Tender Trap," etc.).

    And, once Frank hit it big with "Young-at-Heart," there was a need to keep the retail pipeline filled with fresh Sinatra product in the hope lightning would strike again. That's when older recordings sitting on the shelf got to "see the light of day," if there was nothing more contemporary available.
     
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  9. James_S888

    James_S888 Forum Resident

    This may have been covered elsewhere or has a separate thread.
    If there is a separate thread, please someone direct me to it.

    The 1978 EMI/Capital release, "The rare Sinatra". With Alan Dell producing.

    A collection of tracks, outtakes from the '50s Capital sessions all on one LP.
    Track list:
    Side 1
    1- Don't Make A Beggar Of Me
    2- Ya Better Stop
    3- Day In, Day Out
    4- Memories Of You
    5- If It's The Last Thing I do
    6- I couldn't Care Less
    Side 2
    1- Take A Chance
    2- There's A Flaw In My Flue
    3- The Song Is You
    4- Where Or-When
    5- It All Depends On You
    6- The One I Love

    It's a great collection, I finally put it on a week or two ago and I found the sound on it very good. On my one listen, with some distractions.
    A great collection of stuff. I'm surprised it wasn't all released earlier.
    Is there any commentary on this one?
     
  10. W.B.

    W.B. The Collector's Collector

    Location:
    New York, NY, USA
    I don't know about some others, but such differentials between recording and release have been forever of interest to me. Especially since I first read Brian Rust's discography books in the '80's.
     
  11. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Probably not here at SHF, but at the SFF: THE RARE SINATRA (UK LP) 1978

    Well, sure, it's been included in all of Matt's comparisons for those tracks we've covered so far in this thread. Also, the expanded 1998 CD version which is included in the UK 21-CD box set.
     
  12. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
  13. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Monday, December 13, 1954

    On this date, one day after his 39th birthday, Frank Sinatra returned to Capitol's Melrose Avenue studios for an unusual collaboration with trumpeter Ray Anthony and his orchestra. From 3:30 to 7:30 P.M., two single sides were recorded, with charts by one of Anthony's regular arrangers, Dick Reynolds:
    • Melody of Love - Take 15
      (Music by Hans Engelman; lyrics by Tom Glazer)
      (Instrumental pop song by Billy Vaughn Orchestra in 1954; based on a German song of 1903)

      A rare waltz by Sinatra, "Melody" did moderately well upon its single release in early 1955, due in part to the popularity of both FS and band leader Anthony at the time. The tune remained unreleased on LP until 1966, when it was included in the Forever Frank compilation. It appeared on CD in The Capitol Collector's Series and Sinatra 80th: All The Best; these include a brief unedited studio intro countdown which is not heard on other issues.

    • I'm Gonna Live Till I Die
      (Music & lyrics by Mann Curtis, Walter Kent & Al Hoffman)
      (Popularized by Danny Scholl in 1950)

      This swinger later appeared in the 1959 compilation LP, Look To Your Heart.
    The two songs shared sides of a Capitol single, and they may be found in The Complete Capitol Singles Collection. They were also released on an EP (mentioned in an earlier post).

    FS and Ray Anthony 1954.jpg
    FS and trumpeter Ray Anthony [photo at MPTV].​

    (Additional photos from this session were posted earlier in this thread.)

    Musicians (20): Ray Anthony (leader, trumpet); Conrad Gozzo, Mannie Klein, Johnny Best, Uan Rasey (trumpet); Si Zentner, Ed Kusby, Tommy Pederson (trombone); George Roberts (bass trombone); Skeets Herfurt (alto saxophone); Willie Schwartz (alto saxophone/clarinet); Fred Falensby, Morris Bercov (tenor saxophone); Leo Anthony (baritone saxophone); Paul Smith (piano); Al Hendrickson (guitar); Joe Comfort (bass); Alvin Stoller (drums); Lou Singer (percussion); Jack Costanzo (bongos on "I'm Gonna Live Till I Die").
    __________________

    The Ray Anthony session at Capitol would be Sinatra's last of the year. 1954 saw the release of two highly successful albums (Songs for Young Lovers and Swing Easy!), and two blockbuster singles ("Young-at-Heart" and "Three Coins in the Fountain"), along with the Oscar for From Here To Eternity. Frank Sinatra's comeback was complete!

    As FS entered his 40th year of life, the stage was now set for his most ambitious album project ever: a double 10-inch LP—and first 12-inch LP—In the Wee Small Hours. After a two-month break, recording for the new album would commence in February of 1955.

