What is your favorite CD mastering of Genesis "Wind and Wuthering"

In case anyone is interested, I put the Sanyo Japan up for sale in our classifieds:

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=252922

 

Are these really four distinct masterings? And if so, has anyone compared all four?

And what mastering do I have here? Virgin / Charisma CDSCD 4005, mastered by Nimbus, EAC peak levels as follows:
100.0
94.0
94.6
76.1
83.0
70.0
41.2
92.1
100.0

 

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showpost.php?p=3496394&postcount=10

You have the very 1st one listed, which isn't bad at all.

I have compared the UK V/C, Sanyo, and BT. They are distinctly different. Haven't heard the WG variant though. The BT isn't very good for this one, which surprised me.

 

Thank you, so I suppose it is the same that you call "UK V/C"?

I think the sound quality is less than ideal, relatively bright, and I am not 100% sure how this relates to the presence of pre-emphasis. Without a reference point (another mastering) it is hard to say if it sounds pre-emphasized or not.

 

I don't think there's PE on that disc. (?) But ... that's why a lot of people prefer the Sanyo or the DE: more low end. But like I mentioned, I think the DE has too much of a good thing.

 

Dr. M. and I are in the small camp that prefer the V/C Nimbus over the Sanyo:

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showpost.php?p=3996371&postcount=298

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showpost.php?p=3997402&postcount=310

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showpost.php?p=4014615&postcount=324

Sadly, I can't recall whether Dr. M. or Kevin have posted up EQ comparisons on these two CDs to show how different the LF and HF responses are.

 

Agree it is NOT murky and I have heard my original ATCO vinyl on many systems. Listening to it now. On The Vine is probably not representative as it seems somewhat better balanced. Most of the LP is a bit shy on the bottom end. It is like the frequency response is an upward tilt but rolled off at the very top. I might think it was cut at an odd SRA but you folks say the CD's are similar so the mix was likely EQ'd that way. It glares. Short decays and not much body to the piano, etc. Sounds like a low res digital recording. Not sure what someone or some group was thinking. It is unfortunate because the music is good.

After listening to the recent Rumours, I have no doubt that SH could do wonders with it. It sounds like it was cleanly recorded. Let's hope someone gives him a shot it for vinyl.

Y'all be cool,
Robert

 

Thanks for that. I remember that I gave up reading that thread because people would never mention the album name in their posts.

 

Here's the EQ thing and more of Dr M's W&W info too, further down the page:

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=149728&highlight=genesis+masterings&page=13

I think the Sanyo ends up sounding as the most balanced CD for me, because the dip near 10 kHz mellows out its "top end" (cymbals and snare drum) somewhat vs the Nimbus. (If you reverse that, could the Nimbus UK have the somewhat common "10 kHz boost" vs the Sanyo? I don't know.) They are both good sounding CDs, and in the past I've preferred the Nimbus over the Sanyo. But I've gradually come to like the Sanyo more lately.

 

Just got my hands on the Sanyo disc. So far I'm only on the first track and the first thing
that strikes me right away is the dynamics. Holly freaking cow! The crescendo sections
of 11th Earl of Mar are fantastic! Its a bit quiet overall but that's the tradeoff with digital anyway.

Amazing to note that all these years hearing the DE I agree that the noise reduction killed
that version which is a shame as it does have a bit more bottom end otherwise it would have
been my favorite.

BTW was it ever determined who did the mastering on the Sanyo?

 

I'm confused as to which version is which in this discussion. I own:

US Atco, but manufactured by Sanyo Japan (my 1st exposure, sound really got in the way of the material, very thin & lots of premature fade in/outs)

UK Virgin maufactured by Nimbus (my current fave, although it was an adjustment - had to turn off Blood on the Rooftops halfway through because my ears were too conditioned to the version above)

DE (rotten, it was at this point that I realized, too late in the case of Virgin/UK Foxtrot though I've since got it back, to hang on to my earlier versions. But I was dumb and easily seduced by the notion of a NUrsery Crime sans hiss)

2007 (even worse, although I enjoy this version of Your Own Special Way)

Obviously I'm not big on tech specs, but what is the considered opinion on the 1st two I've mentioned? Of all Genesis this album is the most troublesome in terms of sonics.

 

The very first one you have there is what I personally like the best. There is a Japan made US Atco, and a made in US Sanyo that are the same.

The second one you have is also very nice sounding and has its fans too.

