Third Man Document Records Reissues

Pretty sure there were gonna be four or five volumes of each ...... if you look at the covers I think it shows the upcoming artworl for each ?

Just got my set of the second volumes in the mail today .......

 

Thanks, I don't own any of them yet, but if they are staying in print, then I might wait until they all come out.

 

The weird thing is the 1st series is still out of stock on Third mans site , they must be Backlogged at the Pressing plant .
I looked at the covers the sheiks will be 5 lp's & the other tow are 4 lp's


I listened to side #1 of the Charlie patton vol. # 2 and will say it's not as good as the 1st one , the 1st songs has a TON of noise reduction , Track #3 is really bad , Very noisy you can almost not hear the song at times , Guessing this is the only sourse for that song ? ............

 

Third Man Records recently announced the next wave of these reissues (Volume 3). I decided to only go for Volume 2 of the Shieks this time around (though will probably get both the Patton and Mctell at some point). I'm really loving the Shieks these days.

 

Here is a link to the Vol.3 News
http://thirdmanrecords.com/news/view/document-records-reissues

 

Looks like these are out Tuesday & third man sold some of the Colored Vinyl versions this past week at $40 each ...... Nothing like taking the Ebay out of the Price jacking ...........

 

Just finished spinning my copies of set #3 , these are really good , the sheiks stuff is great & the Blind willie this time sounds really great ......these are FUN well priced lp's .... looking forward to set #4 which will complete 2 of the sets I believe .

 

As I posted in another tread I dropped into Third Man Records last Thursday and picked up 1-3 of both the Sheiks and Charley Patton. Just fantastic. I read some other posts about better sound quality on some CD reissues. Really? CD? I am pretty sure you need to be able to look over and see the black circle spinning to get the full effect of these recordings. One of mine is skipping as I type - perfect!

 

Did this reissue series die off after the first artists? Haven't seen any updates for quite a while.

 

I am rotflmao. Best.post.ever!

 

I'm honoured by your appreciation

 

When is the Leadbelly release coming out? Or has it already?

 

I just found all of these yesterday in mint or near-mint condition for less than $10 apiece--so of course I had to snap them up! I've only listened to vol. 1 of the Charley Patton so far (and mine is a first pressing with the incorrect track sequence), and so far it sounds great. I was interested in these when they came out but decided to hold off getting them right away, and now I'm glad I did!

Instagram photo by @gemcityrecordcollector • Jun 29, 2016 at 4:17am UTC »

Simon

 

Yeah, what happened to these? I was gonna get them all!

 

Hi Gary, thank you for the info. So I assume the reissues were all digitally remastered and are sourced from digital files. Please correct me if I'm wrong. What were the Document masters in the vault? I am curious whether the original Document vinyl are analog sourced

 

I can't believe this guy was answering everyone's question until you asked about sources & then GONE. How shady and lame. Do you have any info on the sources Document used on the original LPs?

 

Believe it.

Their sources? Many were transfers done back in the 1970s and 1980s and inherited from the label's previous owner, Johnny Parth of Austria. His goal was to "document" every pre-war blues recording that could be found. He knew that sound quality would often not be optimal, but the label's mission to make these obscure and rare recordings available (even when they were transferred from 78s that were in poor condition) so that they weren't lost forever was and is admirable.

Fast forward to 2015/2016, and Jack White and Third Man Records and Revenant Records cut a deal with Document's current owners to reissue Paramount Recordings for their 2 "Boxes of Wonder". The sound quality for these boxes was sub-par, because Document generally was not the best source for these records. Labels like Yazoo and John Tefteller's Blues Images had superior sonics, but Third Man didn't strike a deal back then to use those sonically-superior sources. Document Records apparently was "good enough", at least in TM's eyes. Serious blues fans criticized Third Man for this glaring mistake.

Further, the owners of the Paramount recordings, the George Buck Foundation in New Orleans, raised legal issues about the rights to license the contents of those boxes, Third Man and Revenant Records having pointedly not done so.

However, last year, the licensing issue was resolved, and Third Man and Revenant cut a licensing deal with the Buck Foundation. That's good news #1.

