USB C Inputs a new standard?

No, they're pushing to do this across the entire line. And I don't think it's necessary, particularly for the power adapter.

I believe the answer is yes: there are separate jacks for USB3 and power, as well as an HDMI video output. The drag is that now, instead of having a cool, thin, lightweight computer, you have a cool, thin, lightweight computer and a brick.

I have it on good authority they want to go in this direction across the entire line. Let's agree to disagree on their design philosophy. I think it's a bad idea to limit users' options in connectivity. Don't forget that Apple was the first to eliminate 3-1/2" floppy drives, the first to eliminate DVD-ROM drives, and among the first to solder in RAM. They have a long history of being user-unfriendly in terms of upgrades and expandability, and I think a lot of it is unwarranted.

 

On it's own, the USB-C connector is a great advance on the previous iterations of the USB standard, packing greater performance into a smaller and more convenient form factor. Just making the plug reversible is a major step forward for those trying to connect peripherals to a conventional desktop (mini) tower case. However, the implementation of it on devices such as the new MacBook is quite frankly ridiculous where a single connector is useless if you're using the charger at the same time. I have an older 2011 MBA and at least it provides 2 USB ports and a mini display port adapter for additional functionality. A MacBook Pro could easily feature six USB-C ports given the size of the connector.

Call me a conspiracy theorist, but I think it is quite clear that Apple and Microsoft are deliberately dumbing down their systems and removing or hiding as much customisation and level of functionality in an increasing effort to lock you into their ecosystems. Apple was one of the first companies to sign up to the Blu-Ray Disc Association to support the blu-ray format yet they have never released a single product capable of playing or reading any format of blu-ray disc. They'd rather you rent or buy through their store. Both companies want to push you into their cloud based solutions, spouting all of the alleged benefits that come with it while at the same time weaning you off local storage at which point they can literally hold you hostage to your own data. As I see it their long term goal is to sell you the hardware, rent you the operating system (in MS's case), get a cut of EVERY piece of software and content that you channel through them and charge you an ongoing subscription for the right to access your own data. Microsoft is definitely moving a towards a subscription only system for their software, especially in the corporate sector, while desperately trying to emulate Apple's iTunes store model for the revenue that it generates. Add in both Facebook and Google to the equation and it looks rather scary. Given that in order to receive the full "benefit" of their systems, a significant amount of personal data will need to be sent or ceded to them, they have you by the short and curlies in order to push advertising at you as well. Even George Orwell would be impressed by the level of "oversight" that this represents.

 

I would give you ten likes if I could. Everything you say is 100% correct, at least in my experience. These companies are just trying to F with existing standards to limit user choices and force them to get further enmeshed in bull***t. Windows and Mac are becoming equally screwed-up, just in different ways.

 

The thing I find most amusing is that while the so-called "iSheep" and MS "fanbois" get all wrought up and uptight slinging doo-doo at each other about who is better, they all blindly sleepwalk into an increasingly locked down ecosystem in the name of "convenience". I have no "side" in this battle for the minds, or the wallets, as I have a foot in each camp but I am becomingly increasingly disillusioned with the major vendors in this space. They are looking out for the best interests - their own best interests. It would be nice to see the Linux world come together for the common good to bring a bit of competition into this space so that you're not taken for granted by the big boys but I'm sure to see a pig fly by my window before that ever happens.

As Devo prophetically sang in 1980, "Freedom of choice is what you got, freedom FROM choice is what you want." Use it or lose it.

Back on topic, USB-C could be a Godsend for the industry and more so consumers if all of the players get behind it. Life would be so much easier if you use a standard connector to charge your phone, charge your tablet, connect your scanner, printer, camera, keyboard, mouse, display, whatever to the computer. This is where homogeneity is a good thing.

 

So help me understand what happened to Thunderbolt as the "new" standard? What are the technical comparisons with this new USB and why abandoned this so soon after its introduction?

 

Thunderbolt is far from abandoned. Apple now has TB2 on every single one of its laptops and desktops, save for the "ultraportable" MacBook.

As implemented now, TB2 has 4X the transfer capacity of USB 3.1 Type C. This is especially important if you're in a profession environment and need high throughput for disc access, i.e. video editing. Also, I don't think USB 3.1 supports PCIe, critical if you want to use external graphics cards.

In short, USB 3.1 is fine for consumers, but there's still a large pro/prosumer market that needs the extra capabilities of TB2, maybe TB3 when it arrives. Personally, I used TB2 between my Mac mini and Mac Pro, and find the transfer speeds for video files between them extremely fast.

 

Thunderbolt is a completely different interface. It basically exposes the PCIe bus to external devices and is a much more powerful interface. It's not likely to go anywhere on higher end Macs and there is a TB3 in the works. Of course, contrary to what the conspiracy theorists would have you believe, TB is an Intel standard, not Apple, and is actually available on some high end PCs and motherboards. Apple is just much more aggressive with bringing new standards to market, even things like Displayport have been the norm at Apple for years and are just now gaining ground in the PC world. Most PC buyers have been focused on low cost over all else. There are really nice PCs out there but at the local best buy, a high spec PC is pretty hard to come by. Most laptops on display will feature things like HD4400 video chips that are two generations behind the Macs.