 

Last past week I changed speakers for my Yamaha amp. Now a lot of discs sounds different to my ears (i think sounds better). Now I have finished listening my Virgin/Charisma CDSCD 4005 copy (EMI Swindon pressing). I think I like it same like my favorite Japan ATCO issue. V/C sounds very close to US ATCO release. I can feel a bit more top on my V/C compare to Japan ATCO. The middle range is also on good level. Low bass is fast and deep. I'm wondering now who did this great mastering? It is a very good mastering as well. It just great! So now I have not an easy problem to pick the best version for me.

 

Definitive Edition. I saw this thread and listened to it last night.

 

V/C Nimbus arrived this morning, and now ending its 1st spin.

It's a bit on the bright side, but overall no sound issues for me, although it's not in the same league as the awesome V/C Trick of the Tail blueface.

I do like this CD a lot better then my canadian Atco vinyl.

 

Have not heard anything including the sacd close to as good as playing this on vinyl as a kid.

 

Ain't that the truth, for U.K. at least, none of my CDs come close

 

Hello all.
Newbie here - just a quick question - I have just got hold of a Nimbus V/C and like I expected it is lacking in the bass department.
Just out of interest how can I distinguise a Japan for UK V/C disc?
By the way I used to have all the D/E's, upgraded to the 2007 discs, found them harsh and grating on my ears, looked on here and sought out the original V/Cs on the Gabriel era albums and they are far and away superior - more 'bite' on the guitars and more breathing space for the music if you catch my drift.
Just awaiting to pay for a V/C nimbus seconds out tonight that I won on Ebay...

 

robbond55, welcome.

For all things regarding early Genesis CDs, I would spend some time here

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=149728&highlight=genesis+early

 

Thank you marcel.
I have had a good root around - need to find a link to tell me where there is some information on what all these rips and percentage numbers mean e.g track 1 100%, track 2 94% etc.
Anyway, thank you for your assistance - have sold off a lot of CDs recently and got V/C discs which i am enjoying and concentrating on the albums I love the most and getting better masterings of them.
Regards,
Rob

 

I didn't vote.. I've heard the '94 DE and The 2007 remix. I'm new to the forum and I'd like some help in this area, actually. I always enjoyed the deeper low end on the DE's, but upon further inspection, this album suffers in particular from some really abrasive highs and mids- particularly in the louder portions of "Afterglow", and the instrumental portions of "One For The Vine". I attempted to use Sonar Cakewalk to adjust the EQ some on some of that album and it helped, but its irritating that there isn't a solid remastered offering of this great disc. I stumbled upon this site because I Googled "best version Genesis Wind & Wuthering".

A couple of questions: I don't have some of the pre-remastering versions of the album to A/B with the remastered versions. I noticed that a main gripe with the remasters is the use of noise reduction. How in particular did this affect the recording/final product? I got into Genesis around 1995, so I've only ever known the DE's. How noticeable is the use of noise reduction, and if you can describe it, what did it change? My main complaint with W&W DE is that at times the highs are totally abrasive and piercing, which makes the recording extremely noisy and ear-fatiguing. Was this not the case in the earlier Japanese Atco or V/C that everyone seems to love? I always thought "Blood On The Rooftops" had a muddy chorus, but perhaps it's a by-product of the remastering as well. Comparatively speaking, I really enjoy the DE of "Trick Of The Tail", but again- I haven't compared it to vinyl or pre remasters.

Most of the 2007 remasters sounded pretty abrasive to me. My one exception would be "Lamb Lies Down On Broadway", which to me sounds much clearer than the DE, and I love the deeper bass on it. I don't think I've ever heard the vinyl or pre-DE version of that album though.

Just for the hell of it: Since I was working with Cakewalk, I edited Afterglow to include the cool drum fills at the end of the live Seconds Out version- basically just cross faded the live and studio at the very end- and then worked with the levels and eq a bit to marry the tracks as best i could. Came out surprisingly good!

Finally, anyone have a suggestion where I could d/l a good .flac of the better pressings of the pre-remastered V/C or Japanese ATCO, so I can hear it? There shouldn't be any issues here because it's out of print, and I've paid for the album twice already...

Thanks!

 

Welcome to the forum Ebbet! Any relation to the Doctor?

 

No, no relation

I'd love to hear back on some of my questions.

 

Need some help identifying this CD:

Wind & Wuthering:

CD 38-100, manufactured by WEA Canada, with matrix "MFG BY CINRAM."

Discogs doesn't list any versions with this catalog number. The discogs notes mention it being originally released as Atco #38 100. The track listing on the album splits "Unquiet Slumbers" and "... In That Quiet Earth" into "a" and "b." Matrix #900201H.

 

Same as USA Atco cd from 1980's afaik.