there's no such thing as 78 RPM stereo, right? (Modern 78 releases)*

right?

 

Stereo was introduced in 1957, if I recall correctly; and there were a few 78s produced in the US as late as 1959. So it's technically possible, but I sincerely doubt it.

 

There was the time that Duke Ellington was recorded by two broadcast teams
in 1936 and then in the digital age the two 78rpm mono (differently mic'ed)
recordings of the same performances were synced up producing a stereo image.
The cd, now rare as hen's teeth, was called "Stereo Reflections in Ellington".

To answer your query more straightforwardly, a 78prm stylus is essentially
an up-and-down mono stylus. No side to side information was recorded,
at least not on purpose. Stereo records have a 45/45 degree configured groove,
so stereo playback requires lateral, rather than vertical, movement.

 

I thought 78s were side to side only, no up and down information (excepting Diamond Discs)?

 

Right. Stereo was developed (after the fact, a remarkable technical achievement) for the microgrove formats (like the LP) but not for the old 78.

 

Not quite. A conventional "78 RPM" record is recorded laterally--i.e., the stylus swings from side to side in a groove wiggling parallel the record's surface. No *vertical* component is present. Most of the big labels--Victor, Columbia, Decca, Capitol, and on and on--that you will encounter at yard sales or thrift stores or what have you were recorded this way.

Some "78s" go the other way (i.e., vertical cut--groove wiggles into and out of the record surface, with no lateral component), but they are more "specialist" items. The big players in vertical cut recording were Edison and Pathe; a bunch of little labels (e.g., Lyric, OKeh, Vocalion, Gennett) also adopted the vertical system for a time but then either switched to lateral or else went belly up. Edison discs uniformly play at 80 RPM; Pathes can run anywhere from ca. 80 to ca. 90.

One label, Emerson, tried to be "universal" by cutting on a 45-degree angle, allowing for play on both Edison-style and Victor-style machines. The results were rather less than spectacular....

 

Oh, by the way, I think Nimbus issued a set to demonstrate digital recording that included a 78 RPM microgroove side featuring one mvt. from Beethoven's "Hammerklavier" sonata. I read of it at the time but have never seen a copy.

 

In terms of pop music 78s from the 50s/early 60s I've never seen one and have no reason to believe they exist bearing in mind 45s were mono at this stage. However, microgroove 78s have been cut (they were used for library music in the UK even into the 60s IIRC.) Dave Edmunds released King of Hearts on 10" in the UK one side was 45 the other 78. Both microgroove so it is possible to have a stereo cut.

FWIW Pye started cutting 78s on vinyl in the late 50s which can sound lovely.

 

Yes, the last Pye 78's were vinyl
'My old mans a dustman'
Lonnie Donegan

As for stereo, my hero, Alan Dower Blumlein, was cutting stereo 78's into acetate in 1934 for EMI at beautiful downtown Hayes, he invented 45/45 degree lateral stereo cutter heads and the elegant sum and difference recording technique.
Their intention was for cinema sound but EMI used this for stereo record production in the 50's
Allan also suggested cellulose acetate over wax masters and sapphire styli over steel and developed the best microphone of the time the HB1B which was better than the BBC type A ribbon and 4 times the price (£40)
Great bloke.
Then developed 405 line tele and H2S airborne radar which helped win the Battle of the Atlantic and the defeat of Nazi Germany.
Died in a radar trial flight in '43

Blumlein mic technique is still used today.

 

I have minty Lonnie Donegan vinyl 78 on Pye from 1957, and it does sound lovely.

 

Stereo real to real tapes came out before RCA invented stereo disc cutting.

 

The Pye vinyl 78s sounded fantastic. My late parents had a number of Pye recordings in that format and they were excellent, much quieter than shellac. In the late 50s Mercury recordings were marketed through Pye and, thus, Platters' hits on 78 in the UK were on high-quality vinyl.
To get back on topic, were there not a few 78 rpm issues as "novelty" or collectors items as recently as the 80s by some artists. They, presumably, were all vinyl, microgroove (so no 78 stylus required) and in stereo???? Dave Edmunds was mentioned, but I'm sure others did the same, maybe even on colured vinyl.

 

Perhaps Chewy means commercial releases of 78 RPM records in stereo during the heyday of the format, but I read the question as being rather absolute.

I remember reading decades ago about a 78 RPM issue of a Randy Newman single. Thanks to the magic of the internet, I have the details. The A-side is mono, but I thought it interesting that a 78 would be issued as late as 1969.

http://www.randynewman.info/biography/a1.html

While looking up the Randy Newman 78, I found another in stereo by Leon Redbone from 1978.

http://www.cool78s.com/Cool_200901.html

 

Yes, but are there any Duophonic 78s?

 

Hey, thanks for the clarification. I've seen 78rpm grooves thru a microscope
and still managed to get it "backwards". That'll teach me to post
in the middle of the night while fighting the flu! (laughing)

 

The metal parts for these exist in the EMI Library, and not only that, a limited edition re-press was done in the 80s on vinyl. I have these. They're 'up and down/side to side' rather than 45/45 but I thought I read that these were 'proof of concept' on dual channel discs rather than the final product design. I don't know if these recordings are on other media anywhere. One is 'walking and talking', a recording of people moving left to right, right to left while speaking.

Edit: I see there's now lots of hits on google for this stuff. Maybe someone can find a sound clip or even video clip (Blumlein was really working on binaural film soundtracks)

 

This is also a stereo 78 rpm

 

What about Moby Grape?

 

John Fahey had a 10" 78 release in the 1990s that I assume was stereo.

Audiophile Records of Sauk, WI did audiophile red vinyl 78s in the 1950s but I'm not sure if they did stereo.

 

This is true for cylinders, all are vertically cut or 'hill and dale.'
As noted, most '78' discs are lateral. I'm not aware of any companies producing vertically cut discs (or cylinders) beyond the 1920's.
Though, the home recording disc setups that became available much later on would use vertical cutting.

 

The films exist
Trains and cars left to right
People walking and talking in an EMI auditorium at Hayes
Sound only, Sir Thomas Beecham at Abbey Rd with the LSO,that is 45/45.
Roger

 

I have this nifty lil' item. Probably mono

 

I'd guess this 78 RPM from 1972 is in mono, but does anyone know for certain?

 

Robert Crumb's band (the Cheap Suit Serenaders) released several stereo 78 rpm records in the late 1970s.