The Beatles 1 and 1+

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by nikh33, Nov 17, 2015.

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  1. Gems-A-Bems

    Gems-A-Bems Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Duke City
    I think the question should be: How has he enhanced it?

    (aside from Love, which I am still not sure he had a substantial role in creating)
     
    paulmccartneyistheman likes this.
  2. soundQman

    soundQman Senior Member

    Location:
    Arlington, VA, USA
    Fair enough.
     
  3. paulmccartneyistheman

    paulmccartneyistheman Forum Resident

    I like the work Giles has done, because the old stereo mixes were unlistenable to me, and I’ve always went with mono Beatles.

    I’m glad the old stereo mixes are there and the new ones are readily available just the same. It’s not that big of deal, listen to them or not, it’s not as if my old Sgt Pepper disappeared when I put the new one on my shelf
     
    Frank likes this.
  4. Dillydipper

    Dillydipper Space-Age luddite

    Location:
    Central PA
    Well, in normal conversations with people who use a specialty craft, no, it wouldn't occur to me. Just seems to me like the most normal thing for him to be fake-shamed about something like that, I would not presume to take his "cowering" literally in such a case.
     
  5. thrivingonariff

    thrivingonariff Forum Resident

    Location:
    US
    Attempts to be determine exactly what Giles did or meant on the basis of the BBC piece require a degree of faith in journalistic accuracy (and Giles Martinistic-accuracy) and thoroughness that is greater than is warranted.
     
  6. supermd

    supermd Senior Member

    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    This is my biggest complaint with with 1+ mixes.
     
    Onder likes this.
  7. Sean Murdock

    Sean Murdock Forum Intruder

    Location:
    Bergenfield, NJ
    This is a curious detour ... I thought it was pretty widely accepted that Giles was almost ENTIRELY responsible for the LOVE mixes / mashups, with his father credited as "Producer" mainly out of respect.
     
  8. MarkTheShark

    MarkTheShark Senior Member

    Well, the mono mixes did kind of "go away" for quite some time, in that they were mostly out of print after about 1968 and not widely available for decades later, aside from some 45s and the odd occasional limited-edition reissue like the red vinyl mono reissue albums from Japan.

    The first time there was a worldwide reissue of mono albums was when the first four albums came out in mono on CD in 1987. And in their case, they were commercially available in mono only for the next 22 years.

    The 2009 mono box otherwise was really the first widely-available reissue of the mono versions of the Beatles albums.
     
  9. WonkyWilly

    WonkyWilly Forum Resident

    Location:
    Paradise, PA
    I find it generally odd that in most cases, Giles "replicated" the original stereo mixes, but ruined them with lousy compression. The compression itself isn't the problem, but the fact that it sounds incorrectly applied, or way overdone. You can hear bass frequencies poking in and out all over the place, which will briefly cause instability in the stereo image. It reminds me of the sound of those much-maligned Frank Zappa CD's from the 80's.
     
  10. Gems-A-Bems

    Gems-A-Bems Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Duke City
    There are too many other people credited on that release for that to be the case.
     
  11. vmajewsk

    vmajewsk Forum Resident

    Location:
    Mi
    You can't please everyone so you got to please yourself. Giles did, and now there is all this.
     
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  12. Sean Murdock

    Sean Murdock Forum Intruder

    Location:
    Bergenfield, NJ
    The only people credited with production on LOVE are George and Giles Martin. Yes, Paul Hicks and a cast of assistants are credited as Remix Engineers, but Giles is also credited for ProTools sequencing and programming -- plus, Giles did most of the interviews, Giles was the one who convinced Apple to go for it (with the "Tomorrow Never Knows / Within You Without You" mashup), and he's talked about it for a decade as if it were basically his project. In the original post I responded to you said that you weren't "sure he had a substantial role in creating" the LOVE remixes -- I guess I'm just trying to say that I think his role was substantial, to say the least.
     
  13. Darrin L.

    Darrin L. Forum Resident

    Location:
    Golden, CO
    "Then why even believe that the writer interviewed Giles?" Dewey02 stated, in a condescending manner, "perhaps he made up the entire interview?"
     
    dewey02 likes this.
  14. Gems-A-Bems

    Gems-A-Bems Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Duke City
    But you no longer think he was “almost ENTIRELY responsible”?

