Sony UBP-x800 - DSD Question

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by dkmonroe, Nov 14, 2017.

  1. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot Thread Starter

    Location:
    Atlanta
    I just got a Sony UBP-x800 and it's fantastic except for one niggling problem, and I'd like to know if it's really a defect in the player or just a lack in my system. It won't output any sound when I set it to play DSD and not convert to PCM. My previous Sony Blu-ray player did appear to output DSD with no problem.

    Here's the gear involved:

    Current disc player: Sony UBP-x800, natch. Outputs stereo and multichannel SACD only when PCM option is selected.

    Current receiver: Onkyo HT-R290.

    Former Blu-ray player: Sony BDP-s5100. Outputs SACD in DSD, apparently.

    Connection is HDMI.

    When I would play SACD with the BDP-s5100, my receiver would display DSD as the format and it would play OK. Having hooked up the UDP-x800 and set it to output DSD, my receiver displays DSD as the format but there's no sound. If I change the player to convert to PCM, it plays perfectly.

    So, what's the culprit here? Does this particular UDP-x800 have a glitch which prevents DSD output, or is my receiver perhaps not a true DSD receiver?
     
  2. Apesbrain

    Apesbrain Forum Resident

    Location:
    East Coast, USA
    Well, it's interesting. The specs for the Sony imply that it can play DSD over HDMI only at 2.8MHz (single-rate DSD); double- and quad-rate files are converted to LPCM. Could this be the problem?

    Sony UBP-X800 Spec Sheet - Page 6

    Although, if the "DSD Output Mode" is set to "Auto" it should figure this out on its own. Note this description in the manual:

    [Auto]: Outputs DSD signal from HDMI OUT jack when playing Super Audio CD & DSD format file (if the connected device also supports DSD).

    "if the connected device also supports DSD" implies the Onkyo is communicating back to to the Sony its capabilities. They may not be "handshaking" properly. Try a different HDMI cable/input; otherwise, it will be difficult to remedy without a firmware update on the incompatible device. Or, you have LPCM as a fallback.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
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  3. tootull

    tootull John Norman

    Location:
    Canada
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
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  4. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot Thread Starter

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Yeah, that's the weird thing - you'd think with the "Auto" setting that it'd play something either way. It is actually playing the disc but there's no sound.

    I have noticed that the receiver's HDMI light blinks on and off a bunch of times before the disc starts playing, or "playing" in this case. When it's set to PCM it blinks once.

    SACD converted to PCM sounds fantastic on this player so if I'm stuck with it I'm OK, but I'm really concerned if the DSD feature on the player is actually defective because that could indicate other future problems with this particular player.

    I've already updated the Sony. I don't know if there is a firmware update for the receiver but I'll check it out. Thanks!
     
  5. tootull

    tootull John Norman

    Location:
    Canada
    Digital audio output set to auto is the key. If this is set to PCM, DSD does not decode & reads as PCM.
     
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  6. tootull

    tootull John Norman

    Location:
    Canada
    Yeah, DSD auto is silent through a non compatible DSD receiver, checked on a Harman Kardon receiver
     
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  7. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot Thread Starter

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Thanks! I think this is the likely culprit. My Onkyo is a separate from a home theater system and it says that it supports DSD but it may be one of those things where it expects the player to do the work.
     
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  8. caupina

    caupina Forum Resident

    Location:
    Santiago, Chile
    A quick read of the Onkyo manual says that is DSD capable via HDMI as bistream so make sure the Sony is doing that.
     
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  9. PTgraphics

    PTgraphics Forum Resident

    I’ll have to check this on my Integra 40.5. I was told the Integra will do DSD but not so sure. I juts got the x800 over the weekend but haven’t opened it up yet.
     
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  10. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot Thread Starter

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Problem SOLVED! I took @Apesbrain 's advice and switched my HDMI cable from the "Video/Audio" output to the "Audio" output on the player and I've got DSD! Thanks to everyone for the help!

    What a load off my mind - I was really dreading having to exchange this one, it's a minor hassle but I can do without it. :D

    This is a GREAT player. I've been listening to just CD's most of the day and they have never sounded this good. Truly an amazing upgrade from what I had before.
     
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  11. dougotte

    dougotte Vague Waste of Space-Time

    Location:
    Washington, DC
    I've been reading this thread with interest as I just ordered this machine, too.

    I'm glad you resolved your issue. But, I want to point out that, if the player is streaming DSD to the AVR, then the AVR DACs are converting to analog. So, it's your AVR that sounds good, not the player.
     
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  12. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot Thread Starter

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Well, then the AVR sounds much better converting the signal from this player than it did with the last two players. :D
     
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  13. tootull

    tootull John Norman

    Location:
    Canada
    I know this is supposed to be fact and I would love to agree with this. But, I have this Sony & a new Yamaha 681 player both connected by HDMI to the receiver that I mentioned above. I definitely prefer the sound of the Yamaha. ??
     
