Star Trek: Axanar-Independent Feature Film

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by Encuentro, Jul 11, 2015.

  1. Encuentro

    Encuentro Forum Resident Thread Starter

    The film is finished, but they haven't given a release date. They are in post production working on the VFX with Tobias Richter who does a lot of the VFX for these indie productions. My guess, and it's only a guess, is some time later this year. You may have missed him, but Quark is in there as well. Of course, he looks a lot different without the make up and prosthetics.

    Edit: I was trying to figure out who you meant by 'Mike.' I believe you're referring to Mike from Breaking Bad/Better Call Saul. If so, that's not him. That's actually Armin Shimerman who played Quark in DS9. There's another male actor in there who Icheb in Voyager. His name is Manu Intiraymi.
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2016
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  2. Deesky

    Deesky Forum Resident

    Ha, you're right! The clip was so brief that when I saw him, Jonathan Banks immediately came to mind (there is a resemblance). I know what 'Quark' looks like without the makeup. He appeared makeup-less in one of my fave DS9 eps Far Beyond the Stars, but I also saw hin in other works. I guess quite a few years have gone by since I saw him last. I didn't pick Icheb.
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  3. balzac

    balzac Forum Resident

    Nope, not so far. Justin Lin and JJ Abrams seemed to want to make nice with the entire fan community and seemed to unilaterally decide to "announce" that lawsuits were "going away", but my guess is that:

    A) Lin and Abrams aren't familiar with the intricate details of the Axanar case (they seem to think it's just "another fan film")
    B) CBS and Paramount were probably pissed that Abrams jumped the gun and spoke out of turn

    Nobody seems to know precisely how much info Abrams had when he made the comments about the lawsuit "going away." Was he just led to believe settlement discussions (which both sides acknowledge are ongoing) were about to be completed?

    I would guess anybody other than Abrams that didn't have the clout he does in the industry right now would have been told by CBS and Paramount to sit down and shut up or risk being blacklisted by the studio for speaking for the company and its legal position when he has no right or standing to do so.
  4. balzac

    balzac Forum Resident

    I think Peters has been the worst advocate for his own project, and is the worst face for this thing they could have gotten. Numerous people within the fan community and industry, including people who have worked on his projects (including the "Prelude to Axanar" film) don't seem to like the guy. There are reams of pretty distasteful, unprofessional comments coming out of the "Axanar" camp. They've done a pretty poor job running their own project.

    I agree, the problems including making merchandise, and obviously CBS and Paramount in the past didn't have problems with nerds shooting a movie in their garage with consumer gear.

    Clearly, Peters doesn't want to do a "non-Star Trek" film, and he doesn't want a budget limitation. That's the problem. He could have done one Kickstarter, probably still pulled in more money than most any other "fan film", done a more low key operation (no huge merch store, no implying CBS and Paramount's Trek product sucks, no trying to fund a start-up production facility with "fan" money, and hiring someone else to be the public face of the thing because many in the fan community and industry clearly find Peters to be a total antagonistic douche) and gotten the thing done.

    Again, I have go back to the analogy: Would anyone find it odd for Lucasfilm and Disney to sue if Universal Pictures shelled out a couple million to make "Star Wars Episode 7.5" at a loss and distribute it for free?
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  5. balzac

    balzac Forum Resident

    I mentioned this before, and this site clearly has a clear "side" it falls on, but this site offers a TON of first-hand research and analysis:

    Home »
  6. Deesky

    Deesky Forum Resident

    What do you base your 'guess' on? And why guess in the absence of evidence?
  7. balzac

    balzac Forum Resident

    Obviously, implicit in it being a "guess" is that it's not informed by anything other than it being my best guess.

    As for asking why would I guess? It's a discussion board, it's what we do. When it's clearly marked as opinion and guesses, people can weigh such speculation accordingly. I didn't say "Sources inside the company have told me that....."

