The new Sony UHP-H1 plays everything - Blu-ray, SACD, CD, even DVD-Audio

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by back2vinyl, May 20, 2016.

  1. High Fidelity

    High Fidelity Active Member

    Location:
    London
    I would not touch Oppo with a barge pole same goes for Cambridge Audio
     
  2. John1026

    John1026 Member

    Location:
    Valencia
    Has anyone tested the analog outputs of this unit to hear how good the D/A converter is?
     
    vconsumer likes this.
  3. BIGGER Dave

    BIGGER Dave Forum Resident

  4. Olias of Sunhill

    Olias of Sunhill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Jim Creek, CO, USA
    I grabbed one from Crutchfield as well. This lets me move my BDP-95 to the office, where I'll actually take advantage of its analog outs (it's HDMI only in the living room, which is a waste).
     
  5. sparkydog

    sparkydog Forum Resident

    Location:
    Kentucky
    I missed the model you referenced. I humbly apologize. Let me ask a Gort to wipe that comment.
     
  6. RocketUSA

    RocketUSA Active Member

    So, quick edit. If you're not using this with any video out, is there any way to tell which layer of an SACD you're playing? Does it default to the SACD layer on playback? I'm thinking of primarily using it in an audio only set-up. In that situation, does Sony's DSEE HX automatically upscale CD audio? Should I really care?
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2017
  7. formu_la

    formu_la Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    I would buy one gladly , but information from forum members that it doesn't deal well with multichannel files from external hard drives stopped me.
     
  8. dbsea

    dbsea Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    My cheap Sony bdp bx58 from 2011 has a setting to determine which layer to play by default. I'd be shocked if this model doesn't have the same. I'll find out tomorrow and update this thread (I couldn't pass up the $199 price).
     
    RocketUSA likes this.
  9. Tartifless

    Tartifless Forum Resident

    Location:
    France
    It definitely has the option in the settings to define the default sacd version to read: stereo or multichannel (at least it's in the user manual).
    Before i purchase this i still have a question i really need to be sure, so i will ask someone who actually owns this player to answer if possible.

    1) Can the UHP H1 output sound from the stereo sacd layer through the spdif output in PCM or not ? (i have read that the spdif outputs are disabled when reading sacd).
    2) What is the highest bit depth / frequency that i can get through a spdif connection (if answer to question 1 is yes) ?

    Thanks in advance for your feedback.
    Benoit
     
  10. wwaldmanfan

    wwaldmanfan Forum Resident

    In the audio setttings, you choose the default layer of a dual-layer SACD to automatically play: DSD or redbook. You preselect the output format: DSD or PCM. You preselect the maximum resolution of the internal DAC. Obviously, you would set it for 24/196.
    I don't have a DSD DAC, but I can tell you this much: when you play a SACD, it outputs 24/176.4 through the HDMI output. It does play simultaneously through the S/PDIF outputs (coax & optical), but it plays the REDBOOK layer. The bit depth/sample rate maxes out at 24/48 through the S/PDIF outputs, regardless of the source disk. Sony tech support confirmed this when I called them. However, you get the higher resolution through the analog outputs.
    I don't have any single-layer SACD's, so I don't know if or how it would play them through the S/PDIF outputs.
    I hope this explaination is clear.
     
    Galley, dbsea and randy9700 like this.
  11. randy9700

    randy9700 Well-Known Member

    Thanks!
     
  12. Kyhl

    Kyhl formerly known as Strabo

    Location:
    Savage
    I think the 24/176.4 has become the standard for DSD to PCM. From the JRiver Wiki, they translate DSD to 64/352.8. Eventually it will need to be converted to 24 bit and cut down to a sample rate that most DACs can use, 192k or less. 176.4 is 352.8/2, a simpler conversion. Defaulting to 24/176.4 seems like the best options when converting.
     
  13. Tartifless

    Tartifless Forum Resident

    Location:
    France
    Ok so that confirms it: it's impossible to output the sacd layer through spdif output, only the redbook layer.

    I picked it up today and tried the following: hooked up the hdmi output to the TV and the optical out from the TV to my amp: No sound when playing a sacd, but got sound when playing a normal cd.
    Then i tried to use the RCA out from my tv to my amp: got sound both when reading sacd and normal CD.

    Conclusion: the sacd layer is quite locked and cannot be passed through spdif connection, only RCA.
    (for information i have setup the output to PCM)

    My next test will be to use a HDMI de-embedder and try to get the sound from sacd layer via HDMI to it and then through spdif to my amp, but i don't think that this will work... I guess the only way to get sacd playback is through the RCA connection.
     
  14. Kyhl

    Kyhl formerly known as Strabo

    Location:
    Savage
    Why do you want to convert the DSD to PCM just to get it to your preamp? Are you using room correction?
     
  15. Tartifless

    Tartifless Forum Resident

    Location:
    France
    My amp has only 2 RCA inputs already taken by the tuner and turntable, so the only remaining inputs i have are a coax and an optical...
     
