The Americans sixth and final season approaches...

If it could be determined: Just the fact that they didn't fly under their Elizabeth and Philip Jennings names, the fact that they did not fly under these makes their stories suspicious. . . .

 

No, on their stated trips down to see the 'important client' of their travel company in Florida. Unless they booked tickets for that trip as well to cover themselves, but the airline would register the no shows.

 

Me thinks Paige is gonna die.

 

That pill round Liz' neck is not going to be used in the intended manner.

Paige is in a bad place. Even for this show, where she's the daughter of murderers. A friendless college girl. Ending her "journey" is going to be an act of mercy.

I will say that Henry is the model the Jennings wanted to follow, and Paige forced the issue a lot. She's still in a bad place.

 

It makes me remember, do we murder the enemy or do we kill them? During the Cold War how strong is the line of demarcation between combatants and non-combatants? Even "The Enemy" is not so easily defined when one is sitting behind a large red button affixed with the words "Do Not Push."

Now we have World Cup matches in Moscow. We sell the Russians laptops from Dell and HP; they give us back pirated films and interactive porn.

I suppose our captured German rocket scientists were better than their captured German rocket scientists.

 

We kill the enemy.

 

I'm always amazed at this show's economy with words. And when we do hear dialogue, it's often in Russian.
It wasn't quite a Hank moment but it was pretty good. When Stan was snooping around the breaker box I'm thinking "Start flipping switches Stan! What have you got to lose?"
I don't remember the circumstances around why William (Dylan Baker) said the things he said to Stan while he was dying, but obviously it was huge for Stan's insights into the Jenningses. And his convo with Henry.
R.I.P. Marilyn. She was one of the many background spies we see all the time but rarely hear from-and she was involved with many missions with P & E. She had a rather ignominious end, but that's the spy biz.
I don't care what Paige says-she has no idea what it takes to do this job. She just wants her mother's approval.

 

Even wars have rules of engagement. You may have more of a chance of getting away with something, but then there are war crimes as well. You have the drop on me, I surrender, you're not supposed to shoot me anyway. You imprison me for the duration of the war or until you make an exchange. The Jennings don't take prisoners.

Germany occupied France during WWII. That didn't mean the Germans could just shoot the French whenever they felt like it.

I lived through the 1980s, and it was never expected that civilians living in the US were fair game to Russian spies. Never a thing.

This whole justification bit has been done many times with this show. The show is interesting, but the Jennings are not good people and never have been. When caught, they should be strung up in the town square as an example, and left for the crows.

 

So when Stan broke into the Jennings' house, should any of them come back early when he's still in the house, we're all down with Stan simply killing them then and there, right? We're cool with that? Because it's what the Jennings do every single week. Break into private property looking for something, kill people who see them or are in the way.

 

I was surprised Philip and Elizabeth didn’t have a burglar alarm or some other way of alerting them that someone had been in their house.

 

Maybe they do! I hope they at least do what I used to do when I was about 10 years old and stick a moistened hair between a door and doorframe to alert me that one of my sisters had entered my room illegally!

 

First, though espionage, itself, isn't a war crime, when caught by the offended nation, or army, or faction, the trial and sentencing of a spy might as well be that of a war criminal. There is no fair play for captured spies. This is probably how it should be, as it is an ancient game, with its own rules. So, yes, should Philip and Elizabeth get caught by the US government they should be punished above and beyond conventional wartime jurisprudence. This usually means a lose of life, even though there are far worse things than death. They knew when they signed up that the penalty for getting caught was death, as does a US spy, a British Spy, or whatever spy.

The second point, though - and I don't want to offend you - is that we can't be naive to think that the Germans didn't shoot French citizens, or that US Marines didn't rape Okinawan women, or that surrendering British soldiers didn't get ventilated by Afghani troops. Civilians, they always get caught in the crossfire. It isn't right, any more than war, itself, is right, but somewhere along the way the human race decided that war was here to stay, and brother, it's catching!

So, no the Jennings do not take prisoners for those people who actually get in the way of their jobs. That's the spy game. Often citizens are on the battlefield, though this kind of activity wasn't that proliferous in the '60s & '80s. I bet only a few hundred American and Soviet citizens were killed between 1945 and 1991 under the banner of espionage. As I grew up in the 1980s, there was no reason for us to hear about something that never really happened (that much). I didn't hear about spies. All I heard was that nuclear war could happen at any time, and to study well, because we were competing against Russian children for the future.