    I somehow doubt a huge corporation (CBS and Paramount) involved in ongoing litigation would want one of their employees or contractors or associates to speak *for* the company and its legal team and "announce" at a high profile event that litigation that isn't scheduled to end is in fact going to end. It's common sense, and in addition I think some of us here have at least some passing familiarity with entertainment (and other) law.

    *If* CBS and Paramount had decided to magnanimously end the entire thing, they would have at least announced it themselves and gotten the good PR out of it instead of just letting Lin and Abrams look like the good guys. Abrams and Lin, who both work with and for Paramount, made Paramount look like the bad guy.

    More than anything else, the fact that the litigation *hasn't* ended is what leads me to *guess* CBS and Paramount didn't want Abrams making that sort of announcement, however formal or informal he intended it to be.

    I'm less certain of my other point, which is how much Lin and Abrams are familiar with the case. Lin's comments in the past suggest to me he isn't aware of the intricacies of what Axanar has done over the lifespan of this film and case, but that's just a guess.
  8. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR!

    Hollywood, USA
    That's a very interesting source of information, and it looks pretty even-handed to me.

    I don't have any problem with fan-based films, either, but I think there is a line that gets crossed the moment you start making money, particularly on things like merchandising.
  9. balzac

    balzac Forum Resident

    The Axamonitor website has to have been and continues to be a thorn in the side of Peters and Axanar. They've dug into a lot of nuts and bolts of the Axanar operation and discovered all sorts of weird discrepancies.

    I'm stunned so many people gave so much money to a film that was clearly crossing a lot of lines, that surely had a higher-than-usual possibility of being derailed via lawsuits.

    It's sounding like CBS and Paramount will settle this thing; one question is whether this "Axanar" film will be made in the end. Will the settlement allow for the film to made as it's currently scripted?

    Seemingly almost every other fan film organization seems peeved at Peters and Axanar; they might be more peeved if a bunch of "fan film guidelines" are set up by CBS and Paramount (e.g. a cap on crowdsourcing, etc.) but where the "Axanar" film is sort of "grandfathered" in and allowed to be made.

    I think CBS and Paramount should just tell Peters politely and perhaps even energetically that he should make an original film instead.
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  10. Encuentro

    Encuentro Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Peters commented on Facebook that that was something he had considered and discussed with others from the very beginning. The post was very quickly removed. I wish he would rewrite the story and make an original film. It would open doors to him that would remain shut to him should he be allowed to make his Star Trek fan film. He should take a page from E.L. James who originally wrote the story that would eventually become 50 Shades of Gray as Twilight fan fiction.
  11. Encuentro

    Encuentro Forum Resident Thread Starter

    CBS/Paramount have issued their guidelines for fan films.

    "CBS and Paramount Pictures are big believers in reasonable fan fiction and fan creativity, and, in particular, want amateur fan filmmakers to showcase their passion for Star Trek. Therefore, CBS and Paramount Pictures will not object to, or take legal action against, Star Trek fan productions that are non-professional and amateur and meet the following guidelines.

    Guidelines for Avoiding Objections:

    1. The fan production must be less than 15 minutes for a single self-contained story, or no more than 2 segments, episodes or parts, not to exceed 30 minutes total, with no additional seasons, episodes, parts, sequels or remakes.

    2. The title of the fan production or any parts cannot include the name “Star Trek.” However, the title must contain a subtitle with the phrase: “A STAR TREK FAN PRODUCTION” in plain typeface. The fan production cannot use the term “official” in either its title or subtitle or in any marketing, promotions or social media for the fan production.

    3. The content in the fan production must be original, not reproductions, recreations or clips from any Star Trek production. If non-Star Trek third party content is used, all necessary permissions for any third party content should be obtained in writing.

    4. If the fan production uses commercially-available Star Trek uniforms, accessories, toys and props, these items must be official merchandise and not bootleg items or imitations of such commercially available products.

