Tug of War Remix

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by AppleCorp3, Jul 30, 2015.

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  1. AppleCorp3

    AppleCorp3 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Between the two I think I prefer PoP when it comes to the sound, not the content!

    Since you mentioned it though I listened to the McCartney II remaster and was surprised at how good it sounded. Did the original sound that clear?
     
  2. Paul H

    Paul H The fool on the hill

    Location:
    Nottingham, UK
    This is a rubbish answer, I know, but I bought those Lennon remix CDs (I know, not everything was remixed) at a time when I wasn't really on much of a Beatles/Lennon kick. I just picked them up cos I'm a completist. As a result, I've barely listened to them. By contrast, I bought the most recent remasterings when I was in the "right place" for some Lennon and really enjoyed them. Revisiting those remixes has been on my list of musical "things to do" for a while now (along with working my way through the Get Back sessions and picking out the best stuff, two giant boxes of Crowded House live CDs and a bunch of other stuff).

    I've have given some of the remixes a listen and I quite enjoy them. They're not trying to reinvent the wheel, just give the songs a better presentation. And that's what I'm hoping for with the new ToW mix.
     
  3. mindgames

    mindgames Forum Resident

    Location:
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    D’oh, of course there’s at least a 90 second high quality sample up in the iTunes Store:

    Pre-emphasis or not, the original CD is pretty treble-y. Then new remaster is incredibly similar to the original CD in terms of sound. Dynamics are of course a bit more flat on the new version, but the original CD is quiet and has a lot of peaks while there’s way too much head room during a lot of parts, so that’s only a good thing and won’t ever be noticeable when A/B-ing. This won't be a huge revelation, obviously a lot of improvement on the fidelity is baked into the original mix.
     
  4. kenbefound

    kenbefound Forum Resident

    I would have preferred a 5.1 but Paul didn't consult me on this one ;)
     
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  5. Yorick

    Yorick Senior Member

    Location:
    the Netherlands
    I love the sound of the remixed snippets in the videos. There's only two small details that bugged me a little bit:

    On the remixed and mastered for iTunes Tug Of War, because of the different sonics and louder lead vocal, the great string accents during the first verse are a lot harder to clearly hear.

    I like the way the lead vocals have been brought out a bit better, but some of the harmonies have become a bit too separated from the mix. As if they're on top of it, which makes them jump out more. The 'down down' on Take It Away is made a bit cheesier for me for example.
     
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  6. mindgames

    mindgames Forum Resident

    Location:
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    Yes, I agree. Also see the softer horns on 'Take It Away'.

    I must say the new vocal processing is something to get used to, on 'Here Today' (will post samples for that song as well at some point) the much more compressed vocal really is noticeable and I dislike the de-essing.
     
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  7. Rocco

    Rocco Find My Way

    Location:
    Chicago, Il USA
    Relistened to Tug of War, Itunes 2015 and even though love Pauls' lead, I don't like how the backing vocals are now a little buried. The original mix seemed to be very integrated lead and backing vocals which I love. I am certainly glad the original mix will be issued (albeit expensive to get). I also am going to check my current TOW vinyl and make sure I have clean copy, as I presume the new vinyl will be the remixed version?
     
  8. theMess

    theMess Forum Resident

    Location:
    Kent, UK
    I wonder if the advert has the remixed versions or the remastered original versions?
     
  9. Thrillington

    Thrillington McCartney Scholar

    Location:
    Cardiff, Wales, UK
    It's a pity that ordering from Paul's official site doesn't give us these two tracks as a pre-order bonus. The McCartney reissue came with an immediate download of Maybe I'm Amazed. Would love the complete versions to tide me over until October. From what I've heard so far, the new mix sounds great.
     
  10. jgkojak

    jgkojak Mull of Kansas

    Location:
    Lawrence, KS
    I think the TOW situation was too good to pass up- analog recorded on probably the best possible equipment by expert (Martin and his Air team) engineers - why wouldn't you remix it using 2015 digital hi-res techniques?

    The remix samples sound great to me.
     
  11. Sean Murdock

    Sean Murdock Forum Intruder

    Location:
    Bergenfield, NJ
    I agree completely. I think the remix will completely honor George Martin's original production, with better technology and a few tweaks benefitting from 33 years of hindsight. Really looking forward to it, and I wish they had done the same for Pipes of Peace.
     
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  12. jgkojak

    jgkojak Mull of Kansas

    Location:
    Lawrence, KS
    The only songs probably deserving of this treatment on POP are the title track and Say Say Say - and they did remix Say Say Say - I can imagine that remixing POP would be quite a chore given its complexity.

    If you think about it - if you were going to pick a PEAK for recording in analog - it would be that 1980-81 era- and GM had the BEST equipment in his studio - I'm thinking this is gonna blow us away.