     
  15. BeatleJWOL

    BeatleJWOL Senior Member

    Shocking concept here: Giles Martin has a professional life outside of tinkering with manna from heaven, aka the Beatles catalog. Forgetting one instrument in one remix isn't outside the realm of possibility.
     
    soundQman likes this.
  16. Sean Murdock

    Sean Murdock Forum Intruder

    Location:
    Bergenfield, NJ
    Aside from the original 1960s credits that you needlessly included to make your impressive list even longer, yeah. If all those people were working under Giles' direction, and if all the mashups and mixes were done to his specifications, then yes I'd say he was "almost entirely responsible" for what we hear at the LOVE show and on the CD. I never said he personally, physically did every scrap of work by himself, did I? But he was the "Producer" and the producer directs those under him to get the end product he wants.
     
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  17. Gems-A-Bems

    Gems-A-Bems Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Duke City
    You don’t think what’s most impressive about the list is that it shows that Giles Martin was actually not “almost ENTIRELY responsible” for the album?
     
  18. Gems-A-Bems

    Gems-A-Bems Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Duke City
    What’s also not outside the realm of possibility: that he wasn’t familiar with the intricacies of the mixes because he didn’t personally mix them in the first place.
     
  19. dewey02

    dewey02 Forum Resident

    Location:
    The mid-South.
    That's what I wrote and that's what I meant. If you choose to not believe some of what the author said and wrote, why believe him for any of it?
     
  20. Sean Murdock

    Sean Murdock Forum Intruder

    Location:
    Bergenfield, NJ
    Gems, I'm not interested in fighting with you about this, but let's go back to the beginning. You said you weren't sure that Giles played a "substantial role" in the LOVE project. I assumed you were talking about the division of labor between Giles and Sir George, and I replied with that in mind -- that it had long been assumed that between the two of them, Giles had been "almost entirely responsible" for the final product of the LOVE audio. I still stand by that, and I still question your doubt that he played a "substantial" role in the project. He's a co-producer, for crying out loud! Yes, he used a team -- as any producer of these large projects would -- but they worked FOR him, not the other way around. So I'm sorry to disagree again, but I do believe that Giles was "almost entirely responsible" for the vision and the final product of the LOVE audio. If you have evidence to back up your doubt -- besides a list of Giles' subordinates on the job -- I'd love to hear it.
     
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  21. Darrin L.

    Darrin L. Forum Resident

    Location:
    Golden, CO
    I never said I chose not to believe anything, which is why I prefaced my statement by saying I was playing "devil's advocate".
     
    dewey02 likes this.
  22. dewey02

    dewey02 Forum Resident

    Location:
    The mid-South.
    Sorry. I didn't mean it to be directed specifically to you (even though I responded to you).
    It was more a discussion of logic. If "one" chooses not to believe a writer on one item, why believe him on anything he said. I just used "you" as more of a common term. And yes, I do see that you were playing the devil's advocate on this.

    Maybe that was what happened with Giles too..."the devil made him do it?" t (leave out the piano) :D
     
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  23. dewey02

    dewey02 Forum Resident

    Location:
    The mid-South.
    I can see both sides of this Giles spat.
    Personally, I think he did a great job on LOVE.
    Unfortunately, he hasn't done so well on subsequent projects.
    And (my opinion here), he has made several mistakes (yes mistakes) that should have been caught before things became final. And contrary to some folks interpretation, I believe he has pretty much admitted to a couple of them.
     
  24. thrivingonariff

    thrivingonariff Forum Resident

    Location:
    US
    A reader can certainly question a part of piece of writing without questioning all of it.
     
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  25. crossroads69

    crossroads69 Senior Member

    Location:
    London Town
    One theory could be that when remixing tracks for Love, Giles hadn’t bound himself to any specific approach and did what he thought sounded best. For subsequent remix projects (1+ & Pepper), he decided to market the “mono but in stereo” approach and hence had to do things differently than Love. Personally, I much prefer his Love work and hope he remixes with an open mind when it comes to the White Album.
     
    dewey02 likes this.
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