Steve Hoffman's "Aja" Steely Dan...WOW!

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Grant, Sep 23, 2003.

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  1. KeithH

    KeithH Success With Honor...then and now

    Location:
    Beaver Stadium
    Dave and Ben, I recall reading that the Steely Dan catalog was remastered in 1992. I think it was 1992. Many of the Dan albums were released back then as part of MCA's "COMPACT DISC COMPACT PRICE" line. The COMPACT DISC COMPACT PRICE Steely Dan discs have that awful plaid design on the back insert, and the back cover of the booklet has an ad for the COMPACT DISC COMPACT PRICE series. Aja was remastered around 1992, but I don't think it was ever released as part of this series.

    The '92 remaster of Aja retained the original catalog number of MCAD-37214, but the catalog numbers of the other Dan albums were changed. For example, the original catalog number for Katy Lied is MCAD-37043, but the catalog number of the COMPACT DISC COMPACT PRICE version (with the plaid back insert) is MCAD-31194. I just got this version of Katy Lied today at a used CD shop. It is a US pressing, and it was made by JVC. The mirror band on the disc says "MFD BY JVC" and "MCAD-31194-1 1C11". The last two 1s are in a different font than the rest of the information in the mirror band. The last 1 may not actually be a 1. It sort of looks like a semicolon.

    Getting back to the '92 remaster of Aja, the DIDX-55 was dropped from the inserts on copies I have seen, and a barcode was added to the back insert. Also, a somewhat modern-looking MCA logo was added to the spines.

    I am guessing that you both have the '92 remaster. Unfortunately, I don't recall if the '92 remasters were done by Nichols, Glenn Meadows, Gary Katz, or someone else. I do know they are generally regarded as inferior to the earlier pressings. I haven't compared my COMPACT DISC COMPACT PRICE version of Katy Lied to the Japanese pressings yet.
     
  2. -Ben

    -Ben Senior Member

    Location:
    Washington DC Area
    My back insert DOES have the DIDX 55 on the spine.
    How about yours Dave?
     
  3. thxdave

    thxdave "One black, one white, one blonde"

    .....the search continues! ;-)

    dave
     
  4. thxdave

    thxdave "One black, one white, one blonde"

    The ONLY place I can find the DIDX number is on the printed booklet right under the MCAD number....nowhere else.

    d
     
  5. KeithH

    KeithH Success With Honor...then and now

    Location:
    Beaver Stadium
    Ben and Dave, I remembered after submitting my last post that one member here wrote a long time ago that Aja was remastered in both 1992 and 1993. As far as I know, the original catalog number was retained for both versions. Perhaps the subtle differences in artwork that you are observing indicate that one of you has the '92 version and the other has the '93 version. I could be wrong here since your discs show the same track times. Maybe it was only the artwork that was changed between the '92 and '93 versions. I'd have to search for the information here.
     
  6. thxdave

    thxdave "One black, one white, one blonde"

    I don't have a clue which one I have. The only way I can "date" it is by the printed copyright notices. It shows the original 1977 release date copyright and then a 1984 date for the reissue which I think they have to show every time it's reissued with new artwork, for example. My "clear spine" 1977/1999 version was the Nichols master. Finally, the MFSL doesn't have any dates other than 1977.
     
  7. -Ben

    -Ben Senior Member

    Location:
    Washington DC Area
    Dave and Keith,
    I don't think the differences in the back insert are that important. After all ...mine is a BMG and Dave's is not. The fact remains that both were made by JVC USA, have exact inner ring markings AND exact same timings. Therefore same version.
     
  8. John Buchanan

    John Buchanan I'm just a headphone kind of fellow. Stax Sigma

    There must have been at least 5 different US mastering attempts at this album.
    1. Steve Hoffman
    2. Roger Nichols I
    3. Mobile Fidelity
    4. Roger Nichols II ("Remastered by the artist"
    5. Roger Nichols III (Clear spine, latest)
    Steve would know when 1, 2 and 3 were pressed.
     