    To be continued...
    __________________
    ~ Frank's Albums
     
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  14. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
  15. James_S888

    James_S888 Forum Resident

    Interesting, but there's not a lot about this particular record itself. I'll have to put it on again when I have time and I'm in the mood. One poster really praised the sound quality on this, which confirms what I heard.
    When I put it on, my impression was flat transfers or very minimal compression or dicking with the sound. I would say dub tapes, 1st generation copies.
    Plus, just a great collection of stuff I hadn't heard before from sessions where Sinatra produced the best he ever did. Which for Sinatra is saying a lot.
     
  16. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2013
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  17. jtaylor

    jtaylor Senior Member

    Location:
    RVA
    Unlike Nat Cole's session with Ray Anthony, Capitol paired Sinatra not with the Anthony band but instead an assemblage of studio aces.
     
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  18. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    He did bring his brother Leo to the session. (And the bongo player is unique to this Sinatra session, although that may just be because bongos and Sinatra are a rare combination. Offhand, I can recall only one other FS track with prominent bongos, and that was a Mitch Miller overdub for a Columbia reissue in the '50s. :))
     
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  19. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Nice to see Jack Costanzo on a Sinatra track for once, after loads of NKC stuff.
     
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  20. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Re: The Rare Sinatra LP
    Three pages worth in that thread (plus links to others). Seemed to me like a lot of info. ???

    It gets generally high marks, but some tracks may be better than others. If you follow Matt's web pages, these are his recommendations for the tracks on the LP that we've visited so far:

    "Don’t Make a Beggar of Me" - Avoid
    "Take a Chance" - Recommended top choice
    "Ya Better Stop" - Recommended top choice
    "Day In—Day Out" - Recommended top choice
     
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  21. James_S888

    James_S888 Forum Resident

    Very cool. Thanks.
    I'll have to go looking through and make some notes for the LP.
    I thought "There's A Flaw In My Flue" sounded very good. It was one I listened to more closely because it's the "comic" track on the album. It's a nice song. Done really well.

    Matt's web pages look great. Fantastic would be a better word.
    I'm more interested in the best vinyl versions. Since Sinatra mostly gets played on vinyl at my place.
     
  22. Ronald Sarbo

    Ronald Sarbo Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY, NY, USA
    "I'm Gonna Live Till I Die" was popularized in 1950 by the other Frankie...Frankie Laine on Mercury. Laine recorded a stereo version on Columbia in 1963.
     
  23. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Hi, Ron. My goal in these postings is to show who FIRST introduced each song. "I'm Gonna Live Till I Die" was released on National Records with Danny Scholl singing, August 21, 1950. Scholl had the original hit. Frankie Laine's version on Mercury was a cover, released three months later (November 13). There's an interesting backstory...

    Billboard, November 18, 1950:

    Billboard Nov 18 1950 p16.jpg
     
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  24. W.B.

    W.B. The Collector's Collector

    Location:
    New York, NY, USA
    I.I.N.M., Leo recorded during that period as "Lee Roy" (alt: "Brother Lee Roy") for Epic, in fact his "Man On The Beat" / "B.O. Plenty" was the very first single (9001 / 5-9001) issued on Epic, in October 1953.
     
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  25. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Sorry to flashback one year, but I just came across a video which I thought might be of interest...

    Sunday, November 29, 1953

    Frank Sinatra appeared as a guest on a live airing of the CBS-TV Colgate Comedy Hour. This came after Frank's summer hiatus—three weeks after he resumed recording with the Songs for Young Lovers sessions. From Here to Eternity had been in theaters a few months, "South of the Border" had just been released as a single, and Frank was beginning to solidify his show business comeback.

    The hour-long program was hosted by Eddie Cantor and included guests Eddie Fisher, Connie Russell, and Harold Arlen, along with FS. Fisher leads off the show with a medley of his hits. (It's interesting to contrast his performance of "I'm Walking Behind You" to Sinatra's version from the previous spring.) Frank sings a medley of Harold Arlen's tunes (accompanied by the composer himself on piano), including "I've Got the World on a String" (a single earlier in the year) and "Get Happy" (anticipating Swing Easy! the next year). The show concludes with a comedy skit by Sinatra and Fisher with Cantor.

    A kinescope of the entire show is available at archive.org; the following link begins in the middle with Frank's medley:

     

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