Small Faces "Autumn Stone" Box Set Coming (Soon?)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Kevin55, Oct 24, 2017.

  1. Surferghost

    Surferghost Forum Resident

    Location:
    United Kingdom
    There was (just about) enough 'new' post-Ogden's material for a single LP which is how they released it in Europe (as 'In Memoriam'), and there are still tracks there that haven't been released as part of the reissue programme yet (what we got on the Immediate Box were alt takes). I'm still holding out for the extra-long keyboard mix of 'Wide-Eyed Girl' that turned up on that 80s 'Big Music' compilation, rather than spend a fortune scoring a fresh copy of the original. But yeah, I certainly do see your point.
    Yes it's much more likely they'd keep that in reserve for a standalone release, if indeed they can release it at all.
    Me too, but the only other late-period live material I know of that's turned up so far is the short set from the final tour (Vienna 1969). Very interesting setlist, but a very tough listen due to the poor recording quality. If they do go down the live recordings route, hopefully they aren't going to try and pass off the Colour Me Pop footage as a proper live performance.

    And it probably won't happen (and almost certainly not here) but I'd also like to see some kind of release of the Outcasts tape they discovered during the research for the Ronnie biography. They apparently gave away CDRs of it to people who crowdfunded the initial run of the book. Likely that'll leak at some point though.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2017
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  2. RockRoom

    RockRoom Experienced

    Location:
    Upstate NY
    Does this 69' tape circulate or is it in the hands of private collectors? Any additional information about the 66 concert? Wow, how exciting. My dream is that the Marquee 66 footage will surface uncut at some point. Wishful thinking.
     
  3. Surferghost

    Surferghost Forum Resident

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    United Kingdom
    The 69 tape was circulating pretty freely a few years ago, I found a copy fairly easy in the usual internet places. About 25 minutes or so with a couple of surprising songs. But really - don't get excited. I'm as rabid a fan as you'll find anywhere and I've only listened to it maybe twice, and both times it was a struggle.

    Example:

    Great performance, awful recording.

    EDIT: If you search 'Small Faces Vienna' you can find the whole thing.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2017
  4. MrSka57

    MrSka57 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Syracuse, New York
    I hope it includes the LP version of Afterglow as it was on the original German 2-LP set I got in 1976.
    All CD issues have the sped-up single take.
     
  5. KinkySmallFace1991

    KinkySmallFace1991 Not the world's most passionate man...

    Here Come the Nice had a special version on the "Alternate Period Mixes" disc that had the single version at the correct speed.
     
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  6. ajsmith

    ajsmith Forum Resident

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  7. RockRoom

    RockRoom Experienced

    Location:
    Upstate NY
    Thank you, I must have missed it!
     
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  8. owsley

    owsley Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    This is GREAT news! It was supposed to be released 2 yrs ago wasn't it? Very curious as to what if any previously unreleased material will be issued on this set. The only AS outtake I know of that has not surfaced yet on CD is the 'mellotron' mix of Wide Eyed Girl that was issued on the Compleat 2-lp anthology years ago.
     
  9. KinkySmallFace1991

    KinkySmallFace1991 Not the world's most passionate man...

    Here Come the Nice box set had a release date listed for a 2CD Deluxe of TAS slated for November 2014, IIRC.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2017
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  10. Dante Fontana

    Dante Fontana Forum Resident

    Location:
    Melbourne
    Yes i always found this album difficult to listen to through with the variability from track to track, mainly because of the live and studio recordings jumbled together, but also because the singles/hits were well-trodden ground by the time I got it so I’d be tempted to whip the needle off.

    However, think I’ll buy it as hoping sq will improve on the copy I have (castle classics).

    Actually on this point re SQ, the only CDs I have (acquired recently) are the decca anthology and darlings of wapping wharf but a question I do have for those who might know - were the sources used for these and more recent reissues better than those for vinyl reissues in the 80s? I’m asking because although the DR database shows poor dynamic range on DOWW, these comps have become my go to rather than vinyl, which is not my normal vinyl/digital experience. If so might get all the recent reissues too.
     
  11. owsley

    owsley Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    Yeah that's where I saw the release date as well. Hopefully the new AS will be worth the wait. I'm salivating over what will fill up a 3CD release considering the original double lp only takes up one disc.
     
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  12. Surferghost

    Surferghost Forum Resident

    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I mentioned that one myself earlier. I remember loving that mix, that's one I'm holding out for. Long time since I've heard it though (my copy of that LP got stolen decades ago), I can't even remember if the brass section are on that mix or not to be honest. The long version on the Here Come The Nice box sounds like a similar/the same take to me, but a different mix with the brass on top and the keys mixed too far back for some reason, sort of defeating the object. The keys on the Compleat LP mix were right up front, that much I do remember.

    Also 'Take My Time' may or may not be of the right era for inclusion - recording details are scant as usual - and the last time that appeared on a 'new' release was on "Darlings Of Whapping Wharf".