  9. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me! Thread Starter

    You forgot the Glen Meadows version in the boxed set. That makes six.
     
  10. KeithH

    KeithH Success With Honor...then and now

    Location:
    Beaver Stadium
    Ben and Dave,

    The '92 and '93 releases of Aja do not show copyright dates of '92 or '93. I agree that your discs are the same, and I am thinking that only the artwork was changed between the '92 and '93 releases.


    John,

    I am with you on the different masterings. The problem is that the version that was considered Steve's mastering and the version that was considered Nichols' first mastering seem identical in every way.
     
  11. KeithH

    KeithH Success With Honor...then and now

    Location:
    Beaver Stadium
    I exchanged PMs some months ago with another member regarding Aja. This member is very knowledgable about the different releases. Below is one PM he sent me (now no longer P ;)). Note that the message starts with some information on the Japanese CBS/Sony pressing.

    This information indicates that Ben and Dave have the '92 version.
     
    marcfeld69 likes this.
  12. KeithH

    KeithH Success With Honor...then and now

    Location:
    Beaver Stadium
    Here is another message I got from the same person some months ago:

    I'm pretty sure he meant 5000, not 4000. Unfortunately, this person doesn't post here much anymore, but I am hoping he will chime in. I am not sure what the '85-'86 versions look like. Perhaps there are subtle differences in the artwork. I'll be looking for used copies of Aja to see if I can find these various versions.

    If the Hoffman and original Nichols versions were mastered from different sources, they sure should sound different and show different times. :confused:
     
  13. HeavyDistortion

    HeavyDistortion Senior Member

    Location:
    Baltimore, MD
    Keith,

    I have two CD versions of "Aja" from 1984, the CRC "Made In Japan" copy, and the "Made In Japan" copy, which from your info, both seem to be the original Nichols' masterings. They both sound wonderful to my ears, as do the other original "Made In Japan" Steely Dan CDs that I have. In other words, if we can't have Steve's version of "Aja", I would think that most Steely Dan fans would be very satisfied with the original Roger Nichols' mastered CDs; I know that I am.




    Ed Hurdle
    HeavyDistortion
     
  14. Gardo

    Gardo Audio Epistemologist

    Location:
    Virginia
    A few quick thoughts on this ever-fascinating search for the Hoffman Aja:

    My brother has a UK CD of this album that was purchased in the early 1980's, probably 1985. This CD has the DIDX number on the back cover and the booklet, but the CD was pressed by JVC and has the JVC numbers stamped on it that Keith et al. have already enumerated. Before this thread got started, I thought this CD might be the Hoffman version, because to my ears it sounded unusually fine, certainly better than the other versions I've heard since joining this Forum. (Unfortunately, I had an Aja I bought when the CD was first released that was probably the Hoffman version, but I sold it when I got the 1999 remaster because at the time I Didn't Know Better.:( )

    I'm now pretty sure that what my brother has is the first Nichols version. While I'd love to have Steve's version, I am not too broken up. The sound is first-rate and so much better than later releases that I have that listening-again-for-the-first-time sensation. Also, it's worth remembering that Steve has said many times that his version is not all that different from Roger's and that both sound fine. There's an upper-midrange EQ notch that Roger liked to use for some reason--probably to give a little "distance" to the treble--and to Steve's ears it didn't sound quite right, so he filled the notch in halfway. I'm confident I'd be able to hear the difference (or so I like to think), but I'm also confident that the difference would not be night and day.

    All of that said, I'd LOVE to have the SH version just to be complete about it. :D

    And now I see that my post crossed with Heavy Distortion's--there's an echo in here (and it's me!).
     
  15. -Ben

    -Ben Senior Member

    Location:
    Washington DC Area
    I TOTALLY agree.
     
  16. Gardo

    Gardo Audio Epistemologist

    Location:
    Virginia
    Okay, is this the official CD mastering list for Aja?