 

So if I am giving consideration to purchasing new/larger HDD for my music library it might be could to wait for a thunderbolt/new USB standard device and that might give me say five years of functional life?

 

I wish they would settle on one standard (like USB 3.0) and just stay with that. I think they do half this stuff just to keep money coming in rather than to make life easier.

 

Funny (but not ha-ha funny) that the Apple TV is cheaper than the tri-port adapter and more than covers one of those functions.

 

With USB3 the drives do not saturate the bus and won't for some time. Thunderbolt is better (much as SCSI and FW were) for many timing critical apps like video where latency and overhead can be problematic. For most folks USB3 is more than fine.

Different people have different needs. Each progression of USB has brought real, tangible benefits in speed and now 3.1 adds a tremendous amount of flexibility to the connector. Quite frankly, processor speed has been pretty stagnant and makers are not advancing the rest of the system that never kept up when processors were advancing in huge leaps. SSD is a great example. Now that 240gb ssd' are less than $100, I have put PCs that with their C2D processors were too sluggish and brought them back to life and those employees now think they have the fastest machines in the building! Before SSDs became affordable they would be in the landfill.

AppleTv is subsidized by programming.

 

No. No spinning HDD (what your music is stored on) can ever saturate even today's USB 3.0 interface.

 

Will never happen. Chipsets and needs can change drastically over even a 5 year period. Who would have thought 5 years ago that we'd need to be editing 4K video from our GoPro?

 

True! I have actually upgraded computers more over the last several years in order to get access to better IO than for faster processor speed.

I actually run my servers on Mac Minis at work, because the Mini has great IO with USB3 and thunderbolt than many PC based servers. My old Intel server was awesome until ineeded a fast backup solution.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Intel gave Apple a really good deal on Thunderbolt technology to kickstart it as the replacement for Firewire. It never caught on in the consumer market because USB is good enough for most people and too entrenched. Intel, as they often do, also priced it too high.

 

I'd say everything true of Firewire is true of Thunderbolt - most people were fine with other interfaces, the niche that isn't is willing (or needs to be) to pay more for the performance.

 

I'll believe that they're going to dumb down the MacBook pros when I see it. They've sold ultra-portable-yet-connectivity-limited laptops alongside more expensive and capable laptops for years now, been very successful doing so, and I seriously doubt they're going to stop doing such.

But even if they did, dealing with dongles on a laptop isn't the end of the world. I'm kind of glad there's tradeoffs when I think back to the laptop I was given by a job a decade ago this horrific beast of an HP that felt more like a "portable computer" then a "laptop". These things are still available in the PC space if people want them, I'm glad Apple has moved on. Sure don't miss optical drives in laptops.

 

The MacBook is a 2 year at best computer now. As they are now not upgradable. And that Core M architecture is a step backwards. USB-C has potential to be very useful once common and peripheral makers get on board.

 

Firewire was very necessary for many people in the day as that's the interface needed to connect and control video cameras and other peripherals. USB was far too slow and had serious issues with reliability and latency. Theoretical limits were similar, but real world, Firewire blew USB2 away.

It's not intended to be any kind of powerhouse, but it will be great for many people as an option between a full notebook and a tablet, kinda what MS is trying to do with the Surface which, while a nice step forward, is a nightmare as a laptop with the horrendous typeover. I really wanted to love mine!

 

Or maybe they're just trying to make their products thinner...

 

Actually, Intel and Apple working together...

The interface was originally intended to run exclusively on an optical physical layer using components and flexible optical fibercabling developed by Intel partners and at Intel's Silicon Photonics lab. It was initially marketed under the name Light Peak, and after 2011 as Silicon Photonics Link. However, it was discovered that conventional copper wiring could furnish the desired 10 Gbit/s per channel at lower cost. This copper-based version of the Light Peak concept was co-developed by Apple and Intel. Apple registered Thunderbolt as a trademark, but later transferred the mark to Intel, which held overriding intellectual-property rights.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunderbolt_(interface)

The problem is this is one of those typical Intel deals where you rarely (if ever) see the interface show up on a Windows PC. The great thing about Thunderbolt is that you can daisy-chain it, unlike USB; but USB3 will be plenty fast for most people, and it's cheaper than Thunderbolt, which is hard to argue with.

 

We need less making laptops thinner than practical. This new MacBook takes this concept to absurd. The MacBook Air was a semi sensible travel laptop. I respect that part as it's an UltraBook (The netbook's heir apparent). That form factor is the thinnest laptops need to go. I think the 2011-2012 MacBook Pros were the last great MacBooks before the excessive thin and upgrade unfriendliness syndromes kicked in. I think Snow Leopard is still the best OSX made in the purist sense.

 

No Ethernet port?

 

I sure do love my 2014 MacBook pro and its scant 16GB of non-upgradable RAM, despite how dramatically unpractical it is. Ya'll have fun with your PC laptops and Windows - I'm sure you'll enjoy them just as much.

 

I enjoy having $2500 more than I'd enjoy having a speced out MBP.
For $2500 I'd rather have a Schiit Ragnarok headphone amp and a $700 Windows laptop.