    If this version of Autumn Stone is also going to serve as a 'mopping-up exercise' then they might include a few Immediate-era guest appearances. Perhaps they'll finally clear up the question of whether it's really any or all the Small Faces playing 'Madame Garcia' on the flip of that Apostolic Intervention single (sounds uncannily like them to me and Marriott is definitely there, yelling in the background).
     
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  13. owsley

    owsley Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    That mellotron mix of Wide Eyed Girl is rough sounding, could be an acetate dub. You mention Take My Time which probably means the AS reissue will pick up all those stray instrumentals (Get Ready, Wrist Job etc) that have already been issued on various SF comps.
    If we're gonna include padding such as tracks that the Small Faces played backup on, then we'd have to include the tracks on the Johnny Hallyday lp as well as Would You Believe and Girl From New York from the Billy Nicholls lp. I wonder if the January '69 Vienna audience tape will be included as well
     
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  14. Surferghost

    Surferghost Forum Resident

    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I suppose it depends on what they're willing to duplicate from the 2013 box as Wrist Job/Pig's Trotters was on there under (yet another) different title. I'd be mighty displeased if they did that though, after all the hassle I had getting that box (just reissue a no-frills version of it, every home should have one - but don't duplicate bits of it here and there forcing me to buy it again piecemeal). There's also another mix of Collibosher with no brass section and keys upfront that AFAIK only ever appeared on that Repertoire mini-box from about 20 years ago.

    I'd love to have the Hallyday stuff minus the vocals (sorry Johnny fans, but that shrill whistle he constantly throws in for no good reason irritates the bejesus out of me), it sounds like the SFs and Frampton are on at least half of those tracks in one capacity or another, and musically they're on fire. Such a shame it never went any further.

    And Humble Pie's 'Bang' before Humble Pie were even formed:
    JOHNNY HALLYDAY - RECLAMATIONS
    Although someone in the comments section seems to be claiming it was written in 1965...

    They'd probably have to find 'Get Ready' from an off-air source (there is one and it's not too bad) as I suspect it might be missing from the transcription disc they got the rest of the session from before. Unless it was a copyright issue that prevented it's inclusion on the old BBC release. Maybe they'll try to clean up that off-air version of the whole session as all the tracks are Brian Matthew intro-free on it. A nice clean mix of that magnificent BBC version of 'If I Were A Carpenter'? Yes please.

    The Vienna material, they'd need to work miracles to get that to a releasable standard sadly, unless they've found a much better source. Shame, as it's such a great performance, and mostly without any teenyboppers screaming all over it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2017
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  15. KinkySmallFace1991

    KinkySmallFace1991 Not the world's most passionate man...

    I will be the first to admit that I was cynical about The Decca Years box set, and was only in it for the BBC sessions. Once I had it in my hands, though, Immediate-ly (get it, huh? Huh? Wrong label, but still) I was impressed by the packaging and presentation and how sturdy the box was (The Stones' camp should have taken notice before they packaged their Mono Box), but what floored me away was the mastering. It was better than the Deluxes and upon reading the liner notes, I learned the original first-generation masters were used for the box while second-gen or tape copies were used for the Deluxes.

    This Super Deluxe Autumn Stone might serve as a companion to the Decca Years, Here Comes the Nice and the Deluxes of the UK and US variants of the first Immediate LP and Ogdens.

    One thing I shudder to think is, because the stereo mix of Ogdens is now hard to find (seeing as the 3CD was a limited edition and reduced to a 2CD in 2013, eliminating said stereo mix), is if they fill a disc with the stereo Ogdens. That'd be silly, though.

    There is also the 1968 BBC session (which I've heard "Lazy Sunday" in decent quality), it's more than likely going to show up here.
     
  16. owsley

    owsley Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    I think there's gonna be a lot of repetition of rare tracks on upcoming AS that have been issued elsewhere. Such as all the instrumental tracks plus alternate mixes of Red Balloon, Wide Eyed Girl, Collibosher than have appeared on numerous comps, along withe the mono mix of AS that came out the the RSD 45. I'm sure a lot of previously released BBC sessions will make another appearance. I'll betcha several songs will feature new mixes since Castle/Charly have multitracks on several of the 'newer' AS lp tracks.
    Of course I guarantee one song that will _not_ be included: the slow "no effects" mix of Green Circles from There Are But Four. For some unknown reason Rob Caiger refuses time after time to reissue this awesome unique mix despite the master tape being discovered about 15 years ago (it's on the 'Net if you look around). His contention that it was issued without band consent is ridiculous considering there have been 4 or 5 other variations of Circles that Caiger has put out instead, many of them unfinished and ragged and not even close to the perfection of the 'clean' US mix. In any case I'm sure there will be enough new stuff for us diehards that will make this AS reissue essential.

