Steve Wozniak: "Bluetooth just sounds so flat for the same music." (Apple ditching 3.5mm on iPhone)*

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by KeithH, Aug 24, 2016.

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  1. Metralla

    Metralla Joined Jan 13, 2002

    Location:
    San Jose, CA
  2. uofmtiger

    uofmtiger Forum Resident

    Location:
    Memphis, TN
    I don't consider Bluetooth hi fidelity, either. However, I don't think it is as bad as people are saying it is, either. I have a pair of Parrot Zik 2 headphones and they have an app that can change the EQ, the amount of noise cancellation, and the sound stage. They sound decent...better than Apple's earbuds hooked to the aux output. They are very nice for convenience or when I want to block out external noise. In my car, Bluetooth is fine, I am mainly focused on driving.

    As has been mentioned, Apple isn't demanding that you use Bluetooth with the iPhone. It comes with an adapter and a pair of ear buds.
    This stuff is great! I use it everyday to tape my car key around my leg so I don't lose it when it isn't inserted into the car.
     
  3. BayouTiger

    BayouTiger Forum Resident

    Yes it's actually good for everything except sealing ducts!
     
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  4. The7thStranger

    The7thStranger Part of the Rhythm Nation

    Location:
    An der Lahn...
    iPhone 7 sales may be lower than the iPhone 6s, analyst claims »

    I think this is indicative of Apple's unwillingness to move with the times. Removing the headphone jack isn't "progressive." It's a "lookatmeimstillrelevant" move. It kind of distracted a lot of people from figuring out that the 7 is basically just the 6S with better vibration.
     
  5. crispi

    crispi Vinyl Archaeologist

    Location:
    Berlin
    Never trust any internet headline that has the word "analyst" in it. Better to wait for the official report.
     
  6. The7thStranger

    The7thStranger Part of the Rhythm Nation

    Location:
    An der Lahn...
    Apple won't release the numbers for some reason. But there's widespread report of the phone not exactly selling homerun figures, particularly in Asia.
     
  7. Where is this widespread? What does "homerun figures" even mean?

    Apple only needs to sell as many phones as they need to meet their own projections. Again, they're not after market share. It's profit share where the money lies.
     
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  8. uofmtiger

    uofmtiger Forum Resident

    Location:
    Memphis, TN
    The same outlet has this article from the 28th, yours is from the 26th

    Not even Apple was expecting its ‘boring’ new iPhone 7 to be this popular

    I have no idea who BGR is, but they certainly know how to cover all sides of an issue.:D

    Apple will release numbers at QE. They have shortages of their new jet black phone so that will undoubtedly affect sales numbers. You could not pick one up at most ( any?) stores on release day.
     
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  9. crispi

    crispi Vinyl Archaeologist

    Location:
    Berlin
    This is what I meant. Bogus journalism all the way. Everyone gains clicks from running Apple-related stories, so it's no wonder they try to "cover all sides", as you pertinently said, regardless of whether what they say makes sense or not.
     
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  10. The7thStranger

    The7thStranger Part of the Rhythm Nation

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    It's not the only source/theory/whatever you wanna call it. If you Google "iPhone sales," many of the results point towards poor sales in comparison to the 6.
     
  11. uofmtiger

    uofmtiger Forum Resident

    Location:
    Memphis, TN
    Once again, it is ALL theory until they release actual numbers at QE.
     
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  12. The7thStranger

    The7thStranger Part of the Rhythm Nation

    Location:
    An der Lahn...
    This might be the first time I've actively wanted them to fail. I'll remain a Philistine if it means they put the headphone jack back in. :p Some of my friends have been selling their Apple stock. The new Macbook was the first straw, and I think the iPhone was the second.

    I still want the SE, though. Or the 6S. My whole daily driving ecosystem is now 100% Apple. But I just can't get behind this mess of a phone.
     
  13. uofmtiger

    uofmtiger Forum Resident

    Location:
    Memphis, TN
    If you (friends/relatives) have a 401k, you may want to rethink your position, but USA Today has an article about how analysts have been all over the place:

    iPhone 7 sales are boom and bust, and so are Apple shares

    Personally, I always want them to do well since so many people have 401k plans that are heavily invested in Apple ( quite often being the most owned stock). I think the limited supply of the black phones is causing them some headaches in their initial release figures, so they are waiting for QE to release numbers...for good reason.