    1984
    1. Steve Hoffman master from original analog tapes--5000 copies, pressed in Japan

    2. Roger Nichols master from digital masters of original analog tapes.

    1985-86
    3. MCA remasters from analog tapes (originals? safety copies?). Cheap "plaid" graphics on the back.

    4. MoFi version (mastered by whom?)

    1992
    5. "Remastered by the artist" (Nichols again, from mid-80's digital transfers, or from original analog tapes?)

    1993
    6. Remastered by Glenn Meadows for Citizen Steely Dan box set.

    1999
    7. Current master, by Roger Nichols (from original analog masters? 80's digital masters? later digital masters?)

    Am I in the ballpark here?
     
  17. -Ben

    -Ben Senior Member

    Location:
    Washington DC Area
    Re: Steve Hoffman's "Aja"...WOW!


    Grant,
    How about giving us your disc's details..total and individual track timings and matrix info.
     
  18. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    Probably Krieg Wunderlich I'd guess.
     
  19. Michael St. Clair

    Michael St. Clair Forum Resident

    Location:
    Funkytown
    Does anybody know if Steve's "Aja" is mastered with pre emphasis?
     
  20. KeithH

    KeithH Success With Honor...then and now

    Location:
    Beaver Stadium
    Gardo said:


    I am raising the possibility that either version number 1 or version number 2 was not actually released. It has been said that both were released in the manner that you stated, but I'm not so sure.

    Also, I'm not sure there is a version of Aja that matches your version number 3. I've seen a lot of used copies of Aja in stores, but never one with a plaid back insert (meaning part of the COMPACT DISC COMPACT PRICE series). As I stated in an earlier post, MCA changed catalog numbers for titles released in the COMPACT DISC COMPACT PRICE series, and the only MCA version of Aja that I have seen with a catalog number different than the original (MCAD-37214) is the '99 remaster. All versions before the '99 remaster seem to carry the original catalog number.
     
  21. Evan

    Evan Senior Member

    I have made copies for friends before and it appears not to have pre-emphasis.
     
  22. KeithH

    KeithH Success With Honor...then and now

    Location:
    Beaver Stadium
    Evan, could you post the particulars your Hoffman version of Aja (total time, track times, matrix code)? Thanks in advance.
     
  23. badfingerjoe

    badfingerjoe Senior Member

    Location:
    New Jersey
    Keith, you're right..both Aja & Gaucho were not released in the "plaid back" series as the other titles were....I also wonder if with the other titles the original DIDX pressings are different than the "plaid back" versions?????

    JF
     
  24. JohnT

    JohnT Senior Member

    Location:
    PA & FL gulf coast
    And another one for consideration....


    COVER booklet: MCAD-37214 and DIDX 55 on the back (no barcode on booklet).
    Back insert... DIDX 55 MCAD-37214 MCA RECORDS

    DISC:
    Manufactured in USA
    MCAD-37214 DIDX 000055 on disc
    INNER RING: DIDX-000055 4 (then 8 unprintable characters)

    Total Time: 39:56 (as displayed on Sony SCD-C555ES)

    BLACK COW: 5:10
    AJA: 7:57
    DEACON BLUES: 7:37
    PEG: 3:57
    HOME AT LAST: 5:34
    I GOT THE NEWS: 5:06
    JOSIE: 4:32

    Music starts at 0:00 for all tracks.

    Very nice sounding disc. In comparison to a CD-R of Steely Dan gold (vinyl) I did recently, this CD blows that away.
     
  25. -Ben

    -Ben Senior Member

    Location:
    Washington DC Area

    It seems to me (and feel free to correct me), we are stuck.

    ALL the early stuff (PRE 1992 non MFSL) seems to have the SAME timings (Made in Japan or Made in the USA)....which brings us back to KeithH's theory....either ALL Hoffman or ALL Nichols. And if so...where is the other one. Unless someone can come up with an early disc with drastically different timings.
    Otherwise, we'll never know if there are actually two different versions or two very similar versions.... or just ONE version.
    Keith, Is that how YOU read the data so far?
     
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