The sound of Nat King Cole's The Magic of Christmas & The Christmas Song ALBUMS

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by dale 88, Dec 14, 2012.

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  1. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    From the Magic of Christmas in 1960 to the Definitive Christmas Collection in 2007, there have been uncounted reissues, and some re-masterings for this Christmas album.

    Let's listen to many of these for their sound. I hope you can post your experiences with this album.

    Also, do you have a sentimental favorite issue that you like to play?
     
    dale 88, Dec 14, 2012
    #1
  2. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    Twist my arm, I'll play along. I've posted 45 second clips from a late-80s pressing and a 1960s reel to reel tape, here: http://www.11fifty.com/Site_108/NatColeAdesteFideles.html (The LP is mine; the reel transfer is not.)

    Somewhere, I have the original 1986 Capitol CD, but I think it must be in my wife's car right now. I'll try to dig it up.

    If anybody would like to share similar clips, contact me, and I'll be happy to post them on the same page.

    FWIW, I've owned 4 copies of this over the years, and my impression (based only on the editions I've heard) is that the original stereo mix is pretty poor. I'm guessing a re-mix could do wonders for this title (in the right hands, of course), and there was even evidence of this from none other than ......wait for it.....BOB NORBERG on COLE, CHRISTMAS AND KIDS.
     
    MLutthans, Dec 14, 2012
    #2
  3. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    Here are issues I have heard on LP and CD. Let know if there are others that should be considered -- I am sure there are:) .

    The LPs:

    The Magic of Christmas. Stereo. SW 1444

    Side 1 - N1" #3​

    Side 2 - N1 0​

    The Magic of Christmas. Mono. W 1444. 2 copies

    #1 Side 1 - D3​

    Side 2 - D3​

    #2 Side 1 - N1" #4​

    Side 2 - N2​

    The Christmas Song. Stereo. SW 1967

    Side 1 - x1 2​

    Side 2 - x2 0 #2​

    The Christmas Song. Mono. W1967

    Side 1 - G4​

    Side 2 - F3​

    The Christmas Song. Stereo. SW 1967 (SW2-1967) Gold Record Award logo. Bright Orange label

    Side 1 - A8 #2​

    Side 2 - A7​

    The Christmas Song. Stereo. SM-1967. Medium Blue label

    Side 1 - Jay - J 27 #2​

    Side 2 - JH [or] JHM - H 25 #1​

    Nat King Cole's Christmas. Stereo. Music For Pleasure. MFP 50313 Great Britain

    Nat King Cole Chante Noel. Stereo. Music For Pleasure. 2M 048-52030 France

    Christmas with Nat King Cole. Stereo. Stylus SMR 868. 1988 Great Britain
     
    dale 88, Dec 14, 2012
    #3
  4. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    Thanks. I don't have any way to provide clips from my LPs but perhaps others do. I will try to report any differences I hear on my LPs.
     
    dale 88, Dec 14, 2012
    #4
  5. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    The CDs that I have on hand:

    1986. The Christmas Song. CDP 7 46318 2

    p)1992 c)1996. Christmas Favorites. 10 tracks. 07777-57729-2-0

    1999. The Christmas Song. 72435-21251-2-8. 24 bit remastered

    2005. The Christmas Song. 09463-31227-2-7. 24 bit remastered

    2007. The Definitive Christmas Collection. 50995-11414-2-4

    2009. The Christmas Song. 50996-85260-23
     
    dale 88, Dec 14, 2012
    #5
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  6. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    Billboard's original review in 1960.
    BillboardReviewMagicChristmas (3).png
     
    dale 88, Dec 14, 2012
    #6
    Stone Turntable and kennyluc1 like this.
  7. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    I am going to re-clean the LPs and listen again.

    My internet provider has been going down last night and this morning, so we will see how soon I can post.
     
    dale 88, Dec 14, 2012
    #7
  8. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    Actually, since this disc (COLE, CHRISTMAS, AND KIDS) was produced by Ron Furmanek, who is usually very hands-on in the mixing process (even when he is listed as "producer" and not "engineer"), this is pretty certainly a Ron Furmanek mix with Bob Norberg twiddling the knobs largely/entirely at Ron's direction. Seriously, if you haven't heard the quality on that mix -- an outtake from the THE MAGIC OF CHRISTMAS sessions -- prepare to be stunned. It truly illustrates that there is much, much more potential on those 3-track tapes than has ever surfaced.

    Matt
     
    MLutthans, Dec 14, 2012
    #8
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  9. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    Listening to these again, it's amazing how similar they sound. One's an LP; one's a reel-to-reel; and they were manufactured over 20 years apart.
     