I would be cool with it. Play with fire and there's the chance of getting burned. It would be a crap way to end the show, but in theory if this was a show about American spies in Russia, they were caught, and they got whacked, I wouldn't be happy about it, but I would understand why they were killed. They died for their country.

 

Very insightful- esp. for one who was in the service (you must have been somewhat impervious to that basic training brainwashing). Thank you for your service. The military is a necessary evil. But shows like this display how fear, paranoia, propaganda, etc. lead to craziness on both sides.

Great show. Really shows many shades of gray and avoids black/white. But I'm not sure combatants have that luxury; if they see too much gray, they can begin to doubt their mission- just like Phillip.

 

So scary that few wish to really look at it- and those that are forced to (b/c of their job) would have rather stayed ignorant.

This seems very evident to me from your posts.

 

Excellent post! Great points and I agree with most everything you said. (The only disagreement would be about Sandusky. This is no excuse, but there's a large body of evidence that the vast majority of child molesters were themselves molested as children.)

Part of what makes this show exceptional is the lack of stereotypes; no good guys/bad guys, just guys following their (sometimes misguided) beliefs. It leads to the kind of discussion that results in responses like yours and can help overcome the slanted history we were all taught in school.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

 

Eh, I don't know; I mean, there's a purpose to "group think" in the Marine Corps, or "hive mind," whatever you want to call it, and that's to keep each other alive. There's also a rush that's associated with acting and thinking as one entity, so as far as being impervious, I very much saw what I was getting into while doing it, yet you allow yourself to be assimilated into the system, for your own success, and the success of others. I was also almost 22 when I joined, a college graduate, so that might have had something to do with it. It wasn't wartime when I joined, but it certainly was about halfway through my stint. I opted out of OCS because it felt like cheating.

I usually don't talk much about my service, but I'm illustrating a point, i.e. do you see how on a granular level, a rifle squad, or a platoon, or a company mimics the overall flavor of a country and the patriotism thereof? This is why, from a distance, I can understand Philip and Elizabeth's patriotism, just as I understand my own. I love my country, flaws and all. That Philip started to see gray (by the way, that's a good point), is because he's been at it for too long, to the point that it became too much to bear for his own psychological makeup. That, and the fact that he's human, and grew to love the creature comforts that the USA had to offer.

I'm simplifying it, but no there aren't any shades of gray when somebody is shooting at you. At least there never was in my mind.

Anyway, when it comes down to nut cutting, I would imagine that any shades of gray that Philip sees now would revert to black and white again if his family is faced with annihilation. It had been bandied about that Philip might turn himself in, but I don't see that anymore. It was a passing thought. Ironically, he would do what any red-blooded American would do, and that's to fight for his family first, even if it's for a communist cause. From there, let the chips fall where they may.

 

Certainly thre's the purpose of keeping people alive behind the way basic training is constructed, but I think it goes beyond that. From what I've heard from friends, they break you down psychologically so they can re-mold you into the pattern of a "true soldier." Group mind undoubtedly helps keep people alive, but it also minimizes individuality, which can sometimes lead to dissent (which can be life-threatening in combat, but also increases chances of disobedience in the ranks; which of these is a priority for the command, I'm not sure).

Granted, I've never experienced it myself in real life and am only going by my interpretations of others' expressions of their experience, so I welcome any different perspective you might have. But in my mind I think it might be more about control than saving lives...

But it seems you were more mature/aware than many in basic training. I'd imagine few other grunts had your level of awareness???

I can see the mimicing of a country and its patriotism in those things, though I would think they would be diluted to the commonly held core values. For instance, dissent and debate are a big part of what made this country great imo (though it seems we are gradually losing that ability), but that is not something that could be tolerated in the military.

I love my country too (though probably not to the extent of a veteran like you), but look at it like a History Professor once told me, "it's the worst country in the world- except for everyplace else." I.E. I love it despite its many flaws, as you said. But I don't believe we are superior to other countries/cultures. And I can completely understand how some cultures could see us as "The Great Satan," though I disagree with how they choose to respond to that perspective.

