Sinatra, what is the appeal?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by 4stringking73, Mar 4, 2015.

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  1. Monosterio

    Monosterio Forum Resident

    Location:
    South Florida
    You go first. :D
     
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  2. 4stringking73

    4stringking73 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Ohio
    Great Blog! I am ordering "Watertown" right now. And yeah, I agree that Sinatra's phrasing is incredible.
     
  3. Roland Stone

    Roland Stone Offending Member

    I picked up a very nice box set on the cheap of his Capitol "concept albums." Even though I'm a huge jazz fan, I haven't been able to enjoy it.

    I like plenty of jazz singers, including Sarah Vaughan, Billie Holiday, Ella Fitzgerald, Chris Connor, but I've never been able to warm up to Sinatra. Sometimes he seems a little . . . dramatic or hammy, although that overstates it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2015
  4. driverdrummer

    driverdrummer Forum Resident

    Location:
    Irmo, SC
    I was not exposed to Frank Sinatra's music up until about 4 years ago. I heard snippets of his music (New York New York) but that's it. Now I'm a big Sinatra fan.
     
  5. 4stringking73

    4stringking73 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Ohio
    Ok, you my friend just 100% nailed it! Holy smokes it was like you climbed inside my head!
     
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  6. Out of interest, what song or album tipped you over the line? With me it was "Angel Eyes" from "Sings Only The Lonely".
     
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  7. driverdrummer

    driverdrummer Forum Resident

    Location:
    Irmo, SC
    Around the World from Come Fly With Me. I bought the Capitol From the Vaults reissue and enjoyed the album greatly. Just listened to the album in full while reading the album notes and artwork.
     
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  8. The Wanderer

    The Wanderer Seeker of Truth

    Location:
    NYC
    cool, panache, savoir faire
     
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  9. culabula

    culabula Unread author.

    Location:
    Belfast, Ireland
    I thought this thread was for me, in view of the title. I don't get him at all. Never did, never will.

    I even saw him live once and cooked for him afterwards. Nuttin'.
     
  10. quicksilverbudie

    quicksilverbudie quicksilverbudie

    Location:
    Ontario
    Well for me its his "Voice" tone etc. Having grown up in the late 60s/70s/80s I only heard older Frank...but then a few movies started to have his recordings from the 50s "Capitol Period" and I couldn't believe it was the same person...I was hooked after that>

    sean
     
  11. dewey02

    dewey02 Forum Resident

    Location:
    The mid-South.
    To my surprise, my 20 year old daughter has several Sinatra songs on her ipod.
    True talent has no bounds!
     
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  12. Doghouse Riley

    Doghouse Riley Forum Resident

    Location:
    North West England
    Sinatra was never a "jazz singer," he was at most a "big band singer."
    He never did any "scat singing,"

    Oh hang on!

    "Doobie doobie doo."

    But he'll remain one of the most popular ballad singers who worked with some great orchestras.
     
  13. teag

    teag Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    The best solo singer of the 20th century. A varied catalog. Once I realized it was his lesser known stuff that was his best (IMO) the rewards were never ending. If one has only heard his "hits", they really don't know the artist he is. Many of his ballads albums are unbelievably emotional. The man was an absolutely tremendous interpreter of emotion. Obviously, his tough guy act was just that - an act. This man knew what it meant to hurt, lose and seek to recover. With The Beatles, the most important singer for me.
     
  14. Tony Sclafani

    Tony Sclafani Forum Resident

    Location:
    East Coast, USA
    I agree totally with this. Even if Sinatra had stayed a newspaper copyboy I don't see Roselli as having appeal to Middle America, which is what all performers then and now need. His operatic-sounding voice was just too Italian, too New York (and I'm saying this as someone from that background).

    The only way I think he could have been big is if he'd played up his Italian-American affectations like Lou Monte. But I can't see him cutting novelty records. That said, some of his tunes have a lot of appeal today, especially "Little Pal." But I wonder if my name and background were different if I'd be able to relate to a song like that.
    His main innovations were his phrasing and his conversational tone (he didn't "bellow" like a lot of other Italian-American singers). So while he might not be a jazz singer per se, his style was primarily informed by jazz. Which is the main reason most of his work doesn't sound dated today. To call him a "big band singer" is pretty limiting since any listening to that genre will show he was never part and parcel of it.

