Starting my reissue label, it seems to finally be happening

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Scott Davies, Jun 29, 2017.

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  1. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I guess it really does matter who you know or how you manage to get in good with. Cherry Red have had an excellent relationship with Sony dating back to my first projects with them. They were able to get full approval and clearance in no time, and adding extra tracks was just a phone call away. Wounded Bird seem to have the 'in' with Warners and many of their titles have been Warner (and Sony) owned. Edsel seem to have a good relationship with Universal and have done those extensive reissue campaigns, where as Cherry Red struggled for Universal releases. Just a couple years ago when Cherry Red finally released The Passions 'Michael and Miranda' on CD, I was surprised because they had (said they) requested that title a decade earlier. They also tried to request The Waitresses ages ago and received initial approval, and then were suddenly denied. So who knows...

    I did just get a confirmation from Sony A&R that I will have access to the new HD master transfer they've recently done once the title fully clears Business Affairs/Legal. But it's clearly an optimistic sign that they proceeded with the transfers even before full clearance. For the record, the title in question is going to be a CD+DVD collection that has very special significance to me, as I designed the package as a tribute for a friend of mine who's been battling cancer for more than two years, so I've told Sony this one is my absolute top priority. I hope we make it.
     
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  2. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    News on all fronts, some good, some not so good. One of my Warners requests has been cleared and a second will likely be cleared during the week, so two Warner titles should be on the way. Sony still have no further updates on my various requests other than they are still waiting for the UK office on a couple. Universal confirmed my first title is cleared and I am now working with the artist on unreleased material he would like to include as bonus tracks. They said a few others are looking good for clearance.

    On the down side, Universal are having a hard time locating the contract for one of the bands I wanted to do a few releases for, likely because it was from a label they acquired from another label who acquired that label a few years back. Yeah, it makes my head hurt too. And a couple of releases are not going to happen, so I will give the titles here:

    Clare Grogan - Trash Mad: This was the former lead singer of Altered Images shelved solo album from 1988. It was going to be on London records, who were once owned by Warners but are now owned by Universal. I submitted the request several months ago but Universal have decided it's not worth the time to further research for such a small release. I guess I can understand, and truthfully I don't expect it was that great of an album from the couple of songs I've heard from it. Still, it would have been nice to solve the mystery.

    Pseudo Echo - Self Titled: I wanted to finally give this brilliant album the reissue it deserves since all that's been out are bad vinyl transfer releases. Universal, who own EMI, said they no longer control the rights for this album outside of Australia. So no hope for a master tape transferred release.

    In other news, I have made proper contact with the BBC and have submitted a request to release some radio sessions. We will see how that goes.

    Scott
     
  3. scribbs

    scribbs Resident Mockery

    Location:
    Surf City USA
    Wow, I have not thought about Pseudo Echo for 30 years. I had no idea it was OOP. Maybe that's why. That's a real shame.

    Otherwise, it's nice to see you've made some ground in the last couple of weeks. Best of luck to you. Regardless of what you end up getting your hands on, I'm sure that you'll have the backing of many folks here.
     
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  4. Platterpus

    Platterpus Senior Member

    I still hope you can get the Mort Garson titles reissued.
     
  5. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Universal said today that the Lucifer album is looking good and Sony told me last month that Ataraxia is confirmed to be owned by them and is going through the process, so fingers crossed for both.
     
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  6. Platterpus

    Platterpus Senior Member

    Great to hear. Keep us posted.:thumbsup:
     
  7. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Pseudo Echo had an amazing debut album in 1984. It's been a favorite since its release, though their subsequent (more mainstream) material was less satisfying. The album is very special to me and I think each track is excellent. In the future I may reach out to the vocalist of the band, as I understand he may have the non-Aussie rights. But when Almacanter records (poorly) released the album on CD years ago, I had a phone call with the guy running that (rather questionable) label and he said working with the band and their demands were challenging, to say the least. So I may just disregard this title for now and stick to what still can be had from the majors before I branch out even further.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2018
  8. Dubmart

    Dubmart Senior Member

    Location:
    Bristol, England
    That's very interesting information, there's something I quite fancy doing that was on London around then, we are in contact with the artists, but can't be bothered to deal with Universal, I wonder if they've lost all of their paperwork from that label/period? I think we'll have to investigate further, I'm much happier licensing from and paying artists than major labels.

