The problem with rap or country music is:

I know a lot of you guys must get frustrated not being able to speak your piece on your dislike of certain genres without a debate or getting Gorted, so here is a place.

Why did I include country music? There are many people here who dislike country as much as rap. This topic need not be restricted to those two genres, though.

Do not bash. Please try to state your opinions as diplomaticaly as possible.

 

This just isn't meant for rap and country - today's rock/pop music is also included - but it all sounds alike.

Maybe I'm out of touch a bit, but where are the truly unique and distinctive performers in these genres that have their own "sound"? I know they are out there somewhere, but mainstream/commercial radio sure isn't playing them.

 

I don't have a *problem* with either. I acknowledge both as evolutionary branches in the musical tree. Take a step back and "see the forest from the tree". Behold the beauty!

OK, I'm done sermonizing.

Jim W.

 

For every time I think a musical genre is something I don't like as much, there's something I bump into that totally changes my mind. If you told me last year that I would like bluegrass, I would have thought you were full of it.

James is correct, and deeper, we cannot evolve as music listeners, appreciating different kinds of music, if we don't TRY.

There was a time when all I listened to was Zeppelin, Beatles and Hendrix, classic rock. I think it's fine if you dislike a form of music, but I know what I like best.

Once I say, I hate something about music, I'm not listening. That I have learned.

 

The artist has to be saying something you can identify with, something that strikes a chord in you, that resonates with you. If this is not happening, it seems foreign, awkward, meant for someone else.

The hard-core country and the hard-core rap don't appeal to me - they don't speak to me. But when the edges blur and artists from the fringes use those musical forms to get on my wavelength, I find them interesting.

Regards,
Geoff

 

The problem with rap music is that I don't consider it to be music. In the Fifties there was "Beat poetry" and nobody called it music.

I feel that people may listen to whatever they want; but to call rap "music" is an injustice to anyone who ever played a musical instrument, IMHO.

 

The rappers themselves might not be musicians, but what about the musicians who are playing the music? Most rap music today uses original music in order to avoid paying license fees for samples. You might think it is bad music, but it is music, right?

 

I guess I haven't listened to any "new" rap that actually has music in it. I was thinking about rap that was just lyrics and "scratching" from the "old" days.

I apologize if I've slighted the current rap genre or upset any forum members.

 

Still a problem

Yeah, it's me again and I still have a problem with this.
I will use country as an example so as to make sure I cast no racial aspersions.
I love alt.country. My collection is full of stuff by Wilco, Son Volt, Buddy Miller, Whiskeytown, Old 97's...you get the picture. I also dig the old fashioned country guys like Johnny Cash, Merle Haggard, Mickey Newbury.
I tend to not like mainstream, cowboy hat country acts that get a lot of airplay on mainstream country stations. For example: I have heard a couple of songs by Tim McGraw who is a popular and successful artist and I don't care for them. I find them predictable and jingoistic, overly patriotic and just plain boring.
Consequently, I don't listen. That's my right and I'm thankful for it. But that's just the problem ! If I don't listen how can I make an educated judgement? Simply put: I can't.
I used to love The Steve Miller Band. Around when "The Joker" came out I stopped listening. If someone who heard that song on the radio and disliked it as much as I did they could say "Steve Miller sucks!" but they never heard tracks like "Baby's House", "Kow Kow", "My Dark Hour". etc.
Have any of us who slammed rap or country of boy bands in the other thread ever actually listened to an entire album by these artists?
Look: I don't have enough time to listen to the stuff I know I do like to try all the stuff that I might but that doesn't mean it all sucks. Sorry but when I see the word "all" I automatically get turned off.
Peace
Norm

 

My problem is I cannot relate to either genre.

 

I can't either. But I do appreciate what the music has to offer. I also like the old style country like Roy Clark, Johnny Cash, ect... I have found the time to listen to these artists, though.

So, perhaps it is a good idea for me, or anybody, to not comment on what they have never listened to.

Like you Norm, I get angry when I see someone dismissing a whole genre, especially if I suspect they may not have heard much of it.

