Which is the best Dual and why?

Ok, so I'm getting intrigued by all of you guys and the Dual talk.

If you had to buy just one Dual turntable today, with sound quality and mechanical reliability the main concern, which one would you buy and restore to perfection?

 

When I think Dual, the redoubtable 1219 and 1229 are what I think of. Superb versatile automatics and the ultimate classic Duals. I love the 1218 and 1225 very well. (I've owned 6 1218 decks and am very familiar with servicing that classic).

 

The early idler drives, like the 1009, 1219, and 1229 seem to be held in the highest esteem. Then the direct drive models like the 701 or the 721 are the next beloved bunch. I'm sure the Baron will chime in with input. I really like the 1257, which is a changer, and one of the lower end models, but still with that Dual sound. I sold it to get one of the direct drive models, but got sidetracked by that Linn Axis.

 

I owned the 1219, back in the early 70s, don't know how difficult it is to find one.
If I were going to look for one, that's the one.

 

+1

 

I have owned the 1229 and 701. Both were very nice sounding decks, but IMO Dual made decks that were overly complicated to service and repair. I now prefer Thorens tables. Very simple designs.

 

Is there a good vintage Dual website, similar to the ARC database?

 

http://dual-reference.com/

 

The guy who works on mine says that he thinks the CS 5000 was the best deck they ever made (he even preferred it to the 7000).

However, DUALs are usually prized for their ruggedness and features. The 5000 is finicky as hell, and nearly impossible to get parts for (I had to go to Canada for parts last time something went wrong).

But sonically, I'll take it over the more traditional idlers I have or have had, the 1009 and the 1218.

 

Well, i've had the 1229 and 1218, and they were just fine, but now I'm using a 510 in Daily use, and its really sounding great with the Denon DL-160 in the arm. So i have to vote 510.

 

I bought a 1219 new in the day and loved it. I did buy a used one a few years ago, but time had marched on...I didn't keep it.

 

That 510 is nice looking.

 

Once owned a 731Q (or 741?) but I don't know how it compared to the other ones, but my Dealer said, that one was the best.

 

This question has been answered correctly already, still I like to add my 2 cents - The question which is the best DUAL is obvious : http://dual-reference.com/tables/CS7000.htm
A friend of mine got that and I must admit, that it performed a bit better than my trusty workhorse, as long as it was working - the belt had to be replaced and that took him forever - last time i saw him it was still out of order....

Nothing like that with the best regular model DUAL ever came up with : the 701 DD with the SHURE V-15-Type III - This still is the best cart for it, but I have top synergie with a Sumiko Blue Point Special EVO III. HO MC cart, too. As nice as my Primare CD Player sounds , the Dual easily surpasses it - esp in the bass department : that door with the milky glass inside starts vibrating immediately when I play records at the same volume setting as CD/ TV /DVD Radio whatever..
I am not sure how much better a cart the 701 will support, but a Blackbird would surely sing sweeter than the EVO III I bet.
Anyway - recently there is some talk about those vintage idler wheel drives the 1009 /1209 / 1229 etc. series.
Those came before the Direct Drives in 1973 and for a vintage system these may as well be those who make the most sense to restore to perfection - the last part of your question.
http://dual-reference.com/tables/1219.htm

One final word why I love the 701 so much - This TT has been used nearly non stop since April 1975 and never let me down. When asked what the best part is - besides the automatic and the hood - I would say the ULM Tonearm with it's 2 time anti-resonator.

http://dual-reference.com/tables/701.htm

 

I tried a 1229 for several months, and tracking problems were so incurable that I moved on. I am much, much happier with contemporary designs.

 

That was my issue as well

 

Interesting as I thought I was the only dissenting voice. (^_^)y

 

Interesting..

Thanks for the advice so far.

Do you guys know of anyone that specializes in repair and restoration of Dual tables, especially the idler wheel ones?

 

This guy seems to know his way around them:

http://www.doctordual.ca/

 

Thanks for the word up...

That seems like the way to go rather than buy something from ebay, etc. $400 is not a bad price for something that's been totally reconditioned and brought up to spec.

 

Jerry and I both own the 721, which is a great TT with excellent tracking ability on very warped records. I have owned the TT since 1978.

 

Before you do anything, you might want to give Bill a call at http://www.fixmydual.com/
I purchased a beautiful 1219 from him awhile back at a very reasonable price. And it is still functioning perfectly. He also repairs/restores all Duals. He's one of the resident Dual experts over at AudioKarma. I spoke with him at length over the phone before making my decision, and he was very helpful and patient. Good luck.
BTW, I'm currently running a 1219, 1209, and 1228.....all idler drives. I picked up a couple of the late 70s belt drive models a few years ago, and they both are now inoperable for various reasons. I'm sticking with the idlers.

 

I owned a CS 5000 and it was a great performer. I let it go when the viscous cueing stopped working and I could not get it to work properly. If I was smart I would have kept it and put a RB 300 on it.

 

But is there such thing as a bad DUAL TT? The design has been tried and true for decades with continuous improvements. AFAIK, the last of them were still made in Germany ...

 

I wished I had acted when the CS 5000 was still available in the early to mid 90's ...