    I'm also interested in how you get on with the BBC, we found them hard work and from memory they wanted lots of money.
     
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  9. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    The problem with working with the artist directly (aside what I mentioned earlier in the thread) is they have to be sure they own the rights to the material. Some of it is a gray area, especially if the label cannot find contracts. Also, it's rare that if the artist gets their rights back that they make the effort to get the masters back as well.

    I've heard the BBC are expensive as well, that's what Cherry Red said when they didn't include the Altered Images radio sessions on the box set. But I will be very curious to see the quote they provide me for the 5 sessions in question with a 1000 unit guarantee. Their form says it's a minimum of two weeks (probably a bit longer) before I will receive that quote, which I just sent in last week.
     
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  10. Dubmart

    Dubmart Senior Member

    Location:
    Bristol, England
    If the major label decides they don't have any paperwork that shows they own it then I think we're happy to assume the artist owns it, I could give you a very long list of material Universal have released that they absolutely don't own so I see it as a form of natural justice. I think we located the masters a few years ago when we were originally thinking of doing it, perhaps worth putting in a request to see if Universal do have the paperwork, great if they don't.

    If you are willing to share the BBC quote by pm I'd be very interested as there are some sessions we'd like to release and 1,000 units is not a problem, we were entirely put off by trying to licence non session material from them, I really hope they don't price themselves out of you doing what you want.
     
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  11. Natvecal.

    Natvecal. JUST A LOW- FI GUY WHO LOVES A GREAT MASTERING

    Location:
    Oceanside,CA.
    Good luck and looking forward to what comes of this:righton:

    This crowd is one persnickety group here as you well know :laugh:
     
  12. Rkellner

    Rkellner Forum Resident

    Location:
    Huntington, NY
    Awesome! I recently tracked down an original Lucifer (although the liner notes from a later reissue were pretty informative too). I see that a grey market Ataraxia recently came out on vinyl. Would love to hear a proper remaster of it! Are you thinking vinyl for these two releases?
     
  13. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Right now it is just CD, but I have already toyed with the idea of vinyl reissues, especially for Ataraxia considering the scarcity of the original LP. And if I do it would be some sort of color variant, as I always find that appealing with vinyl reissues. But I want to see what the response is to the potential CD reissues first.

    Scott
     
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  14. Rkellner

    Rkellner Forum Resident

    Location:
    Huntington, NY
    Oddly the most appropriate color for Black Mass Lucifer is... black. Maybe you could do an EXTRA black variant. Ataraxia though would be a cool splatter candidate.

    The CD market and the vinyl market may be two different things. I haven’t bought a CD in a decade and even then never bought something more than once that I already had. Vinyl however...
     
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  15. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I just got a response back from the BBC with an initial quote. I've PM'd you the details.
     
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  16. mantis4tons

    mantis4tons Forum Resident

    Location:
    Denver, CO, USA
    +1 on this. I also haven't bought a CD in years. My purchases tend to be either vinyl or FLAC downloads (or ideally both via sites like Bandcamp).
     
  17. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    There are lovers of both formats. I've had people very excited that I'm starting with the CD route (and the CD does still outsell vinyl at this point), and others who would prefer vinyl. But the financial requirements for a vinyl pressing is nearly double that of a CD pressing, and it's likely it would take longer to sell out of vinyl. Also, with the CD's I'm adding extra tracks that would require vinyl to be double sets, and many of the extra hadn't been on CD yet. I've seen labels reissue titles on vinyl that are not very hard to find at all on original pressings, including some titles I've remastered, and I can't help wonder the reasoning for selecting that format for those titles. And considering all of the potential issues with vinyl, warping, a few bad pressings in the batch, damage during shipping, the losses will add up. But if things go ok with CD's, some titles may be given the vinyl treatment. I would love to have some nice deluxe packages, though I will avoid heavyweight vinyl because of all of the issues I have encountered myself with them.
     
  18. mantis4tons

    mantis4tons Forum Resident

    Location:
    Denver, CO, USA
    It'll be interesting to hear how CDs go for you! I wish you the best of luck, and I'll keep my fingers crossed for a FLAC download option for your releases at some point down the road.
     
