The imperfections of vinyl playback, and isn't it wonderful!

To me, highly resolving is simply that it allows more of the music - macro and micro details - to emerge. That both voices and instruments sound more like what I hear when I can listen live. Vinyl allows me to close my eyes and suspend disbelief better more often than digital does - good as high-rez digital has become. (And I've been an SACD supporter since I first heard it.)

 

I recently purchased and listened to several RSD Mono Miles Davis vinyl LP's and "noise" and/or "distortion" wasn't an issue at all. At least on my listening system anyway.

 

Yes, "n" instead of "r", my bad. Though I have seen the terms used interchangeably, but probably incorrectly.

So, is Mr. Winky in your post sarcasm? Do you have any opinion on the concept of euphonic distortion?

 

No sarcasm at all. I´m never sarcastic. Maybe I should start to be.
Yes I think some people like higher amount of distortion, at least second harmonics. And that for different reasons, but just mostly because they prefer it that way, it´s just a preference. I am not one of them, I like very low distortion.

So when people say they sound wise prefer Lps I think this is the case, they just prefer a higher amount of distortion, not more complicated than that. And there is nothing wrong with it.

 

"the differences between CD and SACD are minimal", this reminds me of the days when the general public 1st started buying HDTVs and they would say "I can't tell any difference". They would inevitably either not be receiving HD program or not have it hooked up properly, and the ones that would tell you how great it was, would be watching SD programming in "stretch" mode.

Seriously, if you can't hear any difference between SACD and CD something's wrong and if all you hear when listening to vinyl is pops, clicks, buzzes and surface noise and IGD you're also doing something wrong.

 

Try using poly lined inner sleeves or MoFi's for your most prized vinyl. A lot less wear and tear on the vinyl's surface when removing and replacing the record. IME....clicks and pops aren't really an issue with vinyl that's properly cleaned and in excellent or new condition. That said...vinyl that shows obvious signs of wear will always exhibit some audible flaws and is par for the course, as I'm sure your aware.

 

First, I'm not "quoting" you, because it's not all about you although seemingly every thread comes down to you making your same points over and over until everyone gives up or it gets shut down. You've made a career out telling people that "FACTS" say CD is better than vinyl and "FACTS" say we can't possibly hear the benefits of SACD because it's beyond the range of human hearing. Yet somehow each is gaining traction in the market place and many satisfied customers/listeners come on here to share their enjoyment and each time we're lectured on how it's only or perception that makes it so and the "FACTS" say CD is the only perfect medium.

 

OK, so I don't know about most of you cats, but almost all of my records are at least 25 years old. In fact, lets be honest, most records in the UNIVERSE are at least that old or older. Records are not manufactured with the number of titles or in numbers that in any way approach what was once available. I have a FEW new records, but at $25 a pop it doesn't happen often and I am sometimes underwhelmed by the pressing quality. The fact is that I can come home with 2 or more CD's for that amount, and I'm a MUSIC LOVER. I buy primarily new titles, except for some favorites where I will buy reissues.

So, all of that said, most records that are going to be played in the universe, aside from in an "audiophile" house where they have 5 copies of Famous Blue Raincoat and 15 titles in total to listen to, are going to be used and are going to have typical pops and ticks. This is just part of the sound. As I said earlier, it's a physical medium. You are dragging a needle through a vinyl valley of ridges. It's not going to sound silent, or pop/tick free or have the dynamic range of digital. It is what it is. The medium has other strengths that are worth concentrating on, like it's unlimited bandwidth in it's frequency range.

 

Again, the argument that if you like vinyl you're not a music lover. And any body that tries to optimize their sound sits around listening to Famous Blue Raincoat all day. Personally I've never heard it. I do have an original copy of Spirit: The Family That Plays Together that I bought for $12 at a used record store that plays perfectly quiet. Do I get to be a music lover now?

It will if you're doing it right.

 

I wonder how that can be?

 

Look at it this way though......does the original recording have surface noise like pops, clicks and groove distortion? No it doesn't. And it never will no matter how many times you play it....on CD.
I would rather listen to a medium that might have an an almost imperceptible loss of information than a medium that creates noise that was never on the recording. Makes sense doesn't it?
PS- The way that some of the audiophile CDs are being mastered rival the smoothness and warmth of any LP at least on my system. My recent purchase of Steve's Billion Dollar Babies and AP's Skynyrd Second Coming are prime examples.