    Personally, I didn't buy the MacBook or have any intention to, so it had no affect on my feelings about Apple. I don't use the headphone jack, so I am getting the new phone. I want the better camera(s).

    I think Apple, with the inclusion of the $9 adapter and lightning earbuds, will keep most people from leaving the iPhone. For a lot of people, there is a lot more discomfort in changing systems than attaching an adapter. If you end up leaving them eventually over this issue, I think you will be part of a very small group, but if that is your number one need in a phone, I don't blame you. If they removed the cameras, I would move on, so we all have our must have features.

    I am curious to see what the next MBP looks like, but it would be much easier for me to leave MacOS for Windows than leaving iOS for Android. Currently, the main sticking point is AirPlay, but I also don't want to lose apps that aren't on Android or repurchase apps that are.
     
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  14. The7thStranger

    The7thStranger Part of the Rhythm Nation

    Location:
    An der Lahn...
    I actually use an Android phone. What I wrote ecosystem, I meant iCloud + Macbook. Even with the Android, I sync iCloud to it and have entirely erase Google (no Google account, no PlayStore, etc). This being that if I had a gun to my head and had to choose a company I'd "trust" with my data, it would be Apple. And so far, it's been no problem using iCloud (contact, calendar and e-mail) on Android, but it would be nice to have everything synced perfectly across my devices.

    I think beyond the headphone jack exclusion, the iPhone 7 doesn't have a whole lot to it that's a major improvement over the 6S, which I don't think is helping sales. The better camera yes, but other than that, it's not exactly a leap towards the future the way Apple advertises. I mean, 10 years in, and Apple still haven't produced a camera that rivals what Nokia was doing five years ago on Windows Phone. It just feels like Apple is slipping. For a long time, they were refining their phones, and the 6S and SE are likely the most refined versions of a system that they have ever had-- in short, they are perfect versions of the iPhone 2G. But now, in 2016, it just feels like less. The removal of the jack was used to make room for a chip that handles better tactile feedback, but that's something my GPS can do. If they had to remove such a ubiquitous feature in the name of advancement, then they need to actually come through with said advancement.
     
    lbangs likes this.
  15. SamS

    SamS Forum Legend

    Location:
    Texas
    As someone who owns a 6s Plus and 7 plus, I'd say they're more different than you're making them out to be. Believe it or not, the non-mechanical home button is actually the biggest change in day to day use. I like it more each time I use it, and wished my other devices had it. The new 7 Plus camera is also a noticeable step up, but I'm still exploring all the ways it's better than earlier ones.
     
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  16. Stone Turntable

    Stone Turntable Independent Head

    Location:
    New Mexico USA
    Although this thread is about audio, I'd be very interested in specific detail about how you justify the notion that the iPhone 7 plus is an indifferent and essentially stalled-0ut camera offering with little or no innovation, and how Nokia Windows phone cameras circa 2011 are still better than what Apple now offers. 'Cause to me these claims seem completely untethered from the fact-based world.
     
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  17. uofmtiger

    uofmtiger Forum Resident

    Location:
    Memphis, TN
    That Nokia was essentially a camera lens with a phone attached. Also, it was notoriously slow to shoot and focus, so it was essentially like my old P&S that missed shots constantly because if it's lack of speed. No, Apple should not got that route.

    I see the 7 as an improvement over the 6s. Much better battery, water/dust resistance, optical stabilization on the camera, a brighter screen with a wider color gamut, significantly faster GPUs and Graphics performance, stereo speakers, a 256gb option, etc.. It is a much better phone than the 6s.
     
  18. Jack Flannery

    Jack Flannery Forum Resident

    Location:
    Houston, TX
    I've seen some sample pics. Pretty impressive.
     
  19. The7thStranger

    The7thStranger Part of the Rhythm Nation

    Location:
    An der Lahn...
    The Nokia 1020 was a much better camera than anything Apple has ever released, but my apologies. That was 2013.

    And I didn't say the iPhone 7 had no improvements. I said it just doesn't have any big ones. All the improvements seem relatively minor in the grand scheme of things. That's just how I see it. I don't see the innovation or special spark in feature or design.

    Was the battery on the 6S such a widespread problem? I know the SE is rated higher, but I was under the impression the battery life was great on it. Otherwise, it's all kind of meh. The screen on the 6S, in my opinion, is phenomenal. The 256GB option is nice, but I mean really this all seems kind of meh. If you put in a headphone jack, it's more like the iPhone 6S II. This phone comes off as a side-upgrade than a real upgrade.