    MLutthans, Dec 14, 2012
    #9
  10. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    I am going to pull my copy of Cole Christmas, and Kids and re-listen. Thanks.
     
    dale 88, Dec 14, 2012
    #10
  11. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    The first comparison of the LPs of The Magic of Christmas:

    The Mono - D3

    Clear sounding, Nat's vocals are solid. You can hear the chorus and orchestra elements distinctly.​

    The Mono - Side 1 - N1" #4 ;Side 2 - N2

    Not as clear as the D3 mono, a bit duller and murkier.​

    ​
    The Stereo Magic of Christmas

    One can hear more things clearly in the stereo, but the voice doesn't have the solidity of the Mono D3. Also the voice sometimes seems phasey and light compared to the chorus and orchestra.​
     
    dale 88, Dec 14, 2012
    #11
  12. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    Yes they are very similar, but the reel-to-reel has a more inviting sound in my opinion. There is more detail and more depth on the tape IMO.
     
    dale 88, Dec 14, 2012
    #12
  13. Perisphere

    Perisphere Forum Resident

    Location:
    Mountain Home, Arkansas USA
    My SW 1444:

    Side 1--SW1-1444-N1
    Side 2--SW2-1444-N2

    New York mastering; Scranton pressing. Out of phase on both sides.
     
    Perisphere, Dec 14, 2012
    #13
  14. Kkfan

    Kkfan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Music City, USA
    Kkfan, Dec 14, 2012
    #14
  15. Clark V Kauffman

    Clark V Kauffman Forum Resident

    Location:
    Des Moines, Iowa
    The best vinyl pressing I have of "The Magic Of Christmas" / "The Christmas Song" album is still the set of stereo 7-inch discs that were issued for jukebox play. (There are two different pressings of this set, made a year apart, and they have different song combinations. A few of the discs in the second set have three songs per disc, rather than two...)
    But my rating of the jukebox set probably doesn't mean much because the only other vinyl version I have is a previously sealed 1970s reissue of "The Christmas Song" LP, and that disc doesn't sound very good.
    I hanker for a nice clean copy of "The Magic Of Christmas," but haven't found one as that album wasn't in print for very long.
    label2.jpg strips.jpg
     
    Clark V Kauffman, Dec 14, 2012
    #15
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  16. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    I can't say I'm recommending it, but I've posted a clip from the 1986 Capitol CD, #CDP 7 46318 2, here:

    http://www.11fifty.com/Site_108/NatColeAdesteFideles.html

    Matt
     
    MLutthans, Dec 14, 2012
    #16
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  17. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    I had posted about GOD REST YE MERRY, GENTLEMEN being an alternate take on the COLE, CHRISTMAS AND KIDS compact disc. I was apparently reacting to smoking some bad Seattle hookah, as it's NOT an alternate. Just wanted to clarify and apologize for the goof.

    Matt
     
    MLutthans, Dec 14, 2012
    #17
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  18. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    Matt,

    The notes inside COLE, CHRISTMAS & KIDS for "God Rest Ye Merry Gentlemen" show
     
    MMM, Dec 15, 2012
    #18
  19. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    ^^^^^^Thanks, Martin!
     
    MLutthans, Dec 15, 2012
    #19
  20. Kkfan

    Kkfan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Music City, USA

    Thanks, Matt.

    When you say you can't say you're recommending it, do you mean you can't recommend it?

    The clip doesn't sound bad, but then again one can't judge much through computer speakers. :)
     
    Kkfan, Dec 15, 2012
    #20
  21. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    Perisphere, I am glad you confirmed what I was hearing on my stereo copy of The Magic Of Christmas. Do you happen to know if the West Coast stereo pressing was in phase? Is it worth searching out?
     
    dale 88, Dec 15, 2012
    #21
  22. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    I've never heard any other CD versions, so I can't say this one's superior. Having said that, I'm not impressed with the disc as a whole, but others who have other versions should chime in.
     
    MLutthans, Dec 15, 2012
    #22
  23. dale 88

    dale 88 Errand Boy for Rhythm Thread Starter

    Location:
    west of sun valley
    Kkfan, it is hard to recommend a CD version of this album, since those I know have a drawback somewhere. I don't have the two issues you mention so I can't recommend one over the other. However, the 1990 one seems to be a reissue of the 1986 CD. The EMI 2002 disc seems to have copyright dates of 1992, 1993 on the back cover shown online, so I am wondering if EMI did their own issue or not? I think I will take a chance on the EMI disc and order it for myself, hoping that EMI did their own mastering. Of the commercially available CD versions, I would have recommended the 2009 disc mastered by Brad McEowen except it has (I would swear) some added treble energy that just irritates me.
    http://www.amazon.com/Christmas-Song-Nat-King-Cole/dp/B002HMHXN6/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1355555170&sr=1-1&keywords=nat king cole christmas song 2009

    I haven't ranked the commerical CD issues yet in descending order (maybe in a few days), but I already know that the only CD I will be recommending was not available in record stores and is now out of print.
     
    dale 88, Dec 15, 2012
    #23
  24. Kkfan

    Kkfan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Music City, USA
    Nathan,
    Thanks for that info.

    So, which is this out-of-print CD that you can recommend?
     
    Kkfan, Dec 15, 2012
    #24
  25. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    I've never heard this CD, but I did listen to the free iTunes clips, and at first blush, it sounds like a remix rather than a remaster. Is that correct?
     
    MLutthans, Dec 15, 2012
    #25
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