    Regarding the Hallyday lp, it may never be known exactly who played on which tracks. It is obvious that Marriott played on more tracks than just That Man, What You Will and Bang. He plays rhythm guitar on the opening track (which segues into the Collibosher riff) and the closing track (where you can hear him doing the count-in on the intro). His bone crunching rhythm guitar is unmistakable as is Frampton's lead guitar which is heard on at least half the lp's tracks.
     
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  17. Surferghost

    Surferghost Forum Resident

    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Yep, that's the one that originally included 'Get Ready' when first broadcast in May 68:
    Lazy Sunday/If I Were A Carpenter/Get Ready (instrumental)/Every Little Bit Hurts (with P.P. Arnold).
    Apart from 'Get Ready' these all appeared on the old BBC Sessions CD. It's the only remaining BBC session still outstanding from the reissue series now, so hopefully it's a shoo-in.
     
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  18. Surferghost

    Surferghost Forum Resident

    Location:
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    I can live with all of that so long as, if they insist on including the 'extra flute mix' of Autumn Stone, they mix the damn thing properly this time. As for Collibosher, the book in the 2013 box makes a point of remarking that there'll be at least one alt take of it on the AS deluxe, so you're probably quite right. I'll also be very surprised if Me You And Us Too gets left off the deluxe.
    I don't mind that one bit - I loved those 'stripped down' mixes on the box, although I understand that some fans didn't enjoy them.
    Frampton's guitar really stands out for me, and the keyboard parts (which could be either Marriott or Mac, to be fair). It's tricky to compare as I'm not familiar with the sound of Hallyday's regular band, but I can also hear Ronnie's bass on quite a few numbers unless Hallyday's bassist was a soundalike. One track even includes a Lyn Dobson-alike flute on it, giving it a real latter-days Immediate feel. And let's not forget that Glyn Johns produced the LP which is how the SFs got involved in the first place. Kenney Jones was sure he only played on a couple of tracks however, and Mac didn't even remember playing on it at all. Like you say we may never know for certain.
     
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  19. Kevin55

    Kevin55 Forum Resident Thread Starter

  20. Surferghost

    Surferghost Forum Resident

    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Waaaait a minute.
    So, there's still space to fill on the 3LP version, but there's also still the prospect of a theoretically-higher capacity 3-4 CD version?

    Hmm... hopefully he just means that what they already have slated for inclusion simply hasn't been sequenced yet, unless there's something exclusive planned for the CDs. Seems odd, otherwise, to be touting a 3-4 CD version if you don't yet have enough material for 3 LPs.

    Might be time to start tempering that excitement back down for a while, I reckon.

    Damn these cryptic tweets :waiting:
     
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  21. owsley

    owsley Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    I can think of 3 significant 'leaves' that Caiger won't bother to include on the upcoming AS set

    Green Circles - US stereo mix
    That Man - alternate mono mix from UK Success 'Lazy Sunday' CD
    Yesterday, Today and Tomorrow - alternate mono mix from the French A/Z lp
     
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  22. oxenholme

    oxenholme High Quality Posts™ a speciality

    I disagree VERY strongly. That was a big part of the attraction of the original vinyl.
     
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  23. hallucalation

    hallucalation Forum Resident

    Location:
    Russia
    I though Who was absolute champions in variations of mixes... Damn those SF! What's the differences in last two tracks? They are my favourite psychedelic SF tracks
     
  24. EdogawaRampo

    EdogawaRampo Forum Resident

    Ugh. Not for me. Caused me to seek out later comps that had those tracks in straight mono so I could construct a listenable version of Autumn Stone for myself. Fortunately, all those tunes were re-released later in natural form.
     
  25. owsley

    owsley Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    I think the Small Faces are the kings of alternate mixes and different versions, with the Who and Easybeats a close second :)

    The alternate mix of That Man is kind of muddy and has Ronnie's vocals buried in the mix but Marriott's rhythm guitar is more prominent. At the beginning of each line of each verse, the first guitar chord seems to be cranked up in the mix, giving the song a more Who type pop-power feel. The ending also fades out earlier. I love this mix.
    The 'Lazy Sunday' CD that this track comes from also contains the long version of E Too D and the rare alternate mix of Come On Children (there are 3 different versions of that song: the 1st lp, the French EP and this mix) as well as the alternate mix of Lazy Sunday that showed up on the Here Come The Nice box set.
    Yesterday Today and Tomorrow is the same mix (with louder organ) as the alternate mix that has appeared on the FTB two-fer and the Compleat 'Big Music' double lp with the 'gong' overdub ending . It fades out early like the gong mix however the fade is slightly longer before it fades abruptly vs the gong ending where the backing track fades a bit earlier. It is only a slightly different but it is unique.

    The only other alternate mix I can think of that hasn't been officially released is a slightly alternate mix of Universal that was on YouTube years ago but seems to have disappeared. Also the Sweet Floral Albion on-line magazine from years ago reported that there was a collectors tape in existence with alternate acetate mixes of both Than Man and Yesterday Today and Tomorrow. Never heard it so I can't comment on whether these may be yet more alternate mixes or the same as the alternates that I mentioned.
     
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