I agree with your analysis of why Phillip started to see gray. His psych make-up is very different from Liz's; he reached a point of over-saturation and found it increasily difficult to rationalize all the bloodshed. And while I'm sure he became enamored of the luxuries of Americam life, I also think he has a much more open mind than Liz and could see that our culture and citizens were not nearly as bad as the USSR's propaganda made them out to be.

Agree here as well. Once the combat starts, shades of gray are a luxury that cannot be afforded without risking harm/death. And family is the most important thing to protect. Doesn't the military even put them before country? It's God, family, country, isn't it?

As for Phillip turning himself in, the only way I see that happening is if it is to save his family. And at this point, I'm not even sure how much Elizabeth fits into that. I think he'd sacrifice Liz to save either child in a heartbeat.

The discussions in this thread are to me a mark of what a great series this is. To me, the greatness of a work of art boils down to how much it can enlighten its consumers. If it brings a new perspective or gets people talking about and re-thinking old notions, then it's a success. Judging by this thread, this shows a fantastic success.

I have to admit that I was totally unaware of how much more devastating Russian losses were in WW II than ours. I knew somewhat of how bad the "Russian Front" was, but had no idea just how many Russians were lost. And I held the belief that I imagine is common in this country that we were most responsible for winning that war, but now have a more balanced view.

But that sort of patriotic, slanted-history myopia is one of the main themes in this series, isn't it?

 

Philip is only invested so far as to protect the family. That is the only reason he did Chicago, to help Elizabeth. He doesn't care about the mission or the cause any more. He doesn't see the opposition as the Big Bad anymore.

The aggressive paranoia portrayed on the show is something that was specific to the USSR at the time. It's not just Any Country, 1980s, it was a specific thing. It's why they show Elizabeth believing the Americans are somehow attacking the USSR Way Of Life, while she frequently breaks into private property and kills people who get in her way.

Philip would attack those who attacked his family, but he would turn himself in if that helped protect them too. If Paige is arrested, Elizabeth will throw her under the bus and expect Paige to kill herself. Philip will react differently.

 

I also kind of doubt that this show will come down to some final, violent, conflict between P&E and the Feds. We know P&E can handle themselves just fine there. But P&E are fairly metaphorical characters, and if the show sticks with metaphor, they must end like the USSR ended, with internal collapse while bloodless on the outside. So if that follows, there will be no confrontation there. Any violence may be between P&E themselves, to represent the ultimate rending.

 

Finally saw the latest episode last night. the brief scene w/ Henry and Stan makes me think, again, Henry's not a spy. He wouldn't have given that up about the aunt he's never met if he was still hiding something.

I think maybe the storyline's heading towards Elizabeth being completely disillusioned, realizing that all the brutal murders she's committed have accomplished nothing. not sure though. it seems like she's passively aggressively leading Paige into continuing as a spy, albeit one out of the line of fire.

 

Finally saw last week's episode last night (and then last night's episode).

I have to say, I didn't expect Philip to come clean with Elizabeth like he did - though I like how he noted that he was doing it for their country which totally threw her off.
Also didn't expect how things came to a head and all of this validated him and now she's not just a blind soldier. This tipping point is huge.

Given Paige's continued interest (not sure if Elizabeth will stop her now that she is disillusioned with the Center) - it does seem like Paige's story will end tragically.
She is an idealist, but not mature enough to know or understand what she is doing.

It's possible that Elizabeth once again tries to pull her out of the spy game, but Claudia intervenes and then it becomes the cause vs stopping the cause and we all know what Paige will choose.

 

Why was Philip getting fitted for a new suit? Not sure if I missed something there...

 

That looked quite ominous to me...

If he's shopping for a casket in next week's episode, I'll be really worried.

 

Wow. I didn't even think that. Plus Philip rented that video, so he was getting all nostalgic. Not to mention they keep mentioning the cyanide capsule, so i'm sure that will play into one of the last two episodes. Maybe he'll take out his whole family then take the pill?

 

Phillip knows his destiny, and it's not a happy ending.

I think Claudia will receive orders to kill Phillip and Elizabeth, and she will try to convince Paige to carry out those orders.