    5. The fan production must be a real “fan” production, i.e., creators, actors and all other participants must be amateurs, cannot be compensated for their services, and cannot be currently or previously employed on any Star Trek series, films, production of DVDs or with any of CBS or Paramount Pictures’ licensees.

    6. The fan production must be non-commercial:

      • CBS and Paramount Pictures do not object to limited fundraising for the creation of a fan production, whether 1 or 2 segments and consistent with these guidelines, so long as the total amount does not exceed $50,000, including all platform fees, and when the $50,000 goal is reached, all fundraising must cease.

      • The fan production must only be exhibited or distributed on a no-charge basis and/or shared via streaming services without generating revenue.

      • The fan production cannot be distributed in a physical format such as DVD or Blu-ray.

      • The fan production cannot be used to derive advertising revenue including, but not limited to, through for example, the use of pre or post-roll advertising, click-through advertising banners, that is associated with the fan production.

      • No unlicensed Star Trek-related or fan production-related merchandise or services can be offered for sale or given away as premiums, perks or rewards or in connection with the fan production fundraising.

      • The fan production cannot derive revenue by selling or licensing fan-created production sets, props or costumes.
    7. The fan production must be family friendly and suitable for public presentation. Videos must not include profanity, nudity, obscenity, pornography, depictions of drugs, alcohol, tobacco, or any harmful or illegal activity, or any material that is offensive, fraudulent, defamatory, libelous, disparaging, sexually explicit, threatening, hateful, or any other inappropriate content. The content of the fan production cannot violate any individual’s right of privacy.

    8. The fan production must display the following disclaimer in the on-screen credits of the fan productions and on any marketing material including the fan production website or page hosting the fan production:

      Star Trek and all related marks, logos and characters are solely owned by CBS Studios Inc. This fan production is not endorsed by, sponsored by, nor affiliated with CBS, Paramount Pictures, or any other Star Trek franchise, and is a non-commercial fan-made film intended for recreational use. No commercial exhibition or distribution is permitted. No alleged independent rights will be asserted against CBS or Paramount Pictures.”

    9. Creators of fan productions must not seek to register their works, nor any elements of the works, under copyright or trademark law.

    10. Fan productions cannot create or imply any association or endorsement by CBS or Paramount Pictures.
    CBS and Paramount Pictures reserve the right to revise, revoke and/or withdraw these guidelines at any time in their own discretion. These guidelines are not a license and do not constitute approval or authorization of any fan productions or a waiver of any rights that CBS or Paramount Pictures may have with respect to fan fiction created outside of these guidelines."
    Star Trek Fan Films »
  12. balzac

    balzac Forum Resident

    I've never watched a fan film, let alone participated in making one, but wow, this Axanar thing totally ruined it for every other fan production. I believe some other legitimately "fan" oriented fan films probably exceeded 15 or 30 minutes, and/or two episodes.

    I'll be curious to see what happens with Axanar now. I'd be *extra* pissed if I was another fan film maker and not only did Axanar lead to these stricter guidelines, but also CBS and Paramount somehow settled and allowed Axanar to be made in its current state.

    A few of those guidelines seem ambiguous. What constitutes multiple episodes of one project versus multiple projects. Can the same crew make a two-part episode, and then just make another episode under a different name? Seems that could at least get around the "no full seasons" rule.
  13. balzac

    balzac Forum Resident

    I'm not super familiar with it, but it looks like Paramount/CBS have used a model a little bit closer to what Star Wars allows for its fan films, albeit still longer running times.

    I wonder if, after everything settles and the Axanar thing blows over, how strictly Paramount/CBS will enforce these rules. Will they allow continued distribution of fan films made prior to these rules? Random example: Some former actors from the various series have appeared in these fan films. That apparently won't be allowed (though they don't strictly define what an "amateur" is; does that simply mean unpaid, or that they can't be in SAG?)
  14. Yes and yes. When you also consider that Peters is the type to use phrases like "haters" unironically and has also occasionally made very
    Should be noted that the only guidelines Lucasfilm set forth for fan films is for the yearly contest. Star Wars fanfilms in general outside of those contest submissions have no explicit guidelines.