  16. RocketUSA

    RocketUSA Active Member

    Thanks very much. I guess my major question is will it default to SACD when I'm playing a dual layer disc, without having to go through an on-screen setup menu? I wouldn't be connecting this to a TV via HDMI, so would be flying blind, so to speak.

    Does anyone know if Sony has a smartphone app that can control/perform setup on the UHP-H1?
     
  17. Tartifless

    Tartifless Forum Resident

    Location:
    France
    It will read by default the multichannel sacd layer.
    Don't know it Sony has an app.
     
  18. wwaldmanfan

    wwaldmanfan Forum Resident


    S/PDIF seems to be the bottleneck. I don't know how a HDMI de-embedder works.
    The SACD layer plays through HDMI as 2.6MHz DSD or 24/176.4 PCM, although there aren't many DAC's that support DSD-over-HDMI.
    My NAD M51 doesn't do DSD, but it has HDMI connectivity. It plays SACD's as 24/176.4 PCM.
     
  19. back2vinyl

    back2vinyl Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    London, UK

    That's a good idea for a test but it's not possible that the UHP-H1 is sending the redbook layer of the SACD to the S/PDIF output, for two reasons. The most obvious is that the S/PDIF output is 24/48 which is beyond redbook specification. The second reason is because I don't believe the UHP-H1 or any other player is capable of reading and streaming two different layers in different formats at the same time. Therefore, the 24/48 output that wwaldmanfan was getting through the S/PDIF output can only be a downsampled stream from the SACD layer.

    That leaves the mystery of why you hear no sound when you hook up a TV to the UHP-H1. My guess would be that it's an incorrect setting for SACD playback in the menu. The instructions are not very clear but I suggest you check the SACD settings in the audio menu against the instructions given in the manual. I will try it myself tomorrow and let you know what happens.
     
  20. wwaldmanfan

    wwaldmanfan Forum Resident

    I didn't say that the SACD was playing through the S/PDIF output at 24/48. What I said was the maximum you can get out of the S/PDIF from any source is 24/48.
    When I played my Alison Krauss "New Favorite" dual-layer SACD today, this is what happened. That particular SACD has two very different masterings. The DSD mastering has good SQ with an extended dynamic range. The redbook layer is compressed and brickwalled, with a lot of distorted sibilance on her vocals. I am very familiar with this recording, and I can tell the difference easily. When I played the SACD, the TV monitor said 2.6Mhz DSD (source), the display on my DAC on HDMI said 176.4 (PCM), and the SQ was good. When I switched the external DAC to coax on the fly, the DAC display read 44.1, and the sound quality took a nosedive. So, either the unit is processing both layers at once, or the SACD layer is being downsampled 4x all the way to 44.1, not 48kHz. You only get 24/48 through S/PDIF when you play a regular DVD (native audio), or DVD-A (24/96).
     
  21. BIGGER Dave

    BIGGER Dave Forum Resident

  22. PNeski@aol.com

    PNeski@aol.com Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York
    it makes sense to buy a region free BR player UK titles are often cheaper even with post ,it will pay for itself
     
  23. BMWCCA

    BMWCCA Active Member

    Location:
    Central Virginia
    Anyone tried an iPod through the USB port yet? :-popcorn:
     
  24. bluemooze

    bluemooze Forum Resident

    Location:
    Frenchtown NJ USA
    :edthumbs:
     
  25. back2vinyl

    back2vinyl Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    London, UK

    Sorry, I misinterpreted what you said. But it doesn't really change anything. As I said, I don't have technical knowledge but it's just common sense that a player can't process two different layers in different formats through the same processor at the same time. So the answer is simply that the UHP-H1 is downsampling the 176.4 kHz PCM stream from the SACD layer to 44.1 kHz for the S/PDIF output, rather than 48 kHz.

    I confirmed this using the following simple test. I inserted a single-layer SACD - that is, an SACD disc that does not have any CD layer. I played it through my NAD M32 direct digital amp, connected to the UHP-H1 by HDMI and also by optical S/PDIF. (The UHP-H1 was also hooked up to the TV display by HDMI.) The amp played the SACD without any problems using either input. When set to the HDMI input, the amp display showed that it was receiving an input of 176.4 kHz. When set to the Optical S/PDIF input, the amp display showed that it was receiving an input of 44.1 kHz.

    To sum up for Tartfless who raised this question in the first place - yes, the UHP-H1 DOES play the SACD layer of SACD discs through the S/PDIF outputs but it downsamples the 176.4 kHz stream to 44.1 kHz, for copy protection reasons. I don't know what bit depth it employs - if you really need to know, I'd have to think if there was a way to test for that.

    If you want higher resolution, you can use an HDMI de-embedder which will give you 176.4 kHz at 24 bits if the rest of your optical chain can take it. But some optical inputs will only take up to 96 kHz - coax S/PDIF inputs are more reliable in this respect.
     
    wwaldmanfan likes this.

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