    It also sets up a hi-res or PONO release in the future.

    I've always thought - call it War and Peace, and release a kick-ass single disc from the 80-83 Macca-Martin sessions-

    1. Tug of War
    2. Take It Away
    3. No More Lonely Nights
    4. Someone Who Cares
    5. Rainclouds
    6. Here Today
    -
    1. Ballroom Dancing
    2. Not Such a Bad Boy
    3. Get It
    4. The Pound Is Sinking
    5. Wanderlust
    6. Pipes of Peace
     
  13. mindgames

    mindgames Forum Resident

    Location:
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    Remixed, definitely. As I posted above, even the harmony vocals are mixed differently in the stereo spectrum.
     
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  14. mindgames

    mindgames Forum Resident

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    Here are the samples as promised. Same story as 'Take It Away': the original 1983 CD (CDP 7 46057 2) vs. the 1993 remaster vs. the 2015 remix. All volume matched. 1993 included to showcase how even an acoustic-based song can be butchered in mastering and how awful the now still "standard" version is and was for 22 full years. And again, exported to 192 kbps because the YouTube stream audio quality isn’t any higher. So take that in consideration. This isn’t a high fidelity or mastering comparison though, it’s about the remix.

    https://mega.nz/#!84IBwahK!CpylAShSXvQHzdN7gU6lU9brdR9SyFb-q5iQzsMx8k4

    Like said above, the new vocal processing: if anything, it puts his vocals more BACK in the mix. But take a listen for yourselves. There is no way I'm going to sit through any second of 'Ebony & Ivory', so you gotta compare those versions yourselves, haha...
     
  15. paulmccartneyistheman

    paulmccartneyistheman Forum Resident

    Com'on, take one for the team! :D

    I've always been happy that this is the last track on TOW, very easy to skip and forget all about
     
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  16. I think McCartney recognizes that Tug of War was critically well received and Pipes of Peace was not. That does influence his decisions about which ones would get more TLC.
     
  17. graystoke

    graystoke Forum Resident

    Of the three samples, I rank them as 83 best, just followed by the 93 (not much difference really) and trailing off a distant last (by the proverbial mile) the 2015 remix. The latter is awful. No presence in anything. It's like in order to make the recording sound less toppy and sibilant (which the other two are), they threw a Venus and Mars blanket over it! Hopefully, the 2015 CD will sound better than the YouTube uploaded sample. Somehow, I doubt it.
     
  18. crossroads69

    crossroads69 Senior Member

    Location:
    London Town
    I was listening to Double Fantasy - Stripped Down today and thought perhaps Paul could've also done a stripped down War & Peace remix as a side show to the upcoming reissues. A single CD "new" album to promote the reissues and offer an alternate look into those GM sessions for the fans.
     
    Sean Murdock likes this.
  19. Rob Hughes

    Rob Hughes Forum Resident

    Just wanted to say I'm enjoying the discussion here. Thanks for all the well considered commentary on the mixes! RH
     
  20. jgkojak

    jgkojak Mull of Kansas

    Location:
    Lawrence, KS
    Yes, you could highlight some things... some ideas...

    -Sweetest Little Show, in its demo form, is a nice little tune
    -Seems Like Old Times exists in many forms, complete production to demo
    -Rainclouds I am sure exists in demo form, would love to hear that
    -On the Wings of a Nightingale, man if Paul unearthed a studio-quality version of this demo!
    -Keep Under Cover has a nice demo version
    -Tug of War, Here Today, Wanderlust, the components of The Pound Is Sinking, all exist in lovely acoustic versions
     
  21. mindgames

    mindgames Forum Resident

    Location:
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    A mix is a mix, I'm afraid... Bitrate compression doesn't do anything in regards of what we both hear and don't like at all. But I'm indeed also not jumping to any conclusion until I heard the full deal in full resolution. Until then, this is a fun game.
     
  22. stever

    stever Senior Member

    Location:
    Omaha, Nebr.
    Is the Tug of War remix available on CD yet?
     
  23. Arnold Grove

    Arnold Grove Senior Member

    Location:
    NYC
    October 2, officially.
     
    stever likes this.
  24. pantofis

    pantofis Senior Member

    Location:
    Berlin, Germany
    I was listening a couple of times to the 1993 CD and thought the mix was mostly very classy and tasty. I especially admire the reverb used on "Somebody who cares" which exposes a close vocal, but the decay is ever so long and dark. Also George Martin did a fantastic job of using Linda's harmonies on "Take It Away".
    The only songs where the original mix kind of bugged me were "Ballroom Dancing" - the left-right bass drum, what were they thinking? - seems off-balance. And "Get It" - too much ambiance/reverb on that one.
     
  25. Bobby Morrow

    Bobby Morrow Senior Member

    It can't come a day too soon.
     
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