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  14. Litejazz53

    Litejazz53 Enjoying Sparkling Crystal Clear Digital

    I'm a bit confused on what audio out will work best form me, when using the Sony UBP-X800 Blu-ray player in conjunction with the new PS Audio Direct Stream DAC. I called Sony and I honestly do not think the man I spoke to understood the coaxial output and just what it does on the Sony UBP-X800. Since I have a very nice DAC in the PS Audio Direct Stream, I just wanted to know if the coaxial output on the Sony UBP-X800 could simply be connected to the PS Audio Direct Stream DAC? The man at Sony said this would not be the best route, and suggested I take the HDMI off the Sony Player to my television and then take the Toss Link out of the TV to the PS Audio piece, which to me seemed totally crazy, but what do I know. The other thing I wondered about is going from the HDMI out from the Sony blu-ray, into the PS Direct Stream in the second I2 input, and I think this "might not" work, as PS I2 inputs are not like standard HDMI connections. It's too late to call PS now, but someone might know the answer to my questions and jump on here and help me. I honestly can't think why in the world a simple coaxial output from the Sony to the Coaxial input on the PS audio piece would not yield great results, provided the output from the Sony is or can be set to standard stereo! Thanks so much for any input you can offer! :help:
     
  15. PNeski@aol.com

    PNeski@aol.com Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York
    DSD dosnt work with coaxial
     
  16. Litejazz53

    Litejazz53 Enjoying Sparkling Crystal Clear Digital

    10/4 on that, I realized that, I believe there might be an onscreen setting that will cause the coaxial to be standard two channel stereo PCM, which is fine for my purposes, can you tell me the UBP-X800 coaxial output will give two channel stereo PCM, which can be fed to the PS Audio Direct Stream DAC? I have the PS Audio Direct Stream Transport and the DAC, so I'm good for SACD playback using those together, so PCM will work for my television needs to the DAC.
     
  17. PNeski@aol.com

    PNeski@aol.com Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York
    Sorry I don't have a Dac ,I bought this Sony and when my SACD player broke I replaced it with a Oppo that with special cable is region free,that has a decoder
     
  18. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot Thread Starter

    Location:
    Atlanta
    If I understand your question correctly, yes, the UBP-x800 will output PCM in stereo through coaxial. I expect that you would need to set the player's DSD output mode to Off (which ensures that the signal output is PCM when playing SACD). It might also work if you leave it on Auto - the player should just recognize that you're using coax and output PCM accordingly. I have not bothered to test my unit using coaxial but that's how it should work.
     
  19. Litejazz53

    Litejazz53 Enjoying Sparkling Crystal Clear Digital

    Thanks so much for your reply, because I purchased the two PS Audio pieces, the Direct Stream DAC and the Direct Stream Memory Player, I did not need the SABRE DAC any longer in my Oppo 105D, so I sold it yesterday, I just needed an inexpensive 4K Bluray to use with my new television. Are you happy with the UBP-800? I did a good bit of research on this unit and for $188.00, it seems to be very highly rated, with exceptional 4K capabilities. My primary emphasis is on great SACD and CD reproduction with the PS Audio and reasonably good 4K with the Sony UBP-800, outputting the audio to the PS Direct Stream DAC for the best possible audio with my Blu-ray and 4K movies. :)
     
  20. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot Thread Starter

    Location:
    Atlanta
    I'm very happy with it - I've been using it daily since November and have had very few problems, however, other people here have bought one and have had problems with it locking up or stalling, so be aware of that. The only times it has happened to me are oddly specific - I have two SACD packages on the Linn Records and when listening to both of them, the player has stopped playing the disc for no apparent reason. It has happened more than once but not at the same place, and only with those disks. I just start the CD again and it plays perfectly the second time. All other CD's, SACD's, Blu-rays and DVD's I have played have worked perfectly. I've also streamed audio and video with the player and it works great.
     
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  21. Kiko1974

    Kiko1974 Forum Resident

    I've had a X-800 since early May and I've had ZERO issues with it playing UHD BDs, BDs, SACDs and CDs. The only problemI got was with the first two discs of Westworld Season 1 on UHD BD, the player froze and stopped once on every episode. Before starting watching UHD BD 3 I cleaned it with ammonia and a microfibre cloth and no freezing, but the cloth ended up with a dark grey residue. I then cleaned discs 1 and 2 and then let them play while I was doing other things and no freezing either.
    It's a great player for the money.
     
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  22. Ravi Tester

    Ravi Tester New Member

    Location:
    UK
    I have tried to stream DSF files from Jriver media center without success. It is hooked up to a Marantz SR6011 that will play DSF files from the same DLNA source with no problem.

    When I browse from the media server app on the Sony to a folder with dsf 2.8MHz fils I get an error "no playable content". I would understand if it would not play, or was silent if the format was wrong, but it does not even see the files as playable!

    It will play the files from a USB stick, so I know it will play the files. The Jriver is set to play DSD files without re-encoding them.

    I am flumoxed by this and when I called Sony support, they pointed at Page 33 in the manual that states DSF files may not play over the network. But it seems that some people have managed it, why can't I?

    any suggestions?

    Thanks
     
  23. formu_la

    formu_la Pigs whisperer

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Have anyone tried to play multi-channel files (DSD and PCM) from USB stick or hard drive?
     
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  24. jeffmackwood

    jeffmackwood Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ottawa
    As I have posted previously, despite the owner's manual's warnings to the contrary, the X800 does stream multi-channel DSD files from a Home Network server. The only issue I had was occasional buffering / stuttering (a router, not X800, issue) with multi-channel DSD files; using an Ethernet connection, rather than wireless, cured it. Multi-channel DSD files from a USB stick works as well. I'd never tried it from a hard drive connected via the USB port, so, since you asked, moments ago I plugged a Seagate Backup Plus 2 TB Portable Drive in and the X800 played a multi-channel DSD file without issue.

    Hope that helps.

    Jeff
     
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  25. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot Thread Starter

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Yes, it works, BUT the USB stick or hard drive must be formatted to FAT32. I spent several hours one night with an NTFS-formatted portable hard drive sweating out that one.
     
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