upgrade my Music Hall MMF 5.1! how?

Not by buying a new table but by modding this one.

The motor has started making noises which indicate either lubricant is needed -- or I need to replace it.

Has any experimented with putting a better motor in one of these -- say, the motor from a 7.1?

Or would my investment pay off better if I put the $ towards:

1) a speed box?

2) a glass platter?

I've got about 250 hours on the original Goldring cartridge, so while upgrading that is an idea, I'm looking at $100 upgrades and I couldn't get a better cartridge for that kind of money, of course....

 

Call Roy Hall and ask him what the problem might be with the motor. I've called him once or twice and he's always been helpful.

Which Goldring do you have on there? I benefited from upgrading to a Dyna 10x5 on my 7.1.

 

I agree with what bajaed has told you, check with Roy Hall about the motor noise issue. The most beneficial upgrades I did to my 5.1 I used to have were the following. 1. I replaced the felt platter mat with a Ringmat 330 MkII XLR. This really helped tighten up the bottom end and resonance issues when playing lp's.
2. Upgraded the interconnects between the table and phone pre-amp.
3. Ditched the Goldring and got a Dynavector 10x5. Much better soundstage and detail!
4. Placed Vibrapods underneath the 5.1's feet. This is a great and inexpensive way to help isolate the table.

Hope this helps!

 

I believe it's the 1012.

Unfortunately, Roy says I should replace the motor. I'll probably end up doing so, as the first upgrade. I hope I get more than a couple hundred hours out of the next one.

I've been eyeing an acrylic platter, if for no other reason that to remove the source of static electricity (felt). Ringmat may achieve a similar goal. Thanks for the idea.

I've actually got the turntable isolated in a different room, with a concrete floor, to help with isolation -- both from sound in the room and, now, to prevent me from hearing the motor. Still, more isolation like those pads may be interesting down the road.

Interconnects are blue jeans. Not the best of course, but should avoid most of the obvious issues one can have with cables.

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And you both vote for cartridge upgrades! Yep, that is what I think is first, next, when I solve the motor noise.

I should ask Roy what happens if I don't replace the motor..... since I cannot actually hear it through the signal or in the listening room... but that seems like a dumb way to live. Most reports are that it is heat based, due to friction building up, which would explain why it's silent when it starts.

 

I let mine go on like that for a little while before I replaced it. It just got to where it started making the noise sooner and sooner. I too called Roy Hall for advice and got the same answer.

 

Did you do the job yourself? Any "gotchas"?

Needle Doctor appears to be the main source of replacements. Is that where you picked yours up?

Roughly how many hours did you have on it before it went south? How many hours on the new one?

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I keep encountering people that have done this repair, as I research it, and am wondering whether it is a widespread issue....

 

I did the job myself. In another forum, I posted photos I took along the way while doing the job. I'm sure you could find it with a Google search. It was called "The MMF-5 is back in action". The job was pretty easy.

Roy Hall arranged for shipment of my replacement motor. I don't remember how I paid him. I bought the table as a demo, so I don't know whether they put many hours on it. I suspect I put fewer hours on that first motor than you did on yours.

 

Thanks for the pointer. Found the thread. Good photos. Looks like surgery rather than plug and play. But at least I know to plan ahead!

 

Why not try and repair it??? Motors aren't anything complicated and most of the music hall/project motors can be easily taken apart, and then you can inspect it and put some good lube oil on the bearings and shaft.
It'd be worth a couple of hours rather than paying what, $100 or more for a motor??

the beave

 

I agree. Maybe some sewing machine oil on the motor bearing? Nice new cart you like? I guess I would keep the platter you have now unless the glass one is proven superior.
Give RH a call he's a nice man to deal with.
Sorry late...
All of the above.

 

Yeah I think that's true. It seems strange to have failed with so little time so maybe it's something obvious and minor.