 

Re: Still a problem

Today's "country" music (ie, the stuff that gets played on "country" radio stations) isn't really country music in my opinion. It's pop rock. Stylistically, modern country owes a lot more to REO Speedwagon than to George Jones. Seriously, if the REO guys all bought cowboy hats and added a fiddle player, they could probably get modern country airplay without altering their sound one iota. I HATE modern "country". Conversely, I love the old stuff, as well as new artists like Neko Case who produce genuine country.

I have a lot of friends who dismiss all country out of hand. From talking to them, the primary thing that turns them off is the lyrics, which they see as all fitting one of four themes:
1. "I'm simple/low class and proud of it" (eg "Friends in Low Places, All My Rowdy Friends, Okie from Muscogee)
2. Drinking/partying/alcoholism
3. Reactionary jingoism/ultra conservativism
4. Marital infidelity

And since none of those themes speak to them, they dismiss the genre. I think the general thrust is that they believe intellectually country is lower-brow as a whole than other pop music styles. I've tried to point out to them there is a lot of country which addresses other themes, but I think they are also turned off by some of the stylistic conventions of country (the southern accent most people sing with, the shuffle beat, pedal steel guitars).

 

I find modern country to be cliche city
I worked as a DJ for many years and was in a record pool where I received just about -every rap record released-. I hated it then and still do. I came home with a huge stack every week from the majors to the little labels and never found -one- that I thought was truly enduring, creative artistic or important. If it is, where are the 24 K gold cds of it?
There's the occasional 'hybrid' that I would almost consider music however I don't find much of that particularly enduring either.
As far as country, I like Johnny Cash, Gram Parsons, The Byrds country era, Eagles (crossover), Hank sr., Mary Chapin Carpenter, kd lang and maybe one or 2 more and that's it.
The rest seem to be 'how many cliches can you string together and make it rhyme?'. I don't care for alt country but at least it sorta rocks...but wait! there's more! I don't really care for avant garde either! lol

 

I'm not a big fan of either, myself, but if all I had to choose was between those two, then I would go with country.

While not a country fan, I think Johnny Cash is pretty cool and I've always loved "The Devil Went Down To Georgia" (reminds me of when I used to listen to Top 40 on AM radio - yes AM radio played music at one time before it became a chat-fest).

As for rap, the only rap I've liked were things by Tone Loc or the Fresh Prince, which is pretty much novelty music and not hardcore street rap.

I agree with whoever said that today's country is pop-rock - they're absolutely right. I'm no expert on country, but even I know that Shania Twain and Faith Hill are not country - they're Revlon models who happen to look good in a music video. Not that that's a bad thing, but...

I don't respect rap because they are trying to pass off someone else's music as their own to an audience of kids who don't know any better. When I recognize a riff or melody from one of my favorite songs in a hip-hop or rap tune, it only reminds me of how great the original artist was and gives me no sense of the rapper having his own groove at all.

 

Re: Re: Still a problem

I have to admit that these themes are the exact same thing that tends to turn me off to a lot of country. It seems that most of the country songs that have these subjects are the ones I don't like.

To this list you can add:
5. whining, unending love for wife, kids, pickett fence, ect...
6. traditional (mysigynistic) roles of man and woman

Now, rock and R&B have all of these same traits except maybe the patriotism one. There is nothing worng with patriotism, but it sounds like i'm being blugeoned with it with some of the songs. Or, more to the point, it conjures up images of some jerk riding around with a confederate flag on his old Ford truck with a rifle rack on the back window.

 

Re: Re: Re: Still a problem

Grant...you stated that you can't relate to rap. Can you list the things you don't like about rap similar to the country list above? I'm curious.

Although I understand fully what you are saying here:

Do you think that this may be a "country music myth" comparable to the "rap myths" you debunked in another thread?

Just wondering....

 

Well, I know better that not all country is like what is described above. I made that point clear. But, yes, for a long time I disliked country because of the image in my mind. But, it was based in some reality because I knew people like that who were hardcore country fans. This is how prejudice manifests itself. There is a kernel of truth to something that conjures up a belief or negative feeling towards something. But, we know, or should know that you can't apply an isolated truth to a whole. Hell, if I like some country, I *know* the stereotype cannot be true.