    Anybody who liked the long-form fan productions so far? Sorry. #ThanksAxanar
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  15. lambfan68

    lambfan68 Forum Resident

    Does this mean that the episodic/series based productions such as Continues and Phase II have to cease production? That would be unfortunate.
  16. Encuentro

    Encuentro Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Star Trek: Renegades is a popular fan series starring Star Trek veterans Manu Intaraymi, Tim Russ, Walter Koenig, and Robert Picardo and directed by Tim Russ. They've released one feature length pilot and are currently working on the next installment. Due to the new fan film rules, they are changing it up. Axanar should consider following their lead.

    "Dear supporters,

    On June 23rd CBS and Paramount issued fan film guidelines – Star Trek Fan Films »

    We, at Renegades, have nothing but the utmost respect for Star Trek and its IP holders, CBS and Paramount. Everything we have done has been because of Gene Roddenberry’s vision and creativity. Star Trek is their property and we will absolutely abide by their rules and guidelines.

    That being said, we do have an obligation to our donors and fans, and we have every intention of fulfilling it to the best of our ability. So, we will continue to make “The Requiem” as promised, but without any Star Trek elements.

    As you know, we’ve already begun filming “The Requiem” so we cannot halt, suspend, or postpone production. Renegades, from the get go, was designed to be transformative… not derivative. Thus, with very minor changes to our script, we have eliminated all of the Star Trek references. The good news is that Renegades is now a completely original and ongoing series.

    We would like to take this time to thank CBS and Paramount for letting us play in their proverbial sandbox for as long as they did. And we’d also like to thank our loyal, creative, and passionate fans for their unending support. We truly appreciate it.

    -The Renegades Team"
    A message from the Renegades team regarding the new fan film guidelines – Renegades »
  17. Deesky

    Deesky Forum Resident

    I wasn't aware of this series before, so thanks for the heads-up. However, looking into it, it seems that the pilot ep was not well regarded at all, with an IMDB rating of 4.9! Is it worth seeing?
  18. Encuentro

    Encuentro Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I haven't seen it either. I hadn't heard good things about it, but I gave it a shot anyway. I only got a few minutes into it and shut it off. It just wasn't for me. It's still on Youtube if you're interested.
  19. Deesky

    Deesky Forum Resident

    I made to about 10 mins before dumping it! Terrible.
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  20. Encuentro

    Encuentro Forum Resident Thread Starter

    A recent interview with Vic Mignogna in which he discusses, among other topics, Axanar. He has been, and remains, very critical of Axanar.
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  21. Encuentro

    Encuentro Forum Resident Thread Starter

    From Christian Gosset, director of Prelude to Axanar.

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  22. MikeInFla

    MikeInFla Forum Resident

    Panama City, FL
    I just wonder how this will impact Star Trek Continues and New Voyages. I feel both are excellent tributes to TOS and I would hate for them to have to cut funding and shorten episodes and special guest stars.
  23. will_b_free

    will_b_free Forum Resident

    Boulder, CO
    Urg, someone needs to tell Gossett that alluding to having some kind of insider knowledge that would prove your point is exceptionally ill-advised, when it comes to avoiding charges of slander.

    He's probably telling the truth but the way he did it would make a lawyer sigh.
  24. The last time Alec Peters sued somebody for telling the truth about him, he ended up owing several thousand dollars in lawyers' fees. Spoiler: it wasn't to pay his lawyers. :p
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  25. Encuentro

    Encuentro Forum Resident Thread Starter

    You got me curious. Who was it? I remember Peters complaining about Vic Mignogna and saying that he filed a cease and desist order against him. I haven't heard about anything else.

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