Yep, lube is the first order of business. For some of the other Music Hall tt's, synthetic motor oil (eg Mobil 1) is recommended. I have a bunch of fresh oil so it's a relatively cheap experiment, and if it doesn't help, nothing is lost and I can take it to the next level....

 

Mobil 1 - Great idea...

 

No problems with the motor, but the first thing I did with my Music hall 5 is get rid of the Goldring cart. It sounded harsh. I also put a drop or two of Mobil 1 synthetic motor oil into the sub-platter shaft.

I recently did a poor man's tweak and cut out little 1/6 in. thick cork and stuck them between the two plinths in each corner, and below the feet for vibration control.

 

Any TT motor should last well more than a couple hundred hours. Any warranty? Should last at least several thousand hours IMO.

 

I was wondering whether this was sarcastic or not at first but based on the other responses, I think I figured that out.

I'll mentally file this one. Yet another cart upgrade recommendation.

I think it's a one year warranty. Like some other people, I save vinyl for special occasions, meaning I didn't hit 100 hours in the first year.

But yes, I would consider a different brand next time based on this experience and reading up about the problem online. This is just a gut reaction and not based on science or fact.

 

You

gotta play more vinyl then!

 

About this, I agree.

Just found a sealed copy of the Jaws 2 soundtrack, which I am eagerly looking forward to. While the movie pales, of course, compared with the first, by all accounts, the score is every bit as interesting. I cannot brave the movie again, to confirm that, but a sealed LP was tempting enough for me to take the plunge.

 

Always cool to find a sealed lp. I was bragging a while back about finding a sealed 70's copy of Eagles On the Border. Thinnest vinyl I've ever seen, must have been during the oil shortage. I think I saw "SH" in the wax, must've been why it still sounded good!

Music Hall tables are nice. I feel they are well isolated against vibration. The 9C arm on mine is a good one and an upgraded cart really helps. Hopefully you can resolve the motor issue. Mine is still running strong after 4 years.

 

Which table do you have?

 

The 7.1

 

I have the 7.1 also and the only things I replaced was the mat (with a Herbies) and the interconnects (with Audioquest Colorado). I kept the stock Goldring cart...I like it. I've had mine for about 4 years and just love it.

 

I have an MMF7 (no .1). I replaced the motor a couple years ago after it became noisy. Of course my table was 11 years old at the time, and had seen a lot of use. Still kind of early to have to replace a motor, IMO, considering how many Thorens tables from the 60s and 70s still have perfect motors. The good news with the 7 is that replacement is easy due to the motor pod, and it wasn't particularly expensive.

The only other upgrades I've done is to replace the arm wiring with an Incognito kit and added the Cruise Control 2.o. Cruise Control is nice because all kinds of minor things can affect speed of a belt driven table. A recent belt change resulted in the table running faster. Cruise Control is currently set at 33.0 in order to achieve actual rotation (confirmed with strobe) of 33.3. I'm happy with the sound of the table, but can certainly appreciate the appeal of Quartz Locked DD.

 

I have also been having issues with the motor on my MMF5 after about 200hrs. Loud buzz after 60 minutes of play. I emailed Music Hall and they suggested a drop of oil, and then running it for 24 for 36 hours ! They said that the buzzing can be caused from the motor not being used enough (there are times I haven't played a single LP in a month). I took off the pulley, gave it a drop of oil, lifted the motor spindle up and down a few times to help the oil work it's way down, turned it on; 60 minutes in the loud buzz started, after 3 hours of buzz I expected a fire to start so I gave up and turned it off. 10 minutes later I tried it again and it was quiet, it's now been running for 15 hours silently. Perhaps this has saved me the cost of a new motor.

 

Interesting. I'm going to see if maybe the oil helps with a little more time.

Fire!?!?!?!?!

Was it that hot to the touch?

 

I can go for weeks without turning on my mmf5 and I have no problems whatsoever. When I do use it, I tend to leave it running for a couple of hours. The speed is on the money, too.