Same thing with rap. When rap is mentioned, it stirrs up very negtive inages and feelings in some people, based on some small experience.

I do understand why many people have a negative opinion of rap because it works the same way with any musical gere.

I would love for all the stereotypes and myths about all music exposed. But, you can't change people. All we can do is change ourselves, hopefully for the better of all.

 

I went over to my niece's place this afternoon and she had BET on. They were showing music videos of the top hits. On the tube was a Snoop Dog video and there were no images of violence, no sexual themes, no cursing, no alcohol or drugs, no partying. Everyone was dressed conservatively, but the music was boring and unimaginative. The song was about infidelity, just like some country.

So, I don't have this love for contemporary R & B, either.

 

Metralla said:

I'll second this

I have a dopey sense of humor and the Beastie Boys' stuff appeals to me for that reason. And I think the music is well done too (if you want to hear what they can do musically, take a listen to their instumental compilation album In Sound From Way Out! Great funky jazz/rock (no rap); you would never guess these were the Beasties playing.

Speaking of blurring edges, I own four albums from 311. This group combines rap, metal, reggae, punk and some mystical grooves/lyrics to good effect IMO. My favorite is still their 1997 release, Transistor. I've played it so much I need a new copy becasue of all the scratches (from car and portable player use). And their messages are mostly positive and life-affirming--maybe that's corny these days but I like it.

I'll listen to REAL country; the fake crap on the radio nowadays I tune right past.

[T]

 

I like country music, I just don't like what the current music industry promotes as country. Toby Keith

 

I don't write off any musical form entirely, since I have interests in just about all styles...and I've learned what I like, and what I don't like.

One overriding dislike is anything that is too popularized....today's "young" country is all the same to me, for instance. I bought quite a few of these CDs back in the early 90's just as the current wave was starting. But then I noticed a trend: a second CD by someone like Brooks & Dunn was the same damned thing they just released the previous year! Ditto for everyone else...except for someone like Garth Brooks, whose 10-gallon hat got bigger every year, along with his head. I'm happy with what I own, but would never buy more. And yes, put any artist in a cowboy hat and boots, throw in the pedal steel guitar and fiddle, swing the beat a little, and it's a "country hit" these days.

I even have maybe two or three things in rap, but nothing at all recent. (The first Grandmaster Flash album being one of them, and that sucka is OLD now!) I think I dislike the recent rap attitude and lifestyle even more than the music...no need to be putting these ideas in young kids' heads, and I certainly don't need any kids acting like this! (Look at any of those pathetic "boy bands" and you can see how much it has rubbed off...their embarassing mannerisms, the pathetic "our diapers are full" baggy clothing...it just looks stupid.)

$mooooooth Jazz is another pet peeve of mine. SAME THING! The formula is tired and overused...and I refuse to call it jazz OR to dislike ALL of jazz because of it. The problem there is that I like contemporary jazz that is often easygoing and sounds a lot like the $moothies, but it's not. But, I also dislike the stuffy attitudes of some hardcore jazzers who are stuck in that 50's/60's/Wynton time warp, who stick their nose up at ANY jazz style that is not their precious own, and basically lump anything contemporary into the $moothy category. (I also think this snobism is why their type of jazz is disappearing.)

I could go on (modern R&B, modern alternative rock, etc.), but the point is more that the overpopularized styles are what I don't like, the ones that are commercialized and served up at your local Targets and Walmarts by the thousands. So it's not specifically one specific genre of music, but its overuse and overexposure, which pretty much strips away any individuality the genre ever had and waters it down for mass consumption.

 

I hate smooth jazz as well. It's so bland. It's supermarket music.

I'm a fan of jazz, some rap(2pac, Dr. Dre, and a few others), and other music. I basically can't put labels on people because I don't know them, so I just like them for their music.

 

I look at Toby Keith as sort of a modern Ray Stevens because of the humor in his music. I actually like some of his stuff.

But, have you ever turned on CMT and heard country/rap??? I don't care for it.