    Reminds me of when HTC did the Droid Incredible 2, and it was essentially the same exact phone as the D-Inc 1 with nothing mind-blowing to offer.

    I've yet to play around with the 7, so I can't really speak to this. I'm not sure I'd find it as interesting as you do, but I'm glad you're enjoying the phone's changes. :)

    But out of all the minor changes you guys have described, I don't think anything of them are worth removing the headphone jack for. And from the looks of it, the headphone jack was removed because it fought with the camera and the component that produces tactile feedback, and that just seems silly given how every other manufacturer has never had this issue. Apple could solve the battery life problem if they made the devices slightly thicker. It's not like the 4S - SE are a bunch of clunkers.

    Anyway, this is all just my opinion. The 7 has kind of ruined a bit of my enthusiasm for the SE, because I don't like where the Apple is rolling. But I'm still thinking about it. Regardless, the headphone jack will remain a necessary component for my daily use.
     
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  20. The7thStranger

    The7thStranger Part of the Rhythm Nation

    Location:
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    Also, the camera on the Icon doesn't have that shutter speed issue under normal circumstances. The 1020 definitely did, though.

    Still, there's no camera phone on Earth that even comes close to what Nokia was doing with those lenses in terms of final output except for maybe the Samsung Zoom, with that huge censor on the back. :laugh:
     
  21. tootull

    tootull Looking through a glass onion

    Location:
    Canada
  22. Ghostworld

    Ghostworld Senior Member

    Location:
    US

    So it ain't straight wire with gain going on. As we've said, just adding more crap to the signal. Your $400 headphones are now dependent on whatever quality this chip inside a $9 dongle contains.



    "As the user oldturkey03 managed to slice open his audio adapter, the marking over it does not suggest much about the chip. It only states that the chip is from Apple.

    He uncovered that mystery IC by the Lightning connector, marked 338S00140 A0SM1624 TW—which doesn’t tell us much, other than it’s an Apple part number.

    According to iFixit, the exact purpose of the IC is unknown, but it is believed that it contains a ”digital-to-analog converter (DAC) and amplifier, and its counterpart, an analog-to-digital-converter (ADC).” This is because all audio accessories need analog signals to work and unlike the antique 3.5mm headphone jack, the Lightning connector is digital. DAC is used to bridge the gap and by that it can be said to contain an ADC circuit for converting analog signals to something that can pass through the Lightning port for our iPhones.

    ADVERTISEMENT
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    In terms of the Lightning audio adapter performance, the sound quality falls ever so slightly which will not be noticeable to some users. We can, hence, state that the audio quality on the iPhone 6s and 6s Plus is a little greater than what we will adhere to on the iPhone 7 and 7 Plus. For more details on the scenario, be sure to read the full analysis here.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016
  23. Ghostworld

    Ghostworld Senior Member

    Location:
    US

    What would be a model number for the Nokia Windows phone? I might pick up one of these to test. I use my camera far more than I use the phone, web, or text features.
     
  24. The7thStranger

    The7thStranger Part of the Rhythm Nation

    Location:
    An der Lahn...
    Nokia Lumia 1020 (41MXP), and the Nokia Lumia ICON/930 (20MXP)
     
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  25. Mel Harris

    Mel Harris Audiophile since 1970!

    Location:
    Petaluma, CA
    An amazing amount of tech for $9, no? I forgot that it has to go the other way (ADC) for the microphone. Audiophiles will use an external device (DAC, Audeze CIPHER, etc.).

    In keeping with the thread's title, Apple still excluded AptX on the iPhone 7 (and all previous models). AptX is available on most new Apple desktops. There has been no analog "line out" on Apple mobile devices since the 30 pin connector went away. Since Apple's only "high fidelity" mobile Bluetooth tech is the is W1-enabled "AirPods", we'll probably never know how objectively "good" it is. Somehow I doubt Beats cans will take on Audeze, but stranger things have happened.

    I have tried the new dongle with my iOS 10 updated iPhone 6 and a pair of Etymotic HF5s. IMHO, the sound quality comparison between that and plugging the same IEMs into the analog jack is like comparing the products of two different fast food restaurants. It's fast food. Is the Whopper better than the Big Mac?

    :shrug:

    Is that audiophile snobbery? :agree:
     
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