Speaker cable upgrade- advice appreciated

I think we're getting away from the focus of the discussion: which ketchup sounds the best in high end systems?

 

Happy to help; Jim Lesurf's page from the University of St. Andrews: https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scots_Guide/audio/Analog.html

A piece from the New York Times in 1989 predates what we're talking about here: http://partners.nytimes.com/library/tech/99/12/circuits/articles/23down.html

And then of course you have the importance of trained listeners, not just hobbyists with a wallet - Dr. Sean Olive here: http://seanolive.blogspot.co.uk/sea...-max=2011-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&max-results=12

What do the pro circuit think? Let's see here: http://thehub.musiciansfriend.com/music-gear-buying-guides/audio-cable-buying-guide#judging

Something from QED of cable manufacturing fame, though you might want to compare this with the Lesurf piece at the top of my reply: http://www.qed.co.uk/qed-academy/reports/the-genesis-report.htm?lang=de#conclusions

Geoff Morrison's interesting piece here: http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/the-best-speaker-cable/

I couldn't let this go without linking to the excellent NWAVGuy site, which has always been a reference for me (and should be for others in this hobby): http://nwavguy.blogspot.co.uk/2011/05/subjective-vs-objective-debate.html

Think that's probably enough to get you started. Important too to realise that experts views alone are not the best way to go, a range of views matter more.

 

Big Heinz fan here, but of late, Wilkins and Son of Tiptree make a rather nice one too!

 

I think I'm glad all I can afford is Monoprice wires and cables, that my systems aren't at the highest level of audio technology (but they're audiophile level to me), and my hearing is only very good, not superlative.

 

I'm glad all I can afford is a Kia. My driving skills are not very good so it really doesn't matter. Besides Porsches don't drive any better than my Kia.

 

Pretty snide comment, Lee. Do you feel elevated about yourself now?

 

No, but my cables are elevated.

 

House-made "ketchup" is the only like condiment which won't bury the taste of the food with HFCS and the like (and yeah, I live in Pittsburgh!). Of course, some food may only be palatable that way. I feel sorry for those who settle for bad food. <wink>

What I can't figure out is how @Steve Hoffman and others with similar credentials, in addition to any number of audiophiles and related subject matter experts, are never able to prove unequivocally that hi-end loudspeakers produce audibly different sound depending on the speaker wire. Shouldn't there be a few converts who once ascribed to the religion that all sound the same?

I'd prefer that the thread not devolve too far. Simply, is it true that the laws of physics support only the claim of hardcore objectivists?

Related to the topic, my Analysis Plus were fixed up promptly and shipped out from Michigan. Terrific service!! I may get them back for the weekend. As for the zip cord I'm now using, well, let's just say that I'm not feeling compelled to listen for hours on end in the way that I have been so many times in the past after a system change. Is the way I'm hearing things 100% psychological? I really can't see how, but perhaps I'll learn more once I switch back.

 

I could see there being people who don't buy Heinz because were just brought up in a Hunts family for whatever reason, but Del Monte? I don't understand how anybody could make any serious arguments that its a strong contender to the Ketchup throne.

 

That's bellwire for you. Good quality 2.5mm speaker cable works very well.

 

I'll admit there is a lot going on in sound reproduction that can't always be pinpointed or measured with hard numbers.

But.... if someone makes specific claims of deeper bass or an extended high end or smoother mids, or bright/dull sound with speaker cable X versus Y or Z, frankly that should be a pretty easy thing to measure and offer solid proof of, and if you can't offer proof, well one has to question what one did or did not actually hear.

Once you get into something like sound stage height, width, depth.....well that's another area that is quite real but much harder to sometimes prove an improvement of.

In the end if you're convinced you heard it (or didn't) the discussion is over anyhow. It now turns into an argument.

 

Maybe not anything. There are some companies that simply re jacket basic wire and resell for lots of money. Hard to imagine right a company ripping people off! People should do some basic research.

It would also be nice if companies published specs. If they don't I wont buy because I assume they have something to hide. See above.

Lastly I can add that I didn't find that everything measured or sounded the same. Some expensive things sounded and measured worse than Belden wire! And a lot will depend on the users speakers. Some speakers will change the freq response more than others but some were voiced to perform fine with just basic wire. I didn't find there to be any universal truths.

 

If your driving skills aren't very good why the hell are you driving anything???

 

calling a hotdog food is kind of pushing it no?


Also i pretty much don't like ketchup at all. I've seen people drown a really nice steak in the stuff. Yuk. Or put it on eggs. Barf Puke!

 

Not that I eat hotdogs, but if I was it´s about the only 'food' I would use ketchup on, besides some hamburgers. The purpose with ketchup is to take care of food that doesn´t taste that good, so it will be sort of eatable. It can never enhance any flavour.

 

You both obviously missed the memo. You put ketchup on you speaker cable elevators to provide liquid damping between the elevator and speaker cable. What ever gave You the idea to put it on food, or even hotdogs?

 

Of course, sorry about that, sometimes you just miss the obvious.

 

I don´t know if this would be possible, but we have stores where there is no brand name on the food. Bread is just called 'Bread', ketchup is just called 'Ketchup', schampoo is just called 'Schampoo', coffee is just called 'Coffee', and so on.

Wouldn´t that be a good approach with components, a TT is just called 'Turntable', no brand, a cable is just called 'Speakercable', a speaker would just be a 'Speaker'. Wouldn´t that take care of much. I mean then all must sound the same, right?

 

Ketchup (or tomato sauce to be really accurate) works a treat on chips and occasionally a fish supper, which when cooked just right is a work of genius. Light batter, fish cooked to perfection, still moist and not dry, thick chips with a nice crunch and not soggy... perfect. And none of that mushy peas crap!

 

I would never argue against a subjective belief.

 

There are relatively large differences in simply measured parameters (resistance, inductance, capacitance) between various cables, however in most cases the sonic differences usually described don't show an obvious correlation to those measured differences. There are other more esoteric measurements (e.g., FFT) that show greater differences which some have said better correlate with subjectively described differences, but there isn't a consensus yet. Recording professionals whose work is held in the highest esteem, such as our host, Barry Diament, and many others all use various brands and types of high-end cables. As in all things, you pays your money and you make your choices.

 

Eagerly awaiting the day when Monoprice adds "Condiments" to their product categories.