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  19. Surly

    Surly Bon Viv-oh-no-he-didn't

    Location:
    Sugar Land, TX
    I'd love to have a properly remastered version of that album, preferably with the US artwork. Still kicking myself for not realizing Brian Canham held a GoFundMe a couple of years ago to play a live date here in Los Angeles. Even though he was the only original member, it still would have been a great show to see. And the new album he put out around that time is fantastic, too - great, modern-sounding synth pop.
     
  20. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Are you ready for a little bit of viciousness? I was originally waiting to post an update because some exciting movements were happening and I wanted to wait until they got closer. But a bomb just went off and I'm seriously pissed. As you may recall from earlier in this thread that I had submitted requests to Sony to re-release the Altered Images catalog last May. Within a couple of months of my requests, it was reported that Cherry Red, the shady label that I used to remaster for, were going to do a cheap and dirty box set of the Altered Images recordings. Cherry Red have a very well established relationship with Sony going back years, and it seemed clear that they were informed of my plans and decided to jump ahead of me. It was heartbreaking to have to cancel those 3 albums, especially because the box set that just came out last month is a raging (though predictable of Cherry Red) disappointment. What I learned was to keep most of my release plans under wraps until everything was finalized.

    In summer of last year, immediately following the Altered Images fiasco, I submitted to Sony my requests for all 3 of the RCA Bow Wow Wow albums to reissue, complete with loads of bonus tracks. And I made sure not to post about it anywhere for fear of another idea theft. I eventually got quotes on 2 of the 3 albums, though the other still hasn't received a quote in the better part of a year, even after numerous inquiries. I approved the quotes for the two and they allegedly moved on to legal, which generally takes about 3 months. Then came the end of year drama where all communication ceased and I couldn't get a response from either of my contacts at Sony, resulting in me having to reach out to the VP of Sales. He seemed to kick start things again and I was asked to provide a top 3 list of the most important albums I wanted reissued that were to be cleared before the end of Q1 (which ends next week). One of those top requests was a Bow Wow Wow release. As recently as this morning, I sent a message asking why this album was still stuck in legal limbo after more than six months when it's supposed to be cleared by next week. No response to that question.

    Then just a couple hours ago, I found that Cherry Red have just announced a Bow Wow Wow box set release for May to include all of the albums and material I had requested from Sony. AGAIN!? OK, am I really supposed to believe it's coincidence that the Altered Images catalog had been out of print for 15 years, then a couple months after my request to reissue their catalog, Cherry Red just happened to put together a release idea which caused me to cancel mine? And that after 20 years of being out of print, it's another coincidence that Cherry Red have just announced a Bow Wow Wow box set release while my long-requested titles were stuck in legal limbo for more than twice the standard time without explanation? Not a chance. It's clear to me that Cherry Red have the type of relationship with someone at Sony that they are notified of the titles I am requesting, and then mine end up in unexplained delay while Cherry Red beat me to market. I didn't realize that my Sony requests had to be ran by Cherry Red before I could be allowed to do them. It's pretty clear that Cherry Red are viciously trying to corner the reissue market with rushed and shoddy releases, and using their relationships within Sony to reduce any competition. Having worked for Cherry Red for several years, I'm aware of how shady they can be with the word 'integrity' definitely lacking from their vocabulary. But this is an all time low for them, and it's not helping Sony build a positive image either. I've emailed all 3 of the primary contacts at Sony, including the VP of Sales, regarding this matter. I will not sulk away with my tail between my legs. Someone needs to provide answers but I'm sure that won't happen.
     
  21. Michael

    Michael I LOVE WIDE S-T-E-R-E-O!

    and I'll bet you've heard; it'a only business...a cut your throat business...
     
  22. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I had no anticipation that the CD reissue business was so cut throat, but I'm finding that out. How Cherry Red managed to become the reissue Mafia is anyone's guess. But they clearly have some inside help, and it makes me wonder how many at Sony condone this behavior if they are willing to leave mine sitting there for ages to allow CR to slap their garbage together. Case in point, Thursday of last week I asked to increase the priority of one of my titles to that magical top 3 list, none of which had been cleared despite the Q1 deadline. Monday of this week, I received notice that it had been fully cleared and could proceed... two days after I asked about it, and it was actually the last title I submitted to Sony. I guess it was something Cherry Red weren't interested in, so lucky me, right? Now I have doubts that one and only 'cleared' title after nearly a full year will even make it through at this point.
     