    He was a horrific scat singer (example: "Should I" -- Columbia version). Will Friedwald notes this in his book. But Sinatra made up for this by bringing a lot of other things to the table, some of which can't fully even be explained with words. Two things I can explain are his weird ability to sound both bemused and sad ("Glad to be Unhappy") or the way he'd "fight" swing arrangements rhythmically, not ride with them, creating massive dramatic tension (most of his work with Billy May, with the best example being the '62 "Yes Indeed").
     
  15. Doghouse Riley

    Doghouse Riley Forum Resident

    Location:
    North West England
    Every singer has their best years.

    For me, Sinatra's was the fifties when he was "in and out of favour."

    We who've always liked him have their favourite recordings by him.

    This is one of mine. Mind you I've got this and about twenty other different versions of this song on different media, from Chet Baker to Joe Zawinul.

    But I thought it worth having a 45 of it in one of my jukeboxes.

     
  16. Holerbot6000

    Holerbot6000 Forum Resident

    Location:
    California
    Dino has a great voice and there are times when I prefer him to Frank, but I think Frank had a lot more range as a singer and took things a lot more seriously, learning how to control his voice and work with arrangers. My impression of Dino is that he just showed up, hit his mark and didn't give a darn about much else regarding the recording process. When he was surrounded by killer arrangers at Capitol, it was okay, but when he went to Reprise, his albums got really awful and schmaltzy, and he still didn't care. His Capitol stuff though, what little there is, is choice.
     
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  17. GodShifter

    GodShifter Forum Member

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    Never understood his appeal quite frankly (nyuk nyuk). I think I like one song of his. No offense, but Sinatra seems like music for old people sitting around sipping martinis with The Godfather on mute for ambience. And this is coming from an old guy.
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2015
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  18. SirNoseDVoid

    SirNoseDVoid Forum Resident

    I never got into Sinatra until long after he passed away (I also thought it was old people's music), but I really came to appreciate his vocal technique when I took singing lessons for a couple of years and I did a lot of standards with my vocal teacher.. Sinatra's timing and phrasing are impeccable and he really makes well worn standards his own. I still listen to his stuff once in a while, great sunday morning music.
     
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  19. Wombat Reynolds

    Wombat Reynolds Jimmy Page stole all my best riffs.

    Location:
    Atlanta, GA, USA
    I've always liked that sort of big band orchestra with vocal music. Theres a lot of it traditionally in the Big Band era, and I listen to some of that too. Sinatra had a golden voice, no doubt about it, and the orchestral arrangements are usually excellent.
     
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  20. Licorice pizza

    Licorice pizza Livin’ On The Fault Line

    Yep. Although those two rarely make great background music at the Four Seasons or many other classy venues. Sinatra always does.
     
  21. Licorice pizza

    Licorice pizza Livin’ On The Fault Line

    Yes! As Frank Vincent would tell you. :righton:
     
  22. wpjs

    wpjs Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ny
    Get yourself a copy of Sinatra's Swinging Session!!! from Mobile Fidelity.
    Place it on your table.
    Turn up the volume
    and you will have your answer.
     
  23. Licorice pizza

    Licorice pizza Livin’ On The Fault Line

    That album does it every time...the tender trap, so to speak. :)
     
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  24. majorlance

    majorlance Forum Resident

    Location:
    PATCO Speedline
    +1.
    I assume you're referring to Friedwald's 1995 book Sinatra! The Song is You: A Singer's Art.

    For myself — still somewhere between Sinatra newbie & connoisseur — I found this a highly informative book focusing on his music, not the usual tabloid stuff.

    Friedwald's disdain for most post-1950s pop music (especially Rock) gets a little tedious at times, but this is otherwise essential reading.
     
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  25. teag

    teag Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    It is for old people, and mid aged, and young. And some may sip martinis. Some may not. But probably not so much for the strictly beer, nuts and BBQ crowd.... nyuk, nyuk...:rolleyes:
     
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