More information: Back in June 2016, Document Records (on their Facebook page) formally answered a customer's question about whether more blues vinyl reissues were forthcoming in partnership with Jack White/Third Man. The relationship between Document and Jack White/TM has ended, well more than a year ago:

From Document's own Facebook page:

Customer: Jack White is your man.
Like Reply · June 21, 2016 at 12:30pm

Document Records No , I don't think so . We worked with Jack and he put some vinyl out from our recordings . He worked with other labels too but he [no] longer has Third Man involved in reissuing this type of music Like Reply ·June 22, 2016 at 3:19pm

Customer: Document Records you are saying jack is not going to continue to reissue Blues lps? Like Reply ·June 23, 2016 at 12:57am

Document Records yes I believe that is the case although I haven't talked to him or Third Man in awhile Like Reply ·June 23, 2016 at 10:17am

Now the most interesting part of the story: PBS aired a spectacular new documentary series earlier this summer titled "American Epic", profiling great pre-war blues and country artists and other roots/Americana musicians from the early days of recording in the 1920s. Here's the PBS link: American Epic

Part of the appeal of this series was that the producers worked with John Tefteller/Blues Images and his team that had developed a unique, proprietary and expensive-to-use new transfer process that produced the clearest sonics these nearly 100-year old recordings have ever had.

And Jack White/Third Man, who were so heavily criticized for issuing blues vinyl sourced from Document's sub-standard catalogue in 2015-16, has resumed reissuing new vinyl reissues....this time sonically superior, sourced from the process that John Tefteller and company offered. In the end, superior sonics absolutely did matter. Jack White/Third Man ended the highly questionable relationship with Document Records, and struck a new agreement for better quality sonic transfers from John Tefteller's company. In the end, they did the right thing for those who care about quality.

A number of titles are available:

https://www.amazon.com/American-Epic-Blind-Willie-Johnson/dp/B071VCCW71/

https://www.amazon.com/American-Epic-Best-Mississippi-John/dp/B07193BMPZ/

https://www.amazon.com/American-Epic-Best-Lead-Belly/dp/B071KZVM5J/

https://www.amazon.com/American-Epic-Blues-VARIOUS-ARTISTS/dp/B07258VJ39/

https://www.amazon.com/American-Epic-Best-Memphis-Band/dp/B072L7FHN8/

https://www.amazon.com/American-Epic-Best-Carter-Family/dp/B0711B9Q5F/

https://www.amazon.com/American-Epic-Country-VARIOUS-ARTISTS/dp/B0713WYDYN/

All's well that ends well.

 

I have both the Best of Country and the Best of the Blues lps from the American Epic series and can attest to their amazing sound. Here's hoping they start up another series of Blues reissues based on this process. I was really excited about their Complete Works series with Document until I bought a couple and found the overall quality a bit lacking.

 

Thank you sign that is all very interesting. I'm still curious about Document's vinyl LP sources. Are most of original vinyl pressings cut from tape transfers or was the music digitized before it was cut to vinyl?

 

I guess you'd have to ask Document, on their Facebook page or by email.

You'd also have to clarify what vinyl releases you are talking about. Remember, the Document label has been around for decades, pre-dating the digital era, and there's lot of Document albums in the used (and sometimes new) marketplace that are clearly sourced straight from tape transfers.

OTOH, if you are talking about more recent vinyl issues, or those Third Man/Document collaboration vinyl from 2 years ago, it's hard to know. Document has been financially troubled (by their own overt admission, as you could easily see on their webpage where they discuss their business woes), so it would not surprise me to learn that they used the least expensive method to produce the vinyl. I leave it to someone who knows more about those kinds of costs to tell if the vinyl sourced from digital vs. tape is more or less expensive a process.

But regardless of which process was used, Document historically has often had sonically-poor source recordings, before anyone had to make a decision about tape or digital transfer processes.

 

Hey I'm talking about the early stuff. What stuff is definitely a tape transfer that you know of? I would rather have a noisy tape transfer than a clean digital cut. That's just me. Most of the Document LP's I've been collecting seem to be from the mid to late 80s. I wonder when they started cutting the vinyl from a digital transfer. Are some of the stuff from like 90, 91 still tape transfer?

 

This is totally hype bull $!!!.
I bought three of t the Charlie Patton lps and they sound horrible.
Absolutely horrible. All midrange honk.
i sent all three back for a refund.
Hype bs.......
Beave

 

This is how I feel all about new vinyl reissues. & don't people always say, "na man not all new reissues are bad, some companies do it right AAA like Third Man Records blah blah blah"

 

I have never ever heard anyone say Thirdman is using analogue sources. Even they don't say that except for a White Stripes release some time ago.

Where are you reading that people are saying they do all analogue release? I know some people compliment on their pressings but I've never heard anyone say they do it right because they're all analogue as some sort of blanket statement. I'd definitely like to know who's saying that because it's definitely not correct re: AAA

 

If I remember correctly (it's been a while), all of the Document LPs were cut from analog dubs of the vinyl, but some had been "remastered" by Johnny Parth. Not sure of the size of the tapes used, which varied from project to project, as some of that stuff may have been from reels dating back to the 70s...in any case I doubt anything pressed on vinyl in the original Document series was cut digital.