Vinyl sibilance distortion...

Is it possible to ever be free of sibilance distortion?
1. Is it the pressing?
2. Is it the VTA?
3. Is it my cart (Sumiko Blackbird)
4. Is sibilance distortion a result of mistracking, and if so, does it damage the grooves every time?

Here are my observations: I hear it somewhere in every LP I own. My alignment is dead on using the Mint LP Best Tractor as well as all the other parameters. The one I have little experience with is VTA adjustment. My setting has the the back of the arm about 1mm lower than level. Will VTA adjustment really cure distortion if everything else is set up right?
On another note, am I correct in noticing that the pressing itself can be the source of the distortion? I did a needle drop of a brand new Them Crooked Vultures LP and there's sibilance distortion all over it. However, it includes an MP3 download code of the album, and it's a vinyl source. The MP3 has the sibilance problems in the same spots! The CD release does not exhibit the "splatty" distortions.
I have a Sumiko Blackbird, which I like the tonality of, but have read that is not a great tracker. Is this the problem? I don't get any "inner groove" distortion though. Any recommendations to a similar class of cart, but without problems?
So, will distortion always be there, regardless of gear and set up - even on a new pressing?
Anyway, I'm still fairly new to this stuff so anyones perspective is really appreciated.

 

It should not be there. There is something wrong with your setup. How old is the stylus on the Sumiko? Check your VTA as well.

Also, fill out your equipment profile so we can help determine what's going on in your setup.

 

It's on EVERY lp? Could be as simple as a dirty stylus.

 

Sibilance is often the result of mistracking. IME, it's rarely, if ever, cut into the record by the mastering engineer. It does indeed damage the groove, sometimes immediately, sometimes after multiple plays. IMO, with the right cartridge, you should definitely not be hearing sibilance on some/most/all pressings if the records are in good shape and your turntable and cartridge are properly set up. Tweaking the VTA can certainly help to some extent. And make sure the stylus is clean.

FWIW, I rarely hear any with my KAB'd Technics and Audio-Technica AT160ML. And I never had any sibilance whatsoever - even on certain bright, trebly, loud recordings that people complain about - with my two big Shures: the older V15V-MR and the more recent V15VxMR.

 

What TT do you have? What tracking force did you use?

 

If you play a lot of older used records, you may find that the previous owner(s) mistracking tonearm and needle has damaged the grooves of an originally fine record, and you'll hear it no matter how well your equipment is set up.

Something's wrong with your equipment. Explore forum recommendations on cartridges that have excellent tracking ability.
Or up your tracking weight or something, better to go a little too heavy than too light.

 

I filled out my profile. My gear is new. I've put about 40-50 hours on my cart. I clean all my records with a RCM and MoFi products, I use an anti-static brush before and after ever LP play, I clean the stylus after every side (MoFi stylus cleaner), and I track at 2 grams. Most of the LPs sound good, but at some point on the album, I hear the splatty sound. This does this with new records, too. Here is my VTA:

 

Pro-Ject RM 9.1 and I track at 2 grams - the recommended force.

 

Tried 1.8, 2.0 and 2.2 grams and it didn't make a difference.

 

Since you bought your turntable new... have your dealer set up the cartridge for you.

 

Whats interesting though is that regarding the recent reissue vinyl LP of Neil Young's 'After The Gold Rush' the sibilence on this is very apparent and annoying. Yet I have the original UK pressing and this doesn't have any evidence of this at all. I don't get the problem on anything else that I have noticed especially, so it's nowt to do with my set-up. So in this example it must be the pressing, or a more revealing master perhaps?

 

It's possible your cart/stylus could be defective or damaged.

Project RM 9.1/Sumiko Blackbird is pretty nice gear, I'd expect high performance.

 

That's normally what they do, but I live in a different state, and they can't ship a Blackbird mounted because it has no cover and can get damaged in transit. I'm very confident in proper set up as far as zenith/azimuth/VTF, leveling, although my experience in determining VTA is limited.

 

Yeah, I bought the reissue Harvest and Everyone Knows This Is Nowhere and I heard it there too, especially the latter.

 

Yes it was helpful having the earlier pressings because I can confirm without a doubt that your set-up should not be causing the problem with 'After The Gold Rush' at least. But I didn't notice any overly annoying sibilence on the other Neil Young reissue pressings - so maybe you do have a set-up issue that needs solving? I'm sure someone here can help out. Good luck.

 

Try lowering the arm another two mm, to tilt the needle back a smidge.

 

I tried the Baerwald for Technics protractor on my 1200 which I found on vinylengine.com, and no matter how careful I was with setup, my best results in regard to absence of sibilance were when I used the Technics overhang gauge, so that is what I now use

 

How the hell did you get a closeup like that?

That's awsome!!

 

Agree, he could make a cool avatar out of that.

 

From the bottom end of the vinyl spectrum:

I have a Stanton STR8-30 turntable. Don't bother looking it up - it's a cheapo turntable that cost me somewhere around $150 (probably less) with a stock Stanton cart. Any record that was pressed "hot" gave me sibilance. There isn't any VTA adjustment or anti-skating on this TT. I was looking to upgrade, but have no audition availability and - right here on this forum - entry level audiophile discussion on tables was just a cluster f0ck of opinions.

I bought an Audio Technica 440mla cartridge (approximately $130 - the price of the TT), and all my sibilance went away. I am not here to recommend that cart, I am just saying that the cartridge is something you should look into. The advice for many other cartridges on these very boards (very many of them reasonably priced), will give you the improvement you seek. I will still upgrade my table, but for now - I am listening and I am happy.

 

Still, I have to think there's something wrong with the setup. A RM-9.1 with a Blackbird should not be giving you these problems. Is there a good hi-fi shop within reasonable driving distance where you could take the table and have them look at it? Given your very high quality gear, you should not be hearing sibilance on every single LP you play. I have but a lowly Debut III with an AT440MLa and I get minimal, if any, sibilance. With the caliber of gear you have, it should be a non-issue.

 

Two words: Pinch effect.

Since the cutting stylus is a triangle, not a cone, it is capable of cutting a very narrow groove with respect to horizontal modulations. As you can see in the picture, the groove will be wide at the peak of cutting stylus travel, but will narrow in between them. When the playback stylus encounters such a "pinched" groove, it has no choice but to travel vertically as it is "squeezed" up out of the groove, causing distortion. This problem is alleviated by using a bi-radial stylus, where the minor radius is small enough to stay in the groove when it pinches instead of rising up.

An adjustment to VTA might take care of it if it's a problem with a top-end cartridge.

 

Is it really possible to not get inner groove distortion on any record? I have a lowly setup, yes, but now (finally) I hear no inner distortion on a brand-new Origin Antithesis (Relapse extreme metal) but a brand-new Napalm Death Order of the Leech is loaded with it in the inner grooves.

 

It's tough! Hold out your hand with your fingers spread as wide apart as they can go. Now let the fingers close. That's the difference between inner and outer grooves, so an album with a really hot top end is going to have more inner groove distortion. The only way to get rid of it is to cut at lower levels, or at 45 RPM, which is the reason for those 45 RPM albums!

 

I found this thread of interest:
http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/archive/index.php/t-73316.html