  23. Blair G.

    Blair G. Senior Member

    Location:
    Delta, BC, Canada
    Very disheartening to read this as you’ve obviously invested a great deal of time, thought and energy (and probably money) into this merry-go-round.
    The whole thing with Cherry Red certainly looks suspicious. One “coincidental” release I can see, but twice in quick succession really stretches the bounds of credulity.
    Though their vast catalog and labels intrigue me I’ve always been wary of Cherry Red’s sound quality based on reviews here and there. All I have is one Runaways disc and a bunch of Suzi Quatros, they seem OK.
    Would love to know why you call them shady but I strongly suspect discretion will prevent you from elaborating.

    Good luck and I hope you stick with it, anxious to see & hear what you can do when given the chance
     
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  24. Scott Davies

    Scott Davies Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I suspect my dealing with Sony are wrapping up. They've been the most difficult to deal with of all of the majors, though none have been gravy. I was going to announce that I signed two contracts with Warners a couple weeks ago but I'm not going to announce the titles just yet. I also signed 3 pre-approval contracts with Universal a couple weeks ago but communication with them regarding my first request is still proving challenging.

    And I will gladly share what happened with Cherry Red, considering this recent conduct:
    I got in touch with Cherry Red in 2006 because they were pumping out way too many bad sounding products. During the correspondence I mentioned that I had been remastering for myself for years. They owned material by a band I liked called Artery, and when I inquired about it they asked if I'd like to master it. I said sure, and thus began my first release. They owned the masters so I got a CD-R transfer to work from for most of the tracks, some came from vinyl.

    Over the next couple of years, I did over 15 reissues for Cherry Red. But here's the thing, they didn't want to pay to have original master tapes sourced. So since I was very good at remastering from vinyl, they asked me to use vinyl (or previously existing CD's) to "remaster" from. In one correspondence at the time that included Sony UK, Sony told CR they had the masters pulled and ready to transfer. CR replied telling me to just work from my vinyl collection. I figured the only way to ensure they would be a decent quality is to do them myself since I was a fan of the music (most releases were my suggestion), and I wanted to see them done the best possible from the sources. Most of this work was done free of charge. I would often just get merchandise in trade. Eventually there were a few small fees paid but it really amounted to pennies for the amount of work.

    But the end came when working on the Balaam and the Angel reissues, which I was not a fan of but I was requested to do the work. The project manager was getting source material from the band in the form of CD-R's of the original CD's and 12" singles for bonus tracks. The band member was taking a while to get us the 12" singles so I offered to buy them on eBay if CR would reimburse me. But then they started beating into me that they had a deadline and they needed the mastering done ASAP, and flat out told me to skimp on restoration quality for the sake of meeting a deadline. I told them I will not have my name on a sub-standard product. Their response made me livid. They said to do it sub-par and just keep my name off the release. I was horrified that all the talk of improving the quality on their releases was completely disregarded for the sake of their lousy deadline. I flat out refused to accommodate such insulting suggestions. The CD's were mastered properly from the sources I had to use and they didn't make their stupid deadline, and the world kept spinning. But after all the free work I had provided, I told them that (for lack of a better term) that I resign from further projects. I did finish up a project I had already started and did one final project as a special request for another project manager who was also a friend of mine.

    So that sums it up, not seeking out the proper source material, and even asking to rush it through without quality concerns. Yet they seem to hold controlling interest in the reissue market anywhere.
     
  25. Blair G.

    Blair G. Senior Member

    Location:
    Delta, BC, Canada
    So when people say “I think this CR label release was mastered fron vinyl” they might be right.
    Makes me wonder about those Suzi Quatros I bought on the 7’ts label.
    The first one (Suzi Quatro s/t) sounded fine so I jumped in and bought the rest.
    But haven’t listened to all of them carefully yet.
    Will hope for the best
     
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