PS- I tried to convince my ears that vinyl overall was better than CD in most cases. Over the two years I tried, I failed and sold everything vinyl related.

 

Hey... don't throw me in with those types, mate. You are putting words in my mouth. I LIKE vinyl, but I don't necessarily prefer it. I just bought two LP's and a 7" from Trouble in Mind, for example. I'd say any psych head would love the Doug Tuttle or Morgan Delt LP's. I'm just saying I can get more CD's for less money. I AM saying that there are plenty of people that have 4 copies of about 10 titles and just are into audio kit... but not saying it equates to being a vinyl lover.

BTW, I have a that album too, filed along side Dr. Sardonicus, but I bought it so long ago I couldn't tell you what I paid.

 

I own 15 copies of the White Album, among multiple copies of several other Beatles LP's. I also own a decent higher end audio system. I guess that makes me an "audiophile" Beatles fanatic! That could be a separate thread on it's own! Oh......I don't own "Famous Blue Raincoat". Was that some Yoko Ono album that escaped me?

 

I have a similar problem, only I have fewer copies, and my illness extends to Early Who records, Kinks records and The Jam.

 

no worries, Gingerly!

 

I get more band names from this board...

 

I love the sound of music on vinyl. I've only heard digital approach the same level of realism on systems with absurdly expensive DACs and related digital gear.

On the other hand, vinyl can be a PITA. To truly enjoy it, you need to have a good rig, you need to have the patience and resources to locate and obtain well-mastered LPs in excellent condition and, MOST IMPORTANTLY, you have to be able to listen to the music and not listen for the clicks and pops.

 

All this complaining about ticks and pops...you guys must have some dirty and damaged records. I know this is a hazard if you buy mostly used, but there's a lot of talk as though this is an inherent part of the medium of vinyl. Not really.

 

Remember digital doesn't 'have' dynamic range. Thats the properties of the recording itself. There are very few recordings that have near the full dynamic range capabilities of vinyl (75 db) let alone that of CD (90 db).

 

To better enjoy your CDs I highly recommend picking up a vintage 1989 Belgian made Philips CD-50. The on board TDA 1541 DAC is excellent, and has me re-listening to my CD collection in a very fresh way. I have recently seen two of them sell in the $170 range, just about what I spent on mine. I also suggest you pick up a Herbie's Super Black Hole damper ring, an amazing sound tweak for only $34.95!

 

I just finished the Steven Wilson 40th 2disc set, stunned how good it is, now I have to unwrap benefit by him also.

 

True, but the damn skips and pops are hard to get rid of in many cases. I've had pops on brand new records. It's very annoying.

 

G'day all, I've just been listening to John Williams 'Rhapsody' album with lots of scratches (bought second hand), and yes I wish the scratches weren't there, but honestly when the music is playing I don't really 'hear' them. Regards, Felix.

 

Some people are wired differently. Some can not stand tape hiss. Some zoom in on any type of surface noise or sounds on vinyl

It is not an equipment or record condition issue. Some people are simply "more bothered" by noise and distortions than others.

You may be particularly immune to noticing it. Another may be really put off by any noise.

Its a personal thing, not equipment.

Some, just realizing that there "Can be" these sounds, by their nature, actively "Listen closer in" for the sounds.

 

VINYL:
If you're having a problem with ticks and pops, I suggest upgrading to a table with a heavy platter and a cartridge with a fine-tipped diamond. Even some beat-to-crap LPs sound surprisingly quiet and focused on my TD-124/SME combo with a Grado 8MR w/ upgrade MCZ stylus. Record noise is absolutely not an issue, except on the most severely abused discs. (Groove-worn discs are still unlistenable however.) All of the above assumes that the records are deep-cleaned prior to use.

DIGITAL:
CDs often sound as good and in some ways better than vinyl when played on a better-than-average CD player. I'm using a well-regarded Rotel RCD-1072, and find that well-mastered, well-recorded CDs are just as engrossing as vinyl. Last night I was playing Disc Three from "Ray Charles - The Birth of Soul," and Ray and his band were right there in the room with me, and in my mind's eye, I could see him swaying and reacting to the music.

There